Harbaugh pulls commit's offer two weeks before signing day

[TrustMeIamRight]

There's a whole lot more to back up my side on Dean than there is on you guys and Weaver. OSU never told Dean he was for sure going to get medically cleared and that he'd be able to play. You guys told Weaver he had a commitable offer and that you had accepted it, and then you shut down communication. Two different situations.

That is because a school cannot comment until after a recruit signs a NLI. Instead, you are taking what a jilted recruit is saying as the bible, without knowing the other side of the story. That is what I'm getting at.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

And as I pointed out to MB already, at the last minute they accepted a commitment from a much lower rated CB prospect who they knew was going to need to take a redshirt anyhow to rehab from an injury. The logic just isn't there.

And I say, the whole lower rated only matters to each individual team. Just because a site says a player is a 3 star or a 4 star doesn't mean that is how they are viewed by the team recruiting them.

 

[Across The Field]

That is because a school cannot comment until after a recruit signs a NLI. Instead, you are taking what a jilted recruit is saying as the bible, without knowing the other side of the story. That is what I'm getting at.

Well, there is no other side of the story here, is there? If you guys can take what actually is Ohio State's side of the story and just shoot it down with no evidence to back up your accusations, there's certainly nothing wrong with me calling out michigan for their handling of this recruit as it has appeared.

 

[Across The Field]

And I say, the whole lower rated only matters to each individual team. Just because a site says a player is a 3 star or a 4 star doesn't mean that is how they are viewed by the team recruiting them.

I see your point there, but if they thought so much more of him than they did of Dean, why did they wait until the last day of January to actually go visit him and try to flip him? He had committed to South Carolina in the summer and OSU didn't really go after him again until just before signing day. Again, not a lot of logic there to support your theory. Seems significantly more likely that they knew Dean wasn't going to get medically cleared so at the last minute they went after one of their backup plans.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

I see your point there, but if they thought so much more of him than they did of Dean, why did they wait until the last day of January to actually go visit him and try to flip him? He had committed to South Carolina in the summer and OSU didn't really go after him again until just before signing day. Again, not a lot of logic there to support your theory. Seems significantly more likely that they knew Dean wasn't going to get medically cleared so at the last minute they went after one of their backup plans.

If they knew he wasn't going to be medically cleared. Why have him enroll early? Also, teams get into recruiting certain players late every year for many reasons. Maybe the recruit has a change of heart, maybe a coaching change, maybe a friend signs elsewhere and they want to follow. Who knows? A few guys that signed with Michigan weren't even on our radar until recently.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

All I'm saying is. Before going overboard on Harbaugh. Wait for the whole story. If it comes out UM just said sorry we found someone better -- leaving a teenage kid to find a new school in 2 weeks. I will be here posting that is shady as hell.

 

[Innermind]

Erik Swenson still doesn't have a spot because apparently he wants Wisconsin.... and Wisconsin wants him... but the Badgers are full.

Recruiting News and Notes: Erik Swenson still in search for school

So, I believe Swenson is waiting/hoping for a decommit/flip to happen at Wisconsin. Meanwhile, other Power 5 schools are showing interest in Swenson, but I guess he is waiting for an opening at Wisconsin?

CB Ke'shan Pennamon out of Florida is the most likely to flip from the Badgers, as Rutgers is going hard after Pennamon.
Ke'Shan Pennamon, West Nassau County , Cornerback

So....in anticipation of the flip, the Badgers just got another CB commit on Jan 26.... Caesar Williams out of Texas
Caesar Williams, South Grand Prairie , Cornerback

 

[Across The Field]

If they knew he wasn't going to be medically cleared. Why have him enroll early? Also, teams get into recruiting certain players late every year for many reasons. Maybe the recruit has a change of heart, maybe a coaching change, maybe a friend signs elsewhere and they want to follow. Who knows? A few guys that signed with Michigan weren't even on our radar until recently.

They didn't know he wasn't going to be medically cleared before he enrolled. He tore his ACL in 2013, and then seemed to be healthy his senior year in 2014. He was all set to enroll early, and then a week before he got to campus, he injured his knee again in the Semper-Fi AA game. They didn't get a chance to fully evaluate his knee until after he had already gotten to campus.

And the second part of what your saying doesn't really prove anything against Ohio State; in fact, it pretty much supports what I'm saying. The recruit had a change of heart because, upon finding out Dean wasn't going to get cleared, they went down and put on the press and flipped him. He was a replacement for Dean. That part is pretty evident.

All I'm saying is. Before going overboard on Harbaugh. Wait for the whole story. If it comes out UM just said sorry we found someone better -- leaving a teenage kid to find a new school in 2 weeks. I will be here posting that is shady as hell.

I'm not going overboard on him. I'm merely pointing out that what he's doing here appears to be very, very shitty. The whole reason this convo is still going is because you guys keep trying to bring up the Jamel Dean thing and equate it to what Harbaugh is doing even though there's nothing logical that counters what OSU said happened.

 

[7Samurai13]

Erik Swenson still doesn't have a spot because apparently he wants Wisconsin.... and Wisconsin wants him... but the Badgers are full.

Recruiting News and Notes: Erik Swenson still in search for school

So, I believe Swenson is waiting/hoping for a decommit/flip to happen at Wisconsin. Meanwhile, other Power 5 schools are showing interest in Swenson, but I guess he is waiting for an opening at Wisconsin?

Wisconsin was known for being an offensive line factory for the NFL. I don't know if things have changed since Bielema left because we never get to play Wisconsin anymore.​

 

[Across The Field]

Wisconsin was known for being an offensive line factory for the NFL. I don't know if things have changed since Bielema left because we never get to play Wisconsin anymore.​

I feel you there. I'm pumped for our game up in Camp Randall this October. We haven't played there in 4 frickin years.

 

[LoftonPack80]

Wisconsin was known for being an offensive line factory for the NFL. I don't know if things have changed since Bielema left because we never get to play Wisconsin anymore.​

And outside of Frederick for Dallas they've all flamed out fast in the last decade or so

 

[LoftonPack80]

Sadly.....this is the world of recruiting in this day and age. I do find it funny that this is being targeted at Harbaugh when dropping commits has been a staple of the SEC for years and was brought to the Big Ten by Urban. None of these coaches are morally or ethically clean. Is it shady? Damn right but if you want your program to get to the elite level you fight fire with fire. This is the modern state of big time college football. Harbaugh wasnt paid 7 mil a year to just win some Big Ten titles. Hes expected to comete with the Bamas and Florida States and Clemsons. Want to stamp the problem out.....early signing period

 

[cwerph]

What lie am I making up? We know, for a fact, these things:

-The OSU recruit in question enrolled early
-OSU knew about his knee injury (that happened in 2013) before signing him and moving him to campus
-OSU's class at the time had more committed players than they had room for
-Said player was evaluated by team doctors and said his injury was a football ending injury and OSU would not let him play. Kid had his knee looked at by other doctors and was cleared -- OSU would still not enroll him.
-Literally 5 months later he was a full participant in Auburn's summer camp and "looked exceptional"

So, there are only two conclusions you can draw from this. Either OSU's team doctors were influenced to give the wrong prognosis in order for OSU to make the numbers work OR the OSU team doctors are terrible and should not be practicing medicine; unless you have another option you'd like to share?

Jamel Dean looking 'exceptional' at Auburn after knee injury ended his time at Ohio State

What defensive backs coach Travaris Robinson had to say: "I mean his knee looks exceptional. He's running, he's breaking, so I'm excited about him. Don't know what the future is going to hold, as far as when is going to play and all that kind of stuff, but he is doing a great job. He's a great kid and I'm so happy we got them."

And from your own local newspapers no less:
Former Buckeye Jamel Dean speaks about controversial Ohio State departure, says 'I could have played'

"The Buckeyes, from what had been announced, appeared to be in a numbers crunch for scholarships, but Ohio State said it had approached National Signing Day in February knowing that Dean would be out and adjusted accordingly. They were adamant that Dean's situation had nothing to do with numbers, and that coaches liked the 6-foot-2 cornerback as a prospect.

But John Wilkinson, Dean's coach, was clearly upset months later.

"It's totally wrong to do this to an 18-year-old kid who should be in high school, who you talked into coming up there early," Wilkinson told NEOMG in April. "You can't treat people this way."

After speaking with Wilkinson after the story was published, Ohio State felt the matter had been worked out. Dean had sought a second medical opinion, worked with outside expert Dr. James Andrews, and said he he been cleared. Multiple other schools allowed him to play. But Ohio State said if its doctors would not clear Dean, the issue was over. "

Multiple other teams, and unbiased doctors, cleared the player that the OSU team doctors wouldn't. Funny how that works when you need to meet a scholarship limit -- huh?


So, please tell me what I've gotten wrong here? Why won't you just admit this is a scumbag move and way worse than pulling a scholarship weeks before signing day. Dean had to sit out an entire year because of what Urban did to him.

I already admitted I didn't like what happened to Swenson but have no problem with pulling scholarships prior to signing day. What's super hypocritical is to naively believe that Urban did nothing wrong with the handling of Dean and then criticize Harbaugh for for his handling of the Swenson situation.

Things you missed...

Dean injured his knee but seemed fine when he committed. He signed a mid-year financial aid agreement which meant that they could NOT PREVENT HIM FROM ENROLLING EARLY. If something nefarious was going on they could have come up with some bogus academic reason to keep him out, but they didn't.

AFTER HE SIGNED THE MID-YEAR AGREEMENT he reinjured the same knee. Ohio State asked him not to enroll early but he would not listen.

So, the crux of your argument "they moved him to campus" is pure, unadulterated vagerine crap. THEY COULD NOT STOP HIM FROM ENROLLING.

 

[Across The Field]

And outside of Frederick for Dallas they've all flamed out fast in the last decade or so

Joe Thomas? Kevin Zeitler? Rob Havenstein? Rick Wagner?

All are starting, and Thomas and Zeitler are still elite.

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

Things you missed...

Dean injured his knee but seemed fine when he committed. He signed a mid-year financial aid agreement which meant that they could NOT PREVENT HIM FROM ENROLLING EARLY. If something nefarious was going on they could have come up with some bogus academic reason to keep him out, but they didn't.

AFTER HE SIGNED THE MID-YEAR AGREEMENT he reinjured the same knee. Ohio State asked him not to enroll early but he would not listen.

So, the crux of your argument "they moved him to campus" is pure, unadulterated vagerine crap. THEY COULD NOT STOP HIM FROM ENROLLING.

It shouldn't have mattered when he enrolled or if he tweaked an old injury and needed a few months to recover. Once OSU let him sign those papers, he was their recruit. If they don't want kids enrolling early, they shouldn't allow them to sign papers. It shouldn't matter if they have a minor injury in the meantime.

 

[cwerph]

It shouldn't have mattered when he enrolled or if he tweaked an old injury and needed a few months to recover. Once OSU let him sign those papers, he was their recruit. If they don't want kids enrolling early, they shouldn't allow them to sign papers. It shouldn't matter if they have a minor injury in the meantime.

LOL --- are you a woman? YOUR argument was they should not have let him enroll.

 

[Across The Field]

It shouldn't have mattered when he enrolled or if he tweaked an old injury and needed a few months to recover. Once OSU let him sign those papers, he was their recruit. If they don't want kids enrolling early, they shouldn't allow them to sign papers. It shouldn't matter if they have a minor injury in the meantime.

It wasn't a minor injury.

You've been wrong on nearly every aspect of this topic. Just give up already. Nobody is going to agree with you that what happened to Dean is similar to Harbaugh completely blindsiding kids.

 

[umichgradfan]

All of this discussion regarding Jim Harbaugh's recruiting practices as well as the recruiting practices of other elite coaches like Meyer and Saban seems to have filled some of the void left by the end of the CFB season. We can certainly argue all day and all night long just as we have here, or we can have a substantive discussion about how the recruiting system needs to change to ensure that players and schools alike don't get screwed. All of the finger-pointing is, well, pointless.

That simple fact is that nobody knows exactly what happened in any of the cases posters have mentioned here. It's all speculation and innuendo and rivals taking shots at each other. One thing we can agree on is that ALL (elite?) coaches skirt the edge of what the NCAA allows and what is ethical. Schools "offer" more than 100 players when they can recruit only about a fourth of that number. It amounts to throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks. The so-called "tender feelings" of young players are going to get hurt when they realize they are not as elite as they thought they were.

If we are so "scandalized" by what happens, the system can be changed to stop this slimy, shady behavior on everyone's part if people are willing. The NCAA needs to change the system. The sports media needs to stop encouraging the bad behavior of players and schools alike. Whole web sites devoted to the current system need to be thwarted. The NSD coverage, which is over the top and ridiculous and only provides 15 minutes of fame for players who may or may not pan out, needs to stop. People see only a few of these players reach their imagined potential on the field. There has certainly got to be a better way.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

It wasn't a minor injury.

You've been wrong on nearly every aspect of this topic. Just give up already. Nobody is going to agree with you that what happened to Dean is similar to Harbaugh completely blindsiding kids.

Why is everyone going back to it being comparable? There isn't only one way to be shady in recruiting. You can pull scholarships, you can give grey shirts to healthy players to get around the maximum number of recruits allowed, you can make up an injury that only your doctors see and tell a kid he can't play, you can tell a kid he has a spot but only if player A or B don't accept. The list goes on and on.
It isnt about being comparable. It is that all the top programs are shady. These coaches are being paid millions to coach a game. These kids are their cash cow, so they will do what it takes to push he the boundaries to give them any advantage they can get.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

It wasn't a minor injury.

You've been wrong on nearly every aspect of this topic. Just give up already. Nobody is going to agree with you that what happened to Dean is similar to Harbaugh completely blindsiding kids.

Which OSU fan posted the story said his last injury was a torn meniscus, the most common and minor of any knee injury. That injury would have had nothing to do with his ability to play football, as it doesn't have anything to do with the ligaments (the major knee surgeries)
So one of two things happened:
1. OSU didn't give him a physical before telling him to fill out his financial aid
2. OSU found someone they liked more and used his latest injury as an excuse to say he couldn't play football anymore, knowing he would transfer and open up the spot they needed.

My guess is OSU didn't think he would go to the leading sports medicine doctor in the world to get checked out afterward -- making the diagnosis look extremely shady when he says the knee is fine and he just has to strengthen his quads.