Kyrie to Boston rumors heating up. Deal nearly complete

[Vyle203]

Where is @Mecca ?

I need her to rub my head and tell me the Celtics did good and everything's going to be ok.

 

[WiggyRuss]

@WiggyRuss is my new best friend, leave him alone.

my purple and gold Nance Jr. jersey T is in the mail!

 

[LALakersboy24.7]

my purple and gold Nance Jr. jersey T is in the mail!

 

[tlance]

there's no such thing as a surefire stud.

andrew wiggins was the next Lebron James. Then everyone waffled on him come draft day. Okafor was the golden ticket and then KAT passed him in the tourney. Ben Simmons was a surefire stud then his team sucked and he got lapped by Ingram.

I get what you're saying. I really do. But those real, true, surefire studs? Come along once every 12 years.

The last one was LeBron. Before that, there was Shaq.

Sure, other #1 picks like Duncan have been all time greats. But surefire stud, as you call it? 2 in the last 25 drafts. Shaq and James.

No, Wiggins was not. Neither was Okafor. On draft day, most thought each player had star potential, but was far from a sure thing.

KAT and AD were also sure things. I am not going back further than that, but there were others.

Okafor and Wiggins were overhyped during their college seasons.

It is possible that Bagley or Porter aren't as good as advertised. But it is also possible they are future 1st team all NBA players. Very few players enter the league with that kind of upside. Many number 1 picks don't have it. Josh Jackson is probably the highest ceiling player in this current draft class, but he has a ton of risk too.

 

[tlance]

I mean its only common sense.

Kyrie is still going to be one of the best scorers in the league. Hes amazing offensively. As i have said- other than Durant--- i think hes the best offensive player in the league. The whole reason he is somewhere around the 15th best player in the league is because he is maybe the hardest guy to guard in the league outside of Durant.

But you dont leave LeBron James- the best player in the league--- the games premier combination stretch big man/rebounder in Love, and 3 point shooters like Korver, Frye, Smith, and now Crowder (who shot 40% from 3 last year), without seeing that spacing shrink.

Not only that- but Thomas doesnt have to play 34 minutes a game and carry an offense like he had to do in Boston....hes never played with a scorer like LeBron...hes never played with a scorer like Love...hes never had shooting around him like Korver/JR/Frye....

he is not going to believe how much easier the game gets when instead of constantly getting double teamed- you are left on your own since LeBron has 2 guys on him and if you sag off Love or Korver or Smith or Frye or whoever- you will be made to pay a high price.

I cant wait for the start of the season and run this back.

You honestly believe Kyrie is a better offensive player than James Harden and Steph Curry?

Harden plays no defense and you clearly rank him ahead of Kyrie. Curry is a better defender, but also definitely a better all around offensive player. Not even close really.

Kyrie is probably a better scorer than either. Harden and Curry make the game easy for teammates. Kyrie does not.

 

[WiggyRuss]

No, Wiggins was not. Neither was Okafor. On draft day, most thought each player had star potential, but was far from a sure thing.

KAT and AD were also sure things. I am not going back further than that, but there were others.

Okafor and Wiggins were overhyped during their college seasons.

It is possible that Bagley or Porter aren't as good as advertised. But it is also possible they are future 1st team all NBA players. Very few players enter the league with that kind of upside. Many number 1 picks don't have it. Josh Jackson is probably the highest ceiling player in this current draft class, but he has a ton of risk too.

Ill agree on Okafor--

Wiggins and JAbari i can see both sides- bothwere hyped in a huge way--- but Embiid was actually thought to be #1 before his injury (shit im ean he went 3 even though he had a big injury)

I mean- Wall was a huge prospect. Anthony Davis was. Towns was. Blake Griffin. Simmons was a huge prospect. Derek Rose was a humongous prospect.

not everyone had Kyrie- most did- but he wasnt a monster prospect like the above guys.


from what i understand Bagley and Porter are expected to be in that tier 1 level of prospect

 

[WiggyRuss]

No, Wiggins was not. Neither was Okafor. On draft day, most thought each player had star potential, but was far from a sure thing.

KAT and AD were also sure things. I am not going back further than that, but there were others.

Okafor and Wiggins were overhyped during their college seasons.

It is possible that Bagley or Porter aren't as good as advertised. But it is also possible they are future 1st team all NBA players. Very few players enter the league with that kind of upside. Many number 1 picks don't have it. Josh Jackson is probably the highest ceiling player in this current draft class, but he has a ton of risk too.

I kind of think Fox has the highest ceiling in this draft.

 

[Black Adam]

Where is @Mecca ?

I need her to rub my head and tell me the Celtics did good and everything's going to be ok.

is it official Mecca's the den mother of these boards now...?

just askin'...

 

[tlance]

And went second overall.

Because the potential upside of Greg Oden was viewed as more valuable in an era where big men where still thought to be the ticket to winning championships.

 

[tlance]

Westbrook "is" a better offensive player than Kyrie. Not only that Westbrook plays great defense. Actually IMO, Curry a better offensive player than Kyrie.

Eh.

I agree with most of this, but Westbrook does not play great defense. He doesn't even really play good defense.

He is a capable defender for sure. But he is more interested in doing other things.

 

[Black Adam]

Because the potential upside of Greg Oden was viewed as more valuable in an era where big men where still thought to be the ticket to winning championships.

yep...

talk about overhyped...

and that was before his injury issues...

 

[The Q]

Because the potential upside of Greg Oden was viewed as more valuable in an era where big men where still thought to be the ticket to winning championships.

Say what you want, but if you have an elite big man like Oden was projected to be, it IS the ticket.

You don't think a Shaq, or Admiral wouldn't still dominate?

 

[Black Adam]

Say what you want, but if you have an elite big man like Oden was projected to be, it IS the ticket.

You don't think a Shaq, or Admiral wouldn't still dominate?

not so much as BEFORE zone defenses and no hand checking were instituted...

"conventional wisdom", such as it is, says you start/build with a point guard these days...

 

[tlance]

Say what you want, but if you have an elite big man like Oden was projected to be, it IS the ticket.

You don't think a Shaq, or Admiral wouldn't still dominate?

Dominate, sure.

But Shaq would get exposed defensively too. Robinson and Hakeem would actually be more valuable because they could defend in space so well.

Until I see a big man carry a franchise though, I will hold my belief. The best bigs in today's game can't even make the playoffs.

 

[Vyle203]

is it official Mecca's the den mother of these boards now...?

just askin'...

Maybe.

 

[WiggyRuss]

You honestly believe Kyrie is a better offensive player than James Harden and Steph Curry?

Harden plays no defense and you clearly rank him ahead of Kyrie. Curry is a better defender, but also definitely a better all around offensive player. Not even close really.

Kyrie is probably a better scorer than either. Harden and Curry make the game easy for teammates. Kyrie does not.

Kyrie is harder to guard and a better scorer---- i guess if you are making that distinguishment between scorer and offensive player- you def. take RW and Harden above Kyrie.

Kyrie just has no weakness as a scorer- he is amazing on all 3 levels.

 

[The Q]

not so much as BEFORE zone defenses and no hand checking were instituted...

"conventional wisdom", such as it is, says you start/build with a point guard these days...

I think it's really acquiring 2 stars.

The average 2nd best player on a championship team (historically) has been about 14 according to that 538 article I posted.

And if you're not a typical FA destination like Miami, Texas or California, you need to OKC or GS that shit and draft them (and then not cheap out and trade one away).

In the modern game that means surrounding them with rim protection and 3pt shooters.

You need your stars
Your rim protection
and your 3 & D guys.

All in your top 7-8 players.

 

[knowyourenemy]

Dominate, sure.

But Shaq would get exposed defensively too. Robinson and Hakeem would actually be more valuable because they could defend in space so well.

Until I see a big man carry a franchise though, I will hold my belief. The best bigs in today's game can't even make the playoffs.

Embiid may be the man to do it. Just has to stay healthy.

 

[The Q]

Kyrie is harder to guard and a better scorer---- i guess if you are making that distinguishment between scorer and offensive player- you def. take RW and Harden above Kyrie.

Kyrie just has no weakness as a scorer- he is amazing on all 3 levels.

I read somewhere that his biggest offensive weakness was not drawing more fouls.

This is a good look at Irving.

FTW Explains: Why no one can agree about how good Kyrie Irving actually is

 

[The Q]

Dominate, sure.

But Shaq would get exposed defensively too. Robinson and Hakeem would actually be more valuable because they could defend in space so well.

Until I see a big man carry a franchise though, I will hold my belief. The best bigs in today's game can't even make the playoffs.

Shaq drew enough fouls to make up for it (and would've drawn more if not for shamelessly corrupt NBA officiating).