Tournament Thread March Madness thread

[CycleandJazz]

And if the NBA has nothing to do with it, then why are they coordinating with the NCAA on their draft rules?

NBA has everything to do with the Mininum Age 19 rule, as it is their rule. What is not the NBA's responsibility is how that impacts NCAA basketball. To the extent that the NBA is willing to work with the NCAA to offer support in how the NCAA solves it problems, that is, of course, completely voluntary on the part of the NBA.

 

[CycleandJazz]

The whole purpose of the one and done rule was for NBA FO's to get a chance to evaluate these players against a higher level of competition because they were burning too much cash on players that ended up being complete busts. Everybody knows the NBA uses the NCAA as a minor league system. That whole problem has been solved with the rookie cap and all these monster AAU teams.

The age requirement is meant (as it is in all professions that have one) to set a minimum baseline for when a player is ready (skill-wise, physically, mentally, emotionally) to be a professional player. The NBA wanted 2 years but got significant push back from the union. In fact, Stern said it was his biggest regret as Commissioner that he didn't hold firm on 2 years. Players' agents have significant influence over the NBAPA and it is the agents that have the most vested interest in pushing back against an age requirement, as they benefit from more constant turnover.

No one has answer this question, which I asked earlier: If it is so clear cut that the NBA would benefit from having players enter the league straight out of HS, why have they pushed back on the idea?

 

[gohusk]

NBA has everything to do with the Mininum Age 19 rule, as it is their rule. What is not the NBA's responsibility is how that impacts NCAA basketball. To the extent that the NBA is willing to work with the NCAA to offer support in how the NCAA solves it problems, that is, of course, completely voluntary on the part of the NBA.

The NBA threw their hat in the ring a long time ago on this and yes, they know that the health of NCAA basketball is in the best interests of the NBA. And the rule is tailored to get the kids into a college program for 1 year.

 

[CycleandJazz]

The NBA threw their hat in the ring a long time ago on this and yes, they know that the health of NCAA basketball is in the best interests of the NBA. And the rule is tailored to get the kids into a college program for 1 year.

Why would they do that if it benefits the NBA to allow players into the league straight out of HS?

 

[ericd7633]

Do we know that to be true about Loyola?

Lmao. There is nothing to suggest they ever played like a top 5 team this season. Let's look at their non conference. Those blowout losses to Boise State and Milwaukee certainly wouldn't suggest it, and then went 15-3 in a one bid league. There's also nothing to suggest it when looking at advanced metrics either.

 

[Used 2 B Hu]

Alls I know is, I'm getting tired of that NCAA ad with all the tough-talking young people claiming to be student-athletes

 

[CycleandJazz]

Lmao. There is nothing to suggest they ever played like a top 5 team this season. Let's look at their non conference. Those blowout losses to Boise State and Milwaukee certainly wouldn't suggest it, and then went 15-3 in a one bid league. There's also nothing to suggest it when looking at advanced metrics either.

So I take it that you hadn't seen them play before the Tournament.

 

[gohusk]

The age requirement is meant (as it is in all professions that have one) to set a minimum baseline for when a player is ready (skill-wise, physically, mentally, emotionally) to be a professional player. The NBA wanted 2 years but got significant push back from the union. In fact, Stern said it was his biggest regret as Commissioner that he didn't hold firm on 2 years. Players' agents have significant influence over the NBAPA and it is the agents that have the most vested interest in pushing back against an age requirement, as they benefit from more constant turnover.

No one has answer this question, which I asked earlier: If it is so clear cut that the NBA would benefit from having players enter the league straight out of HS, why have they pushed back on the idea?

There's been plenty of instances where the NBA has reached out to the NCAA when coming up with their age requirements. So yes, they know it's in their interest for NCAA basketball to be healthy.

Why?

1. It gives them a chance to evaluate talent in a highly competitive league
2. They get all sorts of marketing for players before they even hit the league. These guys are entering the league as stars already.
3. A good chunk of the fans in college are going to end up fans of the NBA when they graduate.

And the rules were obviously tailored to get these guys playing college ball for a year. If you ask me on the NCAA end they should just throw all these rules out the window. Want a kid to enter the draft out of HS and he doesn't like the result? Who cares, he's eligible. Guy plays in the NBA for 2 years, career is going nowhere, wants to go to college, who cares, he's eligible (obviously put an age cap at 24 or something). Player wants to sign his own shoe contract in college? Who cares, he's eligible.

If the NCAA pulled something like that the NBA would FREAK OUT. So don't tell me what the NCAA does is of no impact to the NBA or why it's in the best interest of the NBA to be a good partner with the NCAA.

 

[CycleandJazz]

Alls I know is, I'm getting tired of that NCAA ad with all the tough-talking young people claiming to be student-athletes

Are you suggesting that the NCAA randomly chose college athletes for those ads without vetting them to ensure that they are actually serious students? Or are you suggesting that virtually no college athlete is a serious student as well?

 

[gohusk]

Why would they do that if it benefits the NBA to allow players into the league straight out of HS?

Because things have changed. They got monster AAU teams now to evaluate the top players going at each other and they also have the rookie cap to protect themselves.

 

[ericd7633]

So I take it that you hadn't seen them play before the Tournament.

I watched them before the tournament. I think they are a good team, they were one of my picks in the pool I'm in, some of that was because of them and some the draw. But they never played like a top 5 at any point during the regular season.

I mean seriously, lay something out for why you think they did. I'm all ears.

 

[CycleandJazz]

There's been plenty of instances where the NBA has reached out to the NCAA when coming up with their age requirements. So yes, they know it's in their interest for NCAA basketball to be healthy.

Why?

1. It gives them a chance to evaluate talent in a highly competitive league
2. They get all sorts of marketing for players before they even hit the league. These guys are entering the league as stars already.
3. A good chunk of the fans in college are going to end up fans of the NBA when they graduate.

And the rules were obviously tailored to get these guys playing college ball for a year. If you ask me on the NCAA end they should just throw all these rules out the window. Want a kid to enter the draft out of HS and he doesn't like the result? Who cares, he's eligible. Guy plays in the NBA for 2 years, career is going nowhere, wants to go to college, who cares, he's eligible (obviously put an age cap at 24 or something). Player wants to sign his own shoe contract in college? Who cares, he's eligible.

If the NCAA pulled something like that the NBA would FREAK OUT. So don't tell me what the NCAA does is of no impact to the NBA or why it's in the best interest of the NBA to be a good partner with the NCAA.

All the reasons you give are reasons why the NBA would want an age requirement. I asked how it benefits the NBA to not have an age requirement, which is what some are suggesting.

 

[Hitman Hart]

ahh, the hot takes that come from the results of a single elimination tournament will always be music to my ears.

 

[CycleandJazz]

I watched them before the tournament. I think they are a good team, they were one of my picks in the pool I'm in, some of that was because of them and some the draw. But they never played like a top 5 at any point during the regular season.

I mean seriously, lay something out for why you think they did. I'm all ears.

I asked because you had not indicated that you had seen them play. If you had, I wouldn't have questioned it at all. I have no vested interest in Loyola, except as example of how a top-flight mid-major probably deserves a higher seed than 11 most years, even if they didn't play and lose to Wofford at home or didn't lose to UMBC in the 1st round.

 

[gohusk]

All the reasons you give are reasons why the NBA would want an age requirement. I asked how it benefits the NBA to not have an age requirement, which is what some are suggesting.

None of these are why the NBA would want an age requirement. It's all an explanation as to how the NCAA could really stick it to the NBA if they had the balls to do so. Just allow players to be eligible to return even if they do enter the draft and see how happy the NBA would be. Good luck for the bottom feeders being able to sign someone.

So yes, it is in the best interest in the NBA to be on good terms with the NCAA, for a number of reasons. The relationship clearly is breaking down with this massive scandal and they need to be good partners to help fix it.

 

[ericd7633]

I asked because you had not indicated that you had seen them play. If you had, I wouldn't have questioned it at all. I have no vested interest in Loyola, except as example of how a top-flight mid-major probably deserves a higher seed than 11 most years, even if they didn't play and lose to Wofford at home or didn't lose to UMBC in the 1st round.

I said at no point have they played like a top 5 team this season. Because I did watch some of their games. They didn't look very good in the mvc tournament until the final game. I would have been fine if they were on the 8/9 line and wouldn't have taken issue with that.

 

[CycleandJazz]

Because things have changed. They got monster AAU teams now to evaluate the top players going at each other and they also have the rookie cap to protect themselves.

Again, none of those developments explain why the NBA wants to raise the age limit: Adam Silver: The Standout First-Year Commissioner

 

[gohusk]

Again, none of those developments explain why the NBA wants to raise the age limit: Adam Silver: The Standout First-Year Commissioner

I don't even know what your point is anymore.

 

[Used 2 B Hu]

Are you suggesting that the NCAA randomly chose college athletes for those ads without vetting them to ensure that they are actually serious students? Or are you suggesting that virtually no college athlete is a serious student as well?

I'm suggesting the spot is ghey

 

[Codaxx]

Strongly disagree.

Kids need to be able to capitalize on their stock at the point of their best interest.

NBA just needs a real minor league system.

That's ok, we don't need to agree. I just think this takes care of the LeBrons and Kobes of the world. Some kids just don't need college. The others could do well with at least 2 years of coaching and college. Right now both CBB and the NBA are suffering.