Let the chips fall where the may.

[NWPATSFAN]

What was Kliff Kingsbury's record as an NFL QB before going on to become 1 of 32 NFL head coaches?
Does his record really count when it comes to his ability to anal yze others play?

And yes, he is a paid talking head.

Sure there are great analysts who never played the sport. But no one, minus a family member would ever accuse Dan of being one.

The point being when you try and strengthen a weak ass argument with one quote from Orzlosky (sp) you're pretty much are admitting defeat.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Shula is a great coach 2 diff organizations and surprisingly didn't win with Marino This is all subjective I guess and my opinion. If you gave me the choice of BB or Sean Payton for 2023 HC of NE, I would take Sean . I'd take Andy Reid in a heartbeat, Harbaugh it's a wash The young coaches like McVeigh, to early to tell. Kraft's biggest mistake was giving BB the GM position, like Parcells wanted. Now this guy is hiring his friends who failed elsewhere and sons which I guess is normal, and we see where it's heading.

Good points except I don't want anything to do with Hairball.
Payton and Reid both have their faults as well.
This is one of my points. There just aren't a lot of really good HCs out there. So I'm not ready to cut the BB chord just yet.

 

[sonnyblack65]

Good points except I don't want anything to do with Hairball.
Payton and Reid both have their faults as well.
This is one of my points. There just aren't a lot of really good HCs out there. So I'm not ready to cut the BB chord just yet.

I'd be ok with BB staying here with 2 conditions. Take away his GM role and hire someone, and seeing rehashes come back, I would be fine with Pioli and move Patricia back to DC and hire an good OC. And 2nd have someone else speak at the pressers, I have never seen somebody so cringe. They ask simple questions and his answers are baseball bat across head worthy.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

I'd be ok with BB staying here with 2 conditions. Take away his GM role and hire someone, and seeing rehashes come back, I would be fine with Pioli and move Patricia back to DC and hire an good OC. And 2nd have someone else speak at the pressers, I have never seen somebody so cringe. They ask simple questions and his answers are baseball bat across head worthy.

Put Matt up in the box. Use his brains to analyze everything. Kind of like an Ernie/Scar hybrid.

I think losing those guys have had a huge effect.

The D is fine, I don't want to watch another season of the bend over and don't break D.

Would love to see a new GM don't really care who. Hire him with a 33% share of the vote along with BB and J Kraft.

Most important is the need for an OC and Oline coach. There is talent on that O even with Mac's regression. He possibly could bounce back with a couple changes.

There is plenty of draft capital and cap to fix the Oline.

Mr. Kraft step in and bring this team back to greatness.

 

[sonnyblack65]

Put Matt up in the box. Use his brains to analyze everything. Kind of like an Ernie/Scar hybrid.

I think losing those guys have had a huge effect.

The D is fine, I don't want to watch another season of the bend over and don't break D.

Would love to see a new GM don't really care who. Hire him with a 33% share of the vote along with BB and J Kraft.

Most important is the need for an OC and Oline coach. There is talent on that O even with Mac's regression. He possibly could bounce back with a couple changes.

There is plenty of draft capital and cap to fix the Oline.

Mr. Kraft step in and bring this team back to greatness.

Good post!!

 

[nefansince75]

I have never been on the bandwagon and never trusted him. His beady eyes and looking down when he talks are the first sign he is a liar, and not trustworthy, but to each their own. Merry Christmas!!

Sorry for the vole of words here... I went back and bold some of the key points to make it easier to read.

BigKen loves to whine "with authority" and in the process often goes deep in the tank to criticize BB. I've been known to respond to BK when the smell of bs is in the air and when the topic is BB he's on several occasions referred to me as a BB ball washer, ball tickler (while engaged in another activity) or a provided a similar insult. The truth is I dislike a lot about the guy. I also see redeeming qualities and I'm unsure which is the real person and which is the persona to facilitate getting the job done.

Ever see BB when he's interviewed on a topic outside his team and especially outside football? He's jovial and very understated. Often he appears happy to be part of a conversation without ever overtaking it. These appearances have been very rare though.

I also like the 6 SB trophies and three AFC trophies that failed to match with a SB. As much as having Brady was the largest factor, I do think he added as much as any coach has added to any other star in the league.

However, I'm tired of the schtick with the media when he can fully expect questions and responds with pure disrespect. He has enough personality to respond with more humor while giving away the exact same details (zero). He could be honest and repeat policies on giving certain details details and there's nothing wrong with adding "for the respect of players or those involved" or team matter, etc...

Lastly, I fully respect the chessmanship and need to obfuscate any information that could have strategic value, However I think he carries it too far. I heard stories of him getting enraged when opposing medical staff try to aid an injured player who is genuinely in need of aid when simply shooing them off is enough. His need for control needs to be compartmentalized and not be allowed out in a way that makes him look like a doosh or total asshole. He needs to get this one thing: he's already in control and does not need to constanttly emphsize it with actions that don't accomplish anything productive.

 

[Yankee Traveler]

Shula is a great coach 2 diff organizations and surprisingly didn't win with Marino This is all subjective I guess and my opinion. If you gave me the choice of BB or Sean Payton for 2023 HC of NE, I would take Sean . I'd take Andy Reid in a heartbeat, Harbaugh it's a wash The young coaches like McVeigh, to early to tell. Kraft's biggest mistake was giving BB the GM position, like Parcells wanted. Now this guy is hiring his friends who failed elsewhere and sons which I guess is normal, and we see where it's heading.

I haven't seen that Bill has failed enough that I would take any of those guys over him.
Is it coming? Maybe. Yeah, sure it is.
He took the best QB he could get his hands on. He hired his friends who everybody was complaining when they got hired back about the constant brain drain. But are they friends, or just former employees/coworkers that he trusts to know how he does business and not have to indoctrinate a new OC from outside.
OK, experiment failed, move on. But BB hasn't failed because of one bad season that isn't even over yet.

 

[Yankee Traveler]

OK. Not sure I get your point though?

Yeah...me either. That was yesterday, I forget.

 

[Yankee Traveler]

Sure there are great analysts who never played the sport. But no one, minus a family member would ever accuse Dan of being one.

The point being when you try and strengthen a weak ass argument with one quote from Orzlosky (sp) you're pretty much are admitting defeat.

This I agree with.

 

[YankeeRebel]

Anyone thinking BBs job is at risk, or he should be fired is off their rocker, makes zero sense. He is 297-151 that is a winning percentage of .663. He has six SB Titles,

Bill Belichick - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Yankee Traveler]

Anyone thinking BBs job is at risk, or he should be fired is off their rocker, makes zero sense. He is 297-151 that is a winning percentage of .663. He has six SB Titles,

Bill Belichick - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

No...Tom Brady has 6 SB titles.

Bill was lucky to just be there.

 

[YankeeRebel]

No...Tom Brady has 6 SB titles.

Bill was lucky to just be there.

LOL I believe there are some people who think TB12 did it all on his own, can't argue opinion won't argue idiocy

 

[nefansince75]

I haven't seen that Bill has failed enough that I would take any of those guys over him.
Is it coming? Maybe. Yeah, sure it is.
He took the best QB he could get his hands on. He hired his friends who everybody was complaining when they got hired back about the constant brain drain. But are they friends, or just former employees/coworkers that he trusts to know how he does business and not have to indoctrinate a new OC from outside.
OK, experiment failed, move on. But BB hasn't failed because of one bad season that isn't even over yet.

Adding to this: What is our definition of failure? Is it no SB trophy (a few years back that was the standard)? Is it presenting a product we can cheer for and provides tons of entertainment through the season? I'd say we've had that almost every year under BB except this one, possibly add 2002 and 2020.

We all knew we'd take some lumps during the transition from Brady. Does exactly how lumpy it is really matter? The current trend "is not our friend" but one season is not a good measurement period. I'm not saying we should silently accept everything we see but I seem to be more patient than many.

 

[Southieinnc]

Put Matt up in the box. Use his brains to analyze everything. Kind of like an Ernie/Scar hybrid.

I think losing those guys have had a huge effect.

The D is fine, I don't want to watch another season of the bend over and don't break D.

Would love to see a new GM don't really care who. Hire him with a 33% share of the vote along with BB and J Kraft.

Most important is the need for an OC and Oline coach. There is talent on that O even with Mac's regression. He possibly could bounce back with a couple changes.

There is plenty of draft capital and cap to fix the Oline.

Mr. Kraft step in and bring this team back to greatness.

I mostly agree with this.
Unfortunately, improving the O-line is not easy. Miami has been throwing money and picks at it for years and they are all the way up to 27th in run blocking!

 

[sonnyblack65]

Anyone thinking BBs job is at risk, or he should be fired is off their rocker, makes zero sense. He is 297-151 that is a winning percentage of .663. He has six SB Titles,

Bill Belichick - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Kraft is used to going to playoffs and SB's. He did it with Parcells and then through the 2000's with BB, but is a businessman first, along with his son. Belichick has 0 loyalty to players that might be long in tooth or just doesn't want to pay them, and I'm sure Kraft is the same way, 'What have you done for me lately" He is paying BB $20 mill a year and wants results. He mentioned at the owners meeting that he wasn't happy about not winning a playoff game since 2019, plus spending 170 mill in FA when he used to scoff at owners that would do that. Throw in the fact that BB wanted to launch TB who Kraft considered like another son, Bob foot his foot down, and you know the rest. Hey maybe I'm off my rocker, wouldn't be the first time I heard that. Again he is .470 w/o TB and .770 with to make that .663 avg and only 1 playoff win in 10 seasons with diff QB under center. IMO Bob and Jonathan will not tolerate being mediocre , after tasting some much success with what they built.

 

[nefansince75]

Kraft is used to going to playoffs and SB's. He did it with Parcells and then through the 2000's with BB,

Couldn't that mean Kraft is used to having Hall of Fame caliber coaches? I'm am intentionally splitting hairs just to add some contrast (not undermine) to your argument.

 

[YankeeRebel]

Kraft is used to going to playoffs and SB's. He did it with Parcells and then through the 2000's with BB, but is a businessman first, along with his son. Belichick has 0 loyalty to players that might be long in tooth or just doesn't want to pay them, and I'm sure Kraft is the same way, 'What have you done for me lately" He is paying BB $20 mill a year and wants results. He mentioned at the owners meeting that he wasn't happy about not winning a playoff game since 2019, plus spending 170 mill in FA when he used to scoff at owners that would do that. Throw in the fact that BB wanted to launch TB who Kraft considered like another son, Bob foot his foot down, and you know the rest. Hey maybe I'm off my rocker, wouldn't be the first time I heard that. Again he is .470 w/o TB and .770 with to make that .663 avg and only 1 playoff win in 10 seasons with diff QB under center. IMO Bob and Jonathan will not tolerate being mediocre , after tasting some much success with what they built.

LMAO You spitballing Kraft is used to going to the playoffs doesn't mean he doesn't understand the team is rebuilding. And if BB is so tight with the money why is the team so cap tight? Your argument is that because Kraft is use to something he is willing to get rid of the arguably the best head coach ever. That makes sense to you, pretty sure it would not to Kraft.

 

[sonnyblack65]

LMAO You spitballing Kraft is used to going to the playoffs doesn't mean he doesn't understand the team is rebuilding. And if BB is so tight with the money why is the team so cap tight? Your argument is that because Kraft is use to something he is willing to get rid of the arguably the best head coach ever. That makes sense to you, pretty sure it would not to Kraft.

 

[sonnyblack65]

Couldn't that mean Kraft is used to having Hall of Fame caliber coaches? I'm am intentionally splitting hairs just to add some contrast (not undermine) to your argument.

No I completely understand and it's just my opinion. If this was the Rooney's or owner's not so entrenched or used to winning, I would be more likely to think he has job security. If he let BB let TB go, prob be sitting with only 4 Lombardi and more losing seasons imo. Throw in him bringing back Patricia and Judge, inserting them in offense and that is the laughingstock of every sports program I watch. Guy just does not good decisions., Again i'm ok with him as HC but not as GM and personnel decisions

 

[YankeeRebel]

LOL Nothing there at all to indicate he is considering ridding the team of BB nothing at all. You're grasping at nothing. He states he does not like losing playoff games, then immediately states he is pleased with the draft class. The class his GM BB drafted. If this is all your hanging your hat on then you really have nothing.