Bird V Lebron @ age 30

[Clayton]

Again with this win share bullshit. It is the most meaningless stat out there. Reggie Miller has more win shares than Bird, Magic, Kobe, Hakeem and Jerry West - is he a better player than any of them?

Not exactly what I'm saying, though. Career win shares and number of seasons with awesome win shares is actually quite different.

As far as Magic is concerned, you have to give him a pass in terms of career length.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Not exactly what I'm saying, though. Career win shares and number of seasons with awesome win shares is actually quite different.

As far as Magic is concerned, you have to give him a pass in terms of career length.

I'm just saying the whole "Win Share" argument is pointless as it's probably the most useless stat out there - whether you're determining how good a player is or what he has won.

Example: Karl Malone ranked #3 - no NBA championships, John Stockton #5 - no NBA championships, Kevin Garnett #8 - one championship, Bill Russell #17 - 11 Championships

Is Stockton a better, or even more successful player than Russell was?

 

[Clayton]

I'm just saying the whole "Win Share" argument is pointless as it's probably the most useless stat out there - whether you're determining how good a player is or what he has won.

Example: Karl Malone ranked #3 - no NBA championships, John Stockton #5 - no NBA championships, Kevin Garnett #8 - one championship, Bill Russell #17 - 11 Championships

Is Stockton a better, or even more successful player than Russell was?

I could use the eyeball test. Eyeball test tells me that Lebron would beat Bird head to head.

Teams win championships. Kobe didn't win much without a big man and I think it would be foolish to criticize Kobe.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Eyeball test tells me that Lebron would beat Bird head to head.

In what? PPG? Rebounds? FG% or total championships? Because at at 30/31 Bird has lebron beat at all those categories.

 

[Clayton]

In what? PPG? Rebounds? FG% or total championships? Because at at 30/31 Bird has lebron beat at all those categories.

Basketball as a career. Lebron has fallen off. He was off last year even though everyone was praising his run to the Finals.

I have no horse in this race. I just know what I've seen. Honestly if you were building a team today you'd take a prime Bird at 3 and want him to play with prime Lebron at the 4 so its all a bit silly to compare the two.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Basketball as a career. Lebron has fallen off. He was off last year even though everyone was praising his run to the Finals.

I have no horse in this race. I just know what I've seen. Honestly if you were building a team today you'd take a prime Bird at 3 and want him to play with prime Lebron at the 4 so its all a bit silly to compare the two.

Bird has had a far better career. In both stats and championships. Against better opposition too.

And to be honest if I were to build a team today, lebron wouldn't even make the reserves.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Again with this win share bullshit. It is the most meaningless stat out there. Reggie Miller has more win shares than Bird, Magic, Kobe, Hakeem and Jerry West - is he a better player than any of them?

A better 3 point shooter

 

[Shanemansj13]

I'm just saying the whole "Win Share" argument is pointless as it's probably the most useless stat out there - whether you're determining how good a player is or what he has won.

Example: Karl Malone ranked #3 - no NBA championships, John Stockton #5 - no NBA championships, Kevin Garnett #8 - one championship, Bill Russell #17 - 11 Championships

Is Stockton a better, or even more successful player than Russell was?

I didn't know championship where involved in this conversation, it is merely stats, at least by what the OP posted. So "Win Shares" could be involved in a stat alone argument

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

I didn't know championship where involved in this conversation, it is merely stats, at least by what the OP posted. So "Win Shares" could be involved in a stat alone argument

Read my other posts. Win shares are a useless stat when comparing players by their overall greatness or by their ability to win championships.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

A better 3 point shooter

He must be a better overall player then

 

[Clayton]

Bird has had a far better career. In both stats and championships. Against better opposition too.

Better opposition and better teammates. Bird's Celtics teams totally own a lot of the bad teams Lebron has had to play on.

Lebron got to the line 3.4 more times a game. Had the same FG%. Scored 3 more points a game. .6 fewer fouls a game.

Bird got a lot more rebounds. Made his FT attempts more. Better distance shooter..Lebron was really only good at it for a couple of years.

Really similar stats but a different impact on the game.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Better opposition and better teammates. Bird's Celtics teams totally own a lot of the bad teams Lebron has had to play on.

Really?!? Lebron pretty much hand picked the last two teams he was on. He had two all star players in Miami and still was only able to win half the finals he was in.

 

[Clayton]

Really?!? Lebron pretty much hand picked the last two teams he was on. He had two all star players in Miami and still was only able to win half the finals he was in.

I feel like I'm talking to a wall.

The next generation is going to come in and praise Lebron like you praise you older players. Thats how this works. Lebron has the stats and career of an all-time player.

 

[Shanemansj13]

He must be a better overall player then

I was telling the facts, you can think whatever you want. The guy that wouldn't take Lebron as a reserve...good thing nobody listens to you

 

[Shanemansj13]

I feel like I'm talking to a wall.

The next generation is going to come in and praise Lebron like you praise you older players. Thats how this works. Lebron has the stats and career of an all-time player.

The further you get the worse it gets. Good luck

 

[Shanemansj13]

Really?!? Lebron pretty much hand picked the last two teams he was on. He had two all star players in Miami and still was only able to win half the finals he was in.

Are you really going to compare Lebron's teams to the Boston teams with like 5 or 6 HOF's Bird played with...even you aren't that dumb

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

I was telling the facts, you can think whatever you want. The guy that wouldn't take Lebron as a reserve...good thing nobody listens to you

In the GOAT team you would actually have lebron in it?!?

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Are you really going to compare Lebron's teams to the Boston teams with like 5 or 6 HOF's Bird played with...even you aren't that dumb

Lets the grown ups talk, son!

Lebron played with one of the best SG and PF in the league at the time. Whether or not they are HOFers doesn't matter.

 

[trojanfan12]

@Lebroniacs trying desperately to find any former great they can claim Lebron is better than......and failing.

Next up...Cazzie Russell.

 

[Robotech]

LeBron is a very hateable guy, but he was hands down the best player in the league for about a decade. I think that he's already surpassed Bird, but if they are tied right now, LeBron will eventually pass him due because he is more durable than Bird was.