Does Kaepernick get an extension this off season?

[darken65]

You have to look at his whole body of work, not just accentuate the positives and totally ignore the negatives. He's capable of making plays that few other people on this planet are capable of making, but that doesn't mean he's a great quarterback. He's far too streaky and while his highs are very high, his lows are very low as well. But on average what does he look like? A guy who is incapable of making progressions, who locks on to his receivers, who has poor pocket awareness and gets sacked or has to throw the ball away too often, who is oblivious to his clock management issues, and who has been very lucky that defensive players have been dropping his gift INTs/pick sixes. Just because he can occasionally rip a 60 yard run and apparently has the Packers ticket doesn't mean we can ignore all that stuff and say "He's T7 bro. We got this."

Alex Smith never had the chance to take us to back to back NFC championship games. Again, I think Kap is better than Smith but the team hasn't performed markedly better with Kap as QB vs Smith. If Kap gets one of those contracts which means that the overall team talent level will get worse then this team will definitely get worse, unless Kap can make huge strides. If he wants to sign for like 7-8 million per I'm all for that because that's what he is worth. But we all know it will be more than double that. And when he signs that contract, that will be the dagger in the heart of our Superbowl aspirations, unless he makes an unlikely improvement.

Well stated. I really hope that Kap will get better in time. If he is the 9ers' future he had better do just that or it really doesn't matter who the 9ers sign as FA ,draft or resign.

 

[-AC-]

You have to look at his whole body of work, not just accentuate the positives and totally ignore the negatives. He's capable of making plays that few other people on this planet are capable of making, but that doesn't mean he's a great quarterback. He's far too streaky and while his highs are very high, his lows are very low as well. But on average what does he look like? A guy who is incapable of making progressions, who locks on to his receivers, who has poor pocket awareness and gets sacked or has to throw the ball away too often, who is oblivious to his clock management issues, and who has been very lucky that defensive players have been dropping his gift INTs/pick sixes. Just because he can occasionally rip a 60 yard run and apparently has the Packers ticket doesn't mean we can ignore all that stuff and say "He's T7 bro. We got this."

Alex Smith never had the chance to take us to back to back NFC championship games. Again, I think Kap is better than Smith but the team hasn't performed markedly better with Kap as QB vs Smith. If Kap gets one of those contracts which means that the overall team talent level will get worse then this team will definitely get worse, unless Kap can make huge strides. If he wants to sign for like 7-8 million per I'm all for that because that's what he is worth. But we all know it will be more than double that. And when he signs that contract, that will be the dagger in the heart of our Superbowl aspirations, unless he makes an unlikely improvement.

And like wise, while some are focusing on his positives others like yourself are focusing on his negetives... Alex Smith had what, six or seven seasons to get it together? Kapernick just completed his FIRST official season as a starter... So throwing statements like "unless he makes an unlikely improvement" is ridiculous... I have no problem dumping him if he doesn't improve in the near future, but some of you guys aren't giving him a fair shake at this... Most QB's need a little time and experience to develope, and learn the positition at the NFL level...

 

[NinerSickness]

So throwing statements like "unless he makes an unlikely improvement" is ridiculous...

Why is that ridiculous? Do most NFL quarterbacks tend to make marked improvements after the age of 26?

And when has he shown to have stopped repeating the same mistakes over again in the past? What specifically has he improved since his first start in Chicago?

 

[-AC-]

Why is that ridiculous? Do most NFL quarterbacks tend to make marked improvements after the age of 26?

And when has he shown to have stopped repeating the same mistakes over again in the past? What specifically has he improved since his first start in Chicago?

His age is not relevant, its about starting experience... Its ridiculous because he just finished his first official season of starting... You can go back and find several QB's that made stupid decisions, often the same stupid decisions over and over again that are doing fine now... You look at guys like Tony Romo and Phillip Rivers (both who have mentioned as notable better QB's than Kap on this board) who both went through torturous series of mistakes through their careers... Having these types of conversations is reactionary for this board because of what most of us went through with Alex Smith...

 

[NinerSickness]

His age is not relevant, its about starting experience... Its ridiculous because he just finished his first official season of starting... You can go back and find several QB's that made stupid decisions, often the same stupid decisions over and over again that are doing fine now... You look at guys like Tony Romo and Phillip Rivers (both who have mentioned as notable better QB's than Kap on this board) who both went through torturous series of mistakes through their careers... Having these types of conversations is reactionary for this board because of what most of us went through with Alex Smith...

1. I never said Tony Romo is better than TGL. I said Rivers is. And he is. By a mile.

But you're looking at his starts in a vacuum. Starts in college and backup experience both contribute towards learning the position and getting to the point where the QB isn't making rookie mistakes. QBs like Kurt Warner, Jeff Garcia, Rich Gannon, etc. didn't need a lot of time to get acclimated to starting despite a lack of starting experience.

DumbDumb hasn't made ANY improvements since his first start. In fact he's gotten worse. All of the mistakes he made in his first year he literally did the exact same thing all year and including the NFC title game (except running out of bounds for a loss). Most people go to the great QBs and look at how they progressed after their first few years; that's a mistake. You can't just look at the QBs who stand out. You have to look at guys like Shaun King, Charlie Batch, Aaron Brooks, Marc Bulger, Josh Freeman, etc. Quarterbacks don't necessarily get better with improvement. There's no reason to assume one will.

 

[-AC-]

1. I never said Tony Romo is better than TGL. I said Rivers is. And he is. By a mile.

But you're looking at his starts in a vacuum. Starts in college and backup experience both contribute towards learning the position and getting to the point where the QB isn't making rookie mistakes. QBs like Kurt Warner, Jeff Garcia, Rich Gannon, etc. didn't need a lot of time to get acclimated to starting despite a lack of starting experience.

DumbDumb hasn't made ANY improvements since his first start. In fact he's gotten worse. All of the mistakes he made in his first year he literally did the exact same thing all year and including the NFC title game (except running out of bounds for a loss). Most people go to the great QBs and look at how they progressed after their first few years; that's a mistake. You can't just look at the QBs who stand out. You have to look at guys like Shaun King, Charlie Batch, Aaron Brooks, Marc Bulger, Josh Freeman, etc. Quarterbacks don't necessarily get better with improvement. There's no reason to assume one will.

Thats nice, and all this has been said about Alex Smith and discussed on this board ad nauseam... You can throw out names like Garcia, Gannon and Warner but most of us are smart enough to know they all took over prolific offense's that were designed to pass... kap took over a run first offense that has been littered with incosistancies in the passing game... Before the season started the starting WR's were down to guys like Jenkins, lockette, Baldwin and other hacks like that... Boldin was some what of an unknown coming into the season. No one knew if Crabtree would be back this season and if he would return what he would look like... Kap played well this season, all things considered...

 

[NinerSickness]

Thats nice, and all this has been said about Alex Smith and discussed on this board ad nauseam...

And Alex Smith is a sucktastic, franchise-anchoring (in a bad way) QB. He's the kiss of death.

You can throw out names like Garcia, Gannon and Warner but most of us are smart enough to know they all took over prolific offense's that were designed to pass... kap took over a run first offense that has been littered with incosistancies in the passing game...

Run-first offenses are easier to operate than prolific passing offenses; they take the pressure off the QB. And the offense is also littered with great players.

Before the season started the starting WR's were down to guys like Jenkins, lockette, Baldwin and other hacks like that... Boldin was some what of an unknown coming into the season. No one knew if Crabtree would be back this season and if he would return what he would look like... Kap played well this season, all things considered...

Boldin, Vernon, a great OL and one crappy WR is still a lot with which to work. And he was terrible until he got his 2nd 1000-yard receiver back.

 

[-AC-]

And Alex Smith is a sucktastic, franchise-anchoring (in a bad way) QB. He's the kiss of death.



Run-first offenses are easier to operate than prolific passing offenses; they take the pressure off the QB. And the offense is also littered with great players.



Boldin, Vernon, a great OL and one crappy WR is still a lot with which to work. And he was terrible until he got his 2nd 1000-yard receiver back.

Yes an offense that is run minded should translate to a prolific QB, lol

An offense that doesn't use their running game in the passing offense at all, and doesn't seem to know what a quick hitter is. Two slower style WR's and a TE that can disappear at times, albeit he is still one of the best TE's when he is on... Yep, that should translate to tremendous success for the QB

 

[whysies]

His age is not relevant, its about starting experience... Its ridiculous because he just finished his first official season of starting... You can go back and find several QB's that made stupid decisions, often the same stupid decisions over and over again that are doing fine now... You look at guys like Tony Romo and Phillip Rivers (both who have mentioned as notable better QB's than Kap on this board) who both went through torturous series of mistakes through their careers... Having these types of conversations is reactionary for this board because of what most of us went through with Alex Smith...

Reactionary means super conservative dawg: Reactionary - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

I cosign basically everything Sick said (except for Kap not being better than Romo. Romo is head and shoulders better). Kap hasn't really developed to this point. Of course I hope he does but I'm not going to expect it. And hell if I want this team to give him 20 million a year because they expect it. He hasn't shown anything to suggest he will actually get better. Just because other QBs did it doesn't mean he will. As Sick said, for every Steve Young there's 10 Troy Smiths.

Look, I want Kap to become the greatest QB of all time. When he's clicking, he's a lot of fun to watch. I love dual threat QBs. But none of that means I should just stick my head in the sand and ignore the fact that right now he's not giving us enough and he could be a team killer if he gets that big contract and doesn't greatly improve.

 

[NinerSickness]

Yes an offense that is run minded should translate to a prolific QB, lol

Are you serious right now? Strong running games take the pressure off of a QB. Just like strong passing games take the pressure off the running game. You act like it's a negative to have a good running game.

An offense that doesn't use their running game in the passing offense at all,

You mean screen passes?

and doesn't seem to know what a quick hitter is. Two slower style WR's and a TE that can disappear at times, albeit he is still one of the best TE's when he is on... Yep, that should translate to tremendous success for the QB

Yes that should translate to success for a QB! It's a hell of a lot more talent than most QBs had this year.

 

[-AC-]

Are you serious right now? Strong running games take the pressure off of a QB. Just like strong passing games take the pressure off the running game. You act like it's a negative to have a good running game.



You mean screen passes?



Yes that should translate to success for a QB! It's a hell of a lot more talent than most QBs had this year.

This offense is built and designed to run... The pieces in place are not designed for Kap to go out and throw for 4500 yards a season... As it stands, Kap still had more yards passing in his first complete season than any 49er Qb dating back to Jeff Garcia... Under Kap, Boldin was able to have the best season he has had since being a Cardinal. VD had one of his best seasons as the #2 or 3 option under Kap when his best seasons he was clearly the primary target... Of course nobody is willing give him credit for that, its everything around him that helps him succeed, but when the team fails its all on him... lol

 

[whysies]

This offense is built and designed to run... The pieces in place are not designed for Kap to go out and throw for 4500 yards a season... As it stands, Kap still had more yards passing in his first complete season than any 49er Qb dating back to Jeff Garcia... Under Kap, Boldin was able to have the best season he has had since being a Cardinal. VD had one of his best seasons as the #2 or 3 option under Kap when his best seasons he was clearly the primary target... Of course nobody is willing give him credit for that, its everything around him that helps him succeed, but when the team fails its all on him... lol

We haven't had any good QBs since Garcia. That isn't an amazing accomplishment. In the land of the blind, even the one-eyed man is king.

Boldin also had to play with Flacco, a QB that I would actually rate as worse than Kap.

I'm not sure where you're getting the whole "When the team fails its all on him" thing from. I will say though that if you look at his whole body of work, he was one of the weaker links on the team this season.

 

[purguy12]

Smith had plenty of time to lead this team to back to back NFC championship games, what are you talking about.

His whole body of work has been awesome. Again I don't know what you are watching or if you remember what this team has done the last 2 years as him as the starting QB.

 

[purguy12]

AC is killing you guys in this argument. LOL

Facts are Facts and Facts say he is at least a top 7 QB. Its all about winning and showing up in the playoffs and he does that.

Instead of blaming Kap for the seattle why don't u look at Gore who did nothing or VD who dropped 2-3 passes or a defense that let up a little in the 2nd half(2 big plays.) Yes Kap deserves some blame but to throw it all on him is insane. Kap was our offense, people forget that. 1st have he had something 95% of the yards.

Kap is getting better every year so far and I like the direction he is going in. If u would rather have Rivers, Romo or Cutler go become fan of those teams and come back when neither does anything to make the playoffs or get bounced right away. I will take every day of the week over those bums.

 

[whysies]

Smith had plenty of time to lead this team to back to back NFC championship games, what are you talking about.

His whole body of work has been awesome. Again I don't know what you are watching or if you remember what this team has done the last 2 years as him as the starting QB.

Smith never had the opportunity to lead us to back to back NFC championship games. He had one full season, then got benched halfway through the second one.

I don't see what the team accomplishing has to do with what Kap accomplished. I mean, there is some correlation, of course, but they aren't 100% correlated. The fact that the team was just as successful with Alex Smith (a subpar QB mind you) suggests that Kap didn't have nearly as much to do with the team's success as you're claiming he did.

But now that you say his whole body of work has been awesome I get that you're trolling. No way could someone who watched this season say that, not with all his glaring deficiencies. I see what you did there, well played.

 

[-AC-]

We haven't had any good QBs since Garcia. That isn't an amazing accomplishment. In the land of the blind, even the one-eyed man is king.

Boldin also had to play with Flacco, a QB that I would actually rate as worse than Kap.

I'm not sure where you're getting the whole "When the team fails its all on him" thing from. I will say though that if you look at his whole body of work, he was one of the weaker links on the team this season.

And that would be a typical response from somebody entrenched with their argument... But lets be honest, this offense has absolutely no speed. It has been inconsistent all season long. Partly due to Kap, partly to do with the play calling and lack of balance, and partly because this team is not designed to throw. This coaching staff has not got the RB's involved and everyone automatically points to Kap for that? Gore and Miller were primarily used as extra blockers. Everyone talks about reads and progressions, thats great when you have a little diversity in the passing offense. It was a vanilla pass offense that was called all season. Same drop back's, the same plays, the same sets, it was either 3 yards and a cloud of dust, or drop back and look for one of the slow WR's or VD to get open. No screen passes, very rarely did we see a slant, a swing pass, a designed play o get a RB involved. I'm sure you can point out times that it did happen, but it was never a consistent effort from the coaching staff to put an emphasis on it. Here you have a QB with very little starting experience under his belt running an offense built to run the football, yet the coaching staff does very little to take any pressure off the QB by mixing things up? And at the end of the day, everyone piles it on because he ultimately has a season that didn't meet everyones lofty expectations...

 

[purguy12]

Look at the weapons that Rogers, Payton or Brees has, way different then what the 49ers have. Payton has the most weapons I ever saw a QB have this year.

Kap has VD who is up and down, Boldin who is slow and old, and Crabtree who just came back from an injury who wasn't even 100% healthy yet. Kap doesn't have the weapons or speed as these other QBs have. Lets be fair when we judge.

Seattle won because of Lynch and their Defense. Wilson hasn't done anything since like week 12. If Gore had a good game 49ers would won this game with easily. Seattle WRs as a group or better then what we have. Maybe next year with a healthy Crabtree, Boldin and improved Patton plus who ever we draft we can give Kap the WRs that can help him.

 

[whysies]

I'm talking about the shit Kap does. Crabtree's absense doesn't force him to not look for his second option. The fact that Vernon Davis is inconsistent doesn't mean he should continually take delay of game penalties/blow timeouts/run out of bounds when he shouldn't/stay in bounds when he should/run out of the pocket when he sees a ghost.

Christ, are we always going to have to make excuses for our QB? I guess the ghost of Alex Smith really will haunt us forever.

 

[-AC-]

I'm talking about the shit Kap does. Crabtree's absense doesn't force him to not look for his second option. The fact that Vernon Davis is inconsistent doesn't mean he should continually take delay of game penalties/blow timeouts/run out of bounds when he shouldn't/stay in bounds when he should/run out of the pocket when he sees a ghost.

Christ, are we always going to have to make excuses for our QB? I guess the ghost of Alex Smith really will haunt us forever.

The delay of game penalties go back to Alex Smith... That is on Roman for calling in three different plays for each snap! The QB has to wait for the three plays to come in, then he has to huddle everyone up and relay the three plays, then he has to hit the LOS and dissect the defense and figure out which of the three plays works the best... How long do you think all that takes for a QB with very little starting experience? Just another example of the coaching staff not helping things out... SMH

 

[-AC-]

Look at Greg Romans resume-

1995–2001 Carolina Panthers
(offensive line assistant)

2002–2005 Houston Texans
(tight ends/quarterbacks coach)

2006–2007 Baltimore Ravens
(offensive line assistant)

2008 Holy Spirit High School
(offensive coordinator)

2009–2010 Stanford
(offensive coordinator)

2011–present San Francisco 49ers
(offensive coordinator)


Aside from having the fortune of coaching Andrew Luck in COLLEGE, is there anything else Greg Roman has done to excite anyone or show that he is capable of handling a professional offense and putting together a remarkable passing attack? Hell, even when he was at Stanford people wanted to see him open it up more considering they had the best QB in all of college football. But he rarely did...