Cleveland Browns Ongoing Thread

[Across The Field]

Fair assessment. Shall we talk about Corbett and Chad Thomas as of now? shall we talk about Dorsey releasing a productive Nassib to keep Thomas?

All FOs make good picks and bad ones. Coleman pick was a disaster and of course meant they were not taking Michael Thomas....who pretty much the entire league passed on.

Corbett is an unknown but had a 2nd round grade, so it's fair to think he's going to be at least a decent player, if not more.

Nassib was nothing until year 3 and it was with a different team. Maybe we give Thomas a chance to get on the field?

 

[Across The Field]

Dorsey has turned this into a 2 year rebuild and like I have acknowledged Sashi has helped bc of the cap space and picks. You don't win bc of CAP SPACE AND PICKS. You cleared aren't grasping that, you don't win games bc you have cap space and picks. Dorsey, with his drafting skills, has definitely made Sashi look better than he was.

Bottomline.

This sums it up. Without the Browns hiring Dorsey, who actually is building the team, nothing Sashi did was worth a damn. We've seen GMs trade down and accumulate picks and cap space and it's not worked. It's happened numerous places.

 

[Across The Field]

with no cap space and extra picks likely there is no Landry, OBJ, ward, Chubb, etc.

Bottom line.

The thing you are failing to understand is that what Sashi did wasn't special or unique. Many teams have done this before, including Cleveland not long ago. The real savvy comes in using the capital you have wisely to build a contender. That is what Dorsey is doing.

 

[Across The Field]

Garrett is a star. Looks like Dorsey has taken 2 stars with us in Baker and Ward. Sashi took 1. Dorsey also had 2 picks in top 5. Sashi had 1. I think Chubb might be a star, but also think Ogunjobi has a chance.

Also a fact Dorsey had 20+ years experience. Sashi had none. Did pretty good for a guy with so little experience in the role. Don't think so? How did Belichick, Ozzie, Pioli, Savage, etc do early in their careers here?

You accuse me of propping up Dorsey's guys yet you're here talking about a guy who was rated as the 88th best interior DLman last year as a potential star on the same level of Nick Chubb, who was PFF's #1 RB in 2018.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Sashi trading out of Wentz and Watson is pretty awful really. The fact it worked because another GM found a QB isn't a credit to Sashi

If not for Injuries Watson and Wentz are slam dunks at the QB position and the Browns passed on both. And one he traded down to add Corey flipping Coleman.

The list of players Sashi drafted in 16 is awful from that trade. He drafted two QBs from that deal and they both suck.

Dorsey salvaged that deal by nailing the Ward pick, trading Kizer for Randall, being part of salvaging Peppers to move him as part of a deal for OBJ.

No chance Sashi does anything but possibly take Ward and I doubt highly that happens.

Again he passed on two possibly franchise changing QBs in consecutive drafts to follow up with Corey Coleman and Jabril Peppers.

 

[Shanemansj13]

with no cap space and extra picks likely there is no Landry, OBJ, ward, Chubb, etc.

Bottom line.

A ton of GM's make those moves, it doesn't matter if you don't make the right picks. Going by past experiences, Sashi wouldn't have picked Mayfield and Ward or he would have traded down again. Who knows if we have Chubb too. I just don't get the argument that if a GM trades for picks than he gets credit for bold picks in the draft and getting a possible future star at QB, let alone other positions. The argument just doesn't make sense. Sashi traded up and down but while doing so he failed to draft Wentz, Mahomes and Goff. So I mean he had opportunities but from what we saw from Sashi he couldn't make the picks when it counted so he traded. That is a fair assessment considering all the opporutunities he had to draft a franchise QB. The main goal was to draft a QB and he failed, Dorsey didn't. None of this rebuild is possible if Dorsey doesn't take Mayfield #1 (wasn't a pick Sashi traded for too).

 

[Shanemansj13]

Sashi trading out of Wentz and Watson is pretty awful really. The fact it worked because another GM found a QB isn't a credit to Sashi

If not for Injuries Watson and Wentz are slam dunks at the QB position and the Browns passed on both. And one he traded down to add Corey flipping Coleman.

The list of players Sashi drafted in 16 is awful from that trade. He drafted two QBs from that deal and they both suck.

Dorsey salvaged that deal by nailing the Ward pick, trading Kizer for Randall, being part of salvaging Peppers to move him as part of a deal for OBJ.

No chance Sashi does anything but possibly take Ward and I doubt highly that happens.

Again he passed on two possibly franchise changing QBs in consecutive drafts to follow up with Corey Coleman and Jabril Peppers.

Exactly! Plain and simple, he wasn't good when it came to the draft and actually making picks. Not to mention, the future possible star QB Mayfield at #1 when most experts didn't have Mayfield in their top 3 QB's let alone their top 10 in the 2018 Draft.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

How does anyone draft Peppers and him be played at free safety?

Like how in the actual fuck did no one challenge playing a guy who was a glorified linebacker in college at free safety

 

[dtgold88]

You question was if I liked Baker and Garrett. That question is absolutely retarded and everyone but you knows it.

...did you miss the part where I said Dorsey actually brought in good coaches who knew how to properly utilize the OL? How did you miss that?

Retarded is not realizing if they do the usual and win 3-6 games there is no Garrett nor Manziel.

 

[dtgold88]

Dorsey has turned this into a 2 year rebuild and like I have acknowledged Sashi has helped bc of the cap space and picks. You don't win bc of CAP SPACE AND PICKS. You cleared aren't grasping that, you don't win games bc you have cap space and picks. Dorsey, with his drafting skills, has definitely made Sashi look better than he was.

Bottomline.

Oh my.....at the point Dorsey took over there were 2 years left from the 4 year rebuild.

Please don't ever change. You are priceless.

Let me try and explain this to you like I did for my kids when they didn't like mom screaming at them. @Across The Field can listen in too.

If they don't want her to scream, don't do things to make her scream. Cause and effect. without the cause there is no effect.

How does this relate to the Browns? A team needs extra picks and cap room to hit on the extra picks and cap room. Acquiring the picks/clearing the cap space is the cause. Hitting on them is the effect. without the cause there is no effect.

Bottomline

 

[dtgold88]

You question was if I liked Baker and Garrett. That question is absolutely retarded and everyone but you knows it.

...did you miss the part where I said Dorsey actually brought in good coaches who knew how to properly utilize the OL? How did you miss that?

Not knowing I asked the question because without the high picks you don't have them was what was retarded...if anything.

Yeah.....Haley. Great coach.

 

[dtgold88]

Sashi trading out of Wentz and Watson is pretty awful really. The fact it worked because another GM found a QB isn't a credit to Sashi

If not for Injuries Watson and Wentz are slam dunks at the QB position and the Browns passed on both. And one he traded down to add Corey flipping Coleman.

The list of players Sashi drafted in 16 is awful from that trade. He drafted two QBs from that deal and they both suck.

Dorsey salvaged that deal by nailing the Ward pick, trading Kizer for Randall, being part of salvaging Peppers to move him as part of a deal for OBJ.

No chance Sashi does anything but possibly take Ward and I doubt highly that happens.

Again he passed on two possibly franchise changing QBs in consecutive drafts to follow up with Corey Coleman and Jabril Peppers.

A team who needs a ton of pieces not taking an injured FCS QB was awful? Passing on another injured QB the next year to get their QB in a QB heavy draft the following year was awful? And, yes, it worked. Doesn't matter who made the pick, but props to Dorsey for making it.

weird guys who were hurt in college again got hurt in the pros. That never happens, right?

Here's a flash....all teams who take QBs in rounds 2 and 3 find guys who suck. He took his shot with extra picks...one was on a guy once thought to be the top pick in the draft....and he was able to be moved for a former 1st rounder.

dorsey doesn't get to make the Ward pick if not for the deal...you can read the cause and effect explanation in a previous post, too. It should be helpful.

yeah...that's what he did. He traded watson and Wentz for Peppers and Coleman. I hate throwiung around the term, but if anything is retarded.......

 

[dtgold88]

Corbett is an unknown but had a 2nd round grade, so it's fair to think he's going to be at least a decent player, if not more.

Nassib was nothing until year 3 and it was with a different team. Maybe we give Thomas a chance to get on the field?

Here comes the excuse train again. Corey Coleman had a first round grade. Doesn't mean a whole lot, does it?

Nassib was not "nothing" He was what you hope most midround picks are. solid backups.

Try and read this a few times as it seems you are confused by objectivity......I happen to agree it's too early to tell on Thomas and especially Corbett. I heard a draft guy before last season say he gave Corbett a 1st round grade and he could play a decade on the interior line.

But if Sashi had made that pick you wouldn't be making the same excuses and allowing them to wait and see.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

A team who needs a ton of pieces not taking an injured FCS QB was awful? Passing on another injured QB the next year to get their QB in a QB heavy draft the following year was awful? And, yes, it worked. Doesn't matter who made the pick, but props to Dorsey for making it.

weird guys who were hurt in college again got hurt in the pros. That never happens, right?

Here's a flash....all teams who take QBs in rounds 2 and 3 find guys who suck. He took his shot with extra picks...one was on a guy once thought to be the top pick in the draft....and he was able to be moved for a former 1st rounder.

dorsey doesn't get to make the Ward pick if not for the deal...you can read the cause and effect explanation in a previous post, too. It should be helpful.

yeah...that's what he did. He traded watson and Wentz for Peppers and Coleman. I hate throwiung around the term, but if anything is retarded.......

Come on DT they weren't injured on draft day

They have been franchise QBs when healthy

And no my point is they could have not once but twice had their guy and the follow up pick was a bust and a guy they played out of position. Bad teams cannot afford that.

 

[dtgold88]

This sums it up. Without the Browns hiring Dorsey, who actually is building the team, nothing Sashi did was worth a damn. We've seen GMs trade down and accumulate picks and cap space and it's not worked. It's happened numerous places.

Yeah....Sashi was supposed to complete his 4 year rebuild in 2 years. Let me guess.....you were among the many who said farmer set them back 5 years then cried it wasn't fixed in 2.

 

[dtgold88]

The thing you are failing to understand is that what Sashi did wasn't special or unique. Many teams have done this before, including Cleveland not long ago. The real savvy comes in using the capital you have wisely to build a contender. That is what Dorsey is doing.

when did Cleveland do this "not long ago"? Not just trading down, but also GUTTING the team and clearing as much space as possible. No more bringing in the Donte whitners of the world to win an extra 1-3 meaningless games.

had they done it correctly a while ago they could have had the #1 pick and taken Luck. You were probably happy they won a couple meaningless games and couldn't get him?

 

[dtgold88]

You accuse me of propping up Dorsey's guys yet you're here talking about a guy who was rated as the 88th best interior DLman last year as a potential star on the same level of Nick Chubb, who was PFF's #1 RB in 2018.

Pretty sure most think of Ogunjobi as at the very least a stud. You don't?

 

[dtgold88]

A ton of GM's make those moves, it doesn't matter if you don't make the right picks. Going by past experiences, Sashi wouldn't have picked Mayfield and Ward or he would have traded down again. Who knows if we have Chubb too. I just don't get the argument that if a GM trades for picks than he gets credit for bold picks in the draft and getting a possible future star at QB, let alone other positions. The argument just doesn't make sense. Sashi traded up and down but while doing so he failed to draft Wentz, Mahomes and Goff. So I mean he had opportunities but from what we saw from Sashi he couldn't make the picks when it counted so he traded. That is a fair assessment considering all the opporutunities he had to draft a franchise QB. The main goal was to draft a QB and he failed, Dorsey didn't. None of this rebuild is possible if Dorsey doesn't take Mayfield #1 (wasn't a pick Sashi traded for too).

Now you are just spewing nonsense. Bake is an analytics' wet dream. Ton of wins and starts in college, high completion %, tremendous TD/INT ratio. I stopped reading after you made that foolish comment as I'm sure there was too much irrational and probably simple mistakes to follow.

 

[dtgold88]

Exactly! Plain and simple, he wasn't good when it came to the draft and actually making picks. Not to mention, the future possible star QB Mayfield at #1 when most experts didn't have Mayfield in their top 3 QB's let alone their top 10 in the 2018 Draft.

Dorsey's first draft he took 2 NFL caliber players. One a stud the other OK...and a bust at #1.

 

[dtgold88]

How does anyone draft Peppers and him be played at free safety?

Like how in the actual fuck did no one challenge playing a guy who was a glorified linebacker in college at free safety

Let me see if I have this straight....now you are saying Sashi Brown needed to go to a guy who had been a DC for, what, 20 years, and tell him what to do? Never mind when Peppers was played correctly last season he played well.

Hilarious you blame the guy who picked him and not the guy who played him out of position. That cannot be topped.

If someone bought a perfect steak and another guy burnt it, you'd blame the guy who bought the steak?