Asterisk!?

[catlanta33]

LOL. This thread specifically to piss off both the Raptors and Warriors fans. OP is a legend.

He's putting in some work.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

That's about the best you can hope for as depth when you have 4 max types already on the roster, along with a super sub like Iggy and a bonus, rehabbing 5th previous max type.

Yes let us weep for the team with six multiple time all Stars

Again I get Klays injury was fluky but that hammy more a result of playing so many games over half a decade. Same with KD.

Similar to how you saw Showtime come up lame with hammy injuries in 89.

It's a grind playing 100 games a year for that long. Yet another reason Lebron is such a freak.

 

[RP-29]

My position here really has almost nothing to do with the Raptors by themselves. It's not a comment on or critique of them specifically beyond the belief that Toronto is not as good as the best team in basketball: a healthy GS squad.

Yeah, I got ya. GS was the most talented team and if all things were status quo GS probably wins the title 7/10 times. This year, status quo didn't happen; doesn't mean we need stamp asterisks, just chalk it up as status quo didn't happen.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Of course.

I am not pretending that. A lot more talent surrounding Steph.

My biggest point in the 2015/2016 debates is that the value of the surrounding pieces in Cleveland cannot be compared to the value of the pieces in GS because they are relied upon much differently.

LeBron was a transcendent player capable of carrying a franchise on his back to win playoff series against good, not great teams. Kyrie and Love clearly made them better. But their absence is not directly comparable to say Klay Thompson in the Warrior system.

While Kyrie might be the better player, (he is not IMO, but a very reasonable position that many will take) his value to the Cavs never approached Klay's value or even Dray's value to GS. Because they were always dependent on all 3 of those guys playing at a high level to execute their system.

That is my point.

Pre KD, The Warriors were always better positioned to survive a Curry injury than the Cavs were to survive a LeBron injury. But, the Cavs were much better positioned to survive an injury to Kyrie or Love than the Warriors were to survive injury to Klay or Dray.

The Warrior 3 was dependent on each other while Cleveland was dependent on LeBron with some really nice pieces around him.

Can't disagree, some good points. But this is why we can't put Curry in a top tier. While he is still a superstar, there are guys that can put their entire team and roster on their backs while others can't (not many). Just saying, if people didn't already know, which I'm sure you do lol

 

[Inquisitor95]

Asterisks are for sore losers.

 

[calsnowskier]

Availability is the most important ability.

The Raptors won the championship. They were a beast of a team. Period.

Any mention of injuries is either griping or gloating.

The Raptors won. Nothing more needs to be said.

 

[Judge Fudge]

Might as well enjoy the roundball victory; Canadian teams won't be kissing the true Holy Grail anytime soon.

We have 3 teams that are nipping close and one team that is moving in the right direction. We might be closer than you think

 

[Gman]

Availability is the most important ability.

The Raptors won the championship. They were a beast of a team. Period.

Any mention of injuries is either griping or gloating.

The Raptors won. Nothing more needs to be said.

IMO, you (along with a great many people in this thread) are merely reflecting a "good sportsmanship" type attitude.

That's laudable, and all that. But listen:

We're not shaking hands with the other team after the game here. This thread is just about talking straight... being real.

A great number of y'all are also saying lines like, "Yeah, GS would have won the series if they were healthy but..."

I read that as a concession that my overall point is true: Injuries to two HOF, in-their-prime stars had a huge effect on this series and ended up being the deciding factor. Asterisk!

 

[msgkings322]

IMO, you (along with a great many people in this thread) are merely reflecting a "good sportsmanship" type attitude.

That's laudable, and all that. But listen:

We're not shaking hands with the other team after the game here. This thread is just about talking straight... being real.

A great number of y'all are also saying lines like, "Yeah, GS would have won the series if they were healthy but..."

I read that as a concession that my overall point is true: Injuries to two HOF, in-their-prime stars had a huge effect on this series and ended up being the deciding factor. Asterisk!

All of what you say is true but there's no such thing as an 'asterisk'. It doesn't appear in any record of who won. Injuries matter most years, including this one. The Toronto Raptors are world champs. Both are simple facts, no asterisks needed.

 

[handicappers]

Why do only certain stupid threads get sent to Fouled Out? Has Lynda not complained yet?

 

[Gman]

All of what you say is true but there's no such thing as an 'asterisk'. It doesn't appear in any record of who won. Injuries matter most years, including this one. The Toronto Raptors are world champs. Both are simple facts, no asterisks needed.

Do you love your significant other?

How could you prove that fact to anyone else?

Is love tangible? Can you take it out and present it for physical inspection? Can you analyze it under a mircoscope, or detect it with the fanciest 21st century equipment?

Such is the asterisk!

 

[tlance]

Can't disagree, some good points. But this is why we can't put Curry in a top tier. While he is still a superstar, there are guys that can put their entire team and roster on their backs while others can't (not many). Just saying, if people didn't already know, which I'm sure you do lol

Totally agree.

The top tier is a pretty lonely group.

Used to be LeBron. Honestly don't think he is even there anymore. Could get back next year though.

Right now?

Kawhi for sure. Giannis appears heading that way, but he isn't quite there yet. KD was there, but can't bet on him getting all the way back.

I think it is just Kawhi with the following guys having a shot to join next year:

Giannis
Anthony Davis
LeBron
maybe Embiid

Maybe 1 or 2 of these guys get there, maybe none.

 

[RP-29]

We have 3 teams that are nipping close and one team that is moving in the right direction. We might be closer than you think

Yup, just throwing a little salt - and gonna keep throwing until I can't throw anymore.

 

[Robotech]

Do you love your significant other?

How could you prove that fact to anyone else?

Is love tangible? Can you take it out and present it for physical inspection? Can you analyze it under a mircoscope, or detect it with the fanciest 21st century equipment?

Such is the asterisk!

Man, you are getting philosophical here. LOL.

 

[Robotech]

Totally agree.

The top tier is a pretty lonely group.

Used to be LeBron. Honestly don't think he is even there anymore. Could get back next year though.

Right now?

Kawhi for sure. Giannis appears heading that way, but he isn't quite there yet. KD was there, but can't bet on him getting all the way back.

I think it is just Kawhi with the following guys having a shot to join next year:

Giannis
Anthony Davis
LeBron
maybe Embiid

Maybe 1 or 2 of these guys get there, maybe none.

I blame Sonya Curry. LOL. If she had better height genes and Steph were 6'6", he would be a top 10 player of all time.

 

[Black Adam]

why are Cabs fans try to

Man, you are getting philosophical here. LOL.

CLEARLY he's smoking the best this morning...

 

[msgkings322]

I blame Sonya Curry. LOL. If she had better height genes and Steph were 6'6", he would be a top 10 player of all time.

Does that taller guy work as hard to develop his handle and greatest ever shot?

 

[Gman]

Man, you are getting philosophical here. LOL.

You caught me... that was my college degree.

I do believe I cribbed that spiel (with only slight alteration) from Plato or Descartes or someone like that.

 

[Iggloo]

Yeah, yeah, yeah... injuries are a part of sports, injuries happen, injuries always play a role.

These points are not in dispute.

The difference in this case is degree. We're talking 2 HOF players here that are both well within their primes.

That doesn't happen all the time. That isn't just another thing.

Should have asterisks of varying sizes on every championship then, to indicate the degree to which they were not wholly earned according to some?

 

[Gman]

Should have asterisks of varying sizes on every championship then, to indicate the degree to which they were not wholly earned according to some?

Or... we could just use the term judiciously... only when the fact of it is abundantly clear.