2019 Offseason Thread

[TurnUpTheHeat]

In fairness he makes it easy to kick his ass. He at least admits he bases his comments on poster and not post though....so he's got that going for him.

Fuck off with that deflection.
At one point or another everyone here has disagreed with each other.
Right @Wamu ?

You just are a different breed.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

not only that, but if the Cavs had the 1st pick or the 8th pick, they were always going to execute a trade for Love.

No other team was going to give up substantial assets to get Love when he already said he would not sign an extension and would become a free agent.

The Cavs took a measured gamble and of course won the gamble because he did resign- but there were plenty of people out there that thought the Cavs were crazy for trading the #1 pick for a guy that could very well walk in a year.

their were only 2 other teams that were even mildly in the bidding--- the Warriors - who were refusing to give up Thompson---- and the Lakers- who had no assets that a team would want--- certainly none as good as a solid lotto pick- whether it be #1 or #8.

Perfect!
You two can try to convince each other of whatever you want.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

You made the comment you said was fact. You have not provided something to factually prove it.

I'd give that a D for effort.

Same D tattooed on your forehead?
Or the one you saved as best grade on report card?

 

[WiggyRuss]

@CitySushi

just saw an interesting argument.

in order to get Russell, the Warriors of courses had to deal Iguadala, give Memphis a lightly protected first round pick AND send a first round pick to the Nets.

I read an article that thought the Warriors instead could have gotten significantly more for Iguadala's expiring contract (which may be worth a late first on its own), and the 2 first round picks they spent to get Russell--- then just Russell on his own.

I had not thought of it that way because of all the moves at the time kind of obscured the overall deal.

but essentially thats what it was---- 2 first round picks and Iguadala for Russell. In that context, do you like the move? If they move Russell- do you think they can get equal value back compared to what they already gave to get him?

 

[dtgold88]

No
Its just you,
You make @WiggyRuss seem semi normal.

We both have an easy time kicking your ass so are alike in that sense....or sit back and watch you kick your own ass.

 

[Wamu]

Fuck off with that deflection.
At one point or another everyone here has disagreed with each other.
Right @Wamu ?

You just are a different breed.

Yes sir.

 

[dtgold88]

Same D tattooed on your forehead?
Or the one you saved as best grade on report card?

Wasting your time.....should be facthunting.

No luck yet? maybe wamu and Shaqdaddy will help you?

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

We both have an easy time kicking your ass so are alike in that sense....or sit back and watch you kick your own ass.

Nice.
You can slap each others bare asses as you praise each other!

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

@WiggyRuss
Why’s bet still pending?
Don’t pussy out, please.

 

[WiggyRuss]

@WiggyRuss
Why’s bet still pending?
Don’t pussy out, please.

i didnt see - repost it-- i keep going in and out. Have al ot going on

 

[WiggyRuss]

Wasting your time.....should be facthunting.

No luck yet? maybe wamu and Shaqdaddy will help you?

lol....good luck there....thats like the blind leading the blind.......or the blind leading the deaf, dumb, blind and mute....lol

 

[WiggyRuss]

We both have an easy time kicking your ass so are alike in that sense....or sit back and watch you kick your own ass.

I mean its really easy. He doesnt watch or pay attention to anything except the Heat on the floor. He has no concept of the CBA, doesnt pay attention to other teams, cant really gauge trade value. Its no wonder he really has no clue how bad Riley has been. What does he have to compare it too? he is in a vacuum basically.

 

[dtgold88]

@WiggyRuss
Why’s bet still pending?
Don’t pussy out, please.

you mean like you did?

you claim I didn't reply to question
I Said let's bet on if I did
you back down

It's another transitive property

TurnUp says if you back down from betting on your own comments/opinions you are a pussy
TurnUp backs down from his own comment

So.........

 

[WiggyRuss]

@CitySushi

just saw an interesting argument.

in order to get Russell, the Warriors of courses had to deal Iguadala, give Memphis a lightly protected first round pick AND send a first round pick to the Nets.

I read an article that thought the Warriors instead could have gotten significantly more for Iguadala's expiring contract (which may be worth a late first on its own), and the 2 first round picks they spent to get Russell--- then just Russell on his own.

I had not thought of it that way because of all the moves at the time kind of obscured the overall deal.

but essentially thats what it was---- 2 first round picks and Iguadala for Russell. In that context, do you like the move? If they move Russell- do you think they can get equal value back compared to what they already gave to get him?

anyone else that actually talks basketball have any thoughts on this?

Russell was a free agent, but because the Warriors did not have any cap room, they basically gave up 2 first rounders and Iguadala for the right to give Deangelo Russell a 4 year $117 million dollar contract.

Paying Russell damn near $30 million a year, on its own, seems like an overpay-- which is pretty much to be expected in free agency--- but committing about a 1/4 of your cap room to Deanglo Russell seems like a risk.

When you add in the price of 2 first round picks and losing Iguadala and his expiring contract- which might be spun for a late first rounder, or at least a pair of 2nd rounders, on its own....seems like a very steep price to pay.

if they trade Russell will they even be able to recoup what they spent in draft capital/players to get him? That is certainly debatable.

if they trade him, will they get something better than the equivalent of 2 first rounders and 2 second rounders and the corresponding cap flexibility.

 

[tlance]

Cavs first 6 years post LeBron will def. be better than the Heats---- but it mostly comes down to the fact that Riley was too old, impatient and butt-hurt by LeBron leaving to take a step back and do a proper rebuild. That ego is fucking him.

The Heat have averaged 41.8 wins over the last 5 years and will almost surely be better than that in year 6.

That is obviously not great.

But Cleveland won 19 games last year. They will be better this year, but probably won’t be sniffing 40 wins. Most rebuild plans tend to top out in the 45-50 win range and I see no reason to project Cleveland will be better than that any time in the next 6 years.

So what is your claim based on?

Maybe Cleveland’s year 6 will have more wins than Miami’s. But that is a long ways out. And the harsh reality is that Cleveland is unlikely to average 42+ wins a year over the first 6 post LeBron given their start. To accomplish that, they would have to average 46.6 wins over the next 5. Which is very difficult for a rebuilding team in a non-destination market.

If they get 35 wins this season, they would need to average 49.5 over the last 4. Since their Vegas projection is only 24.5, very few expect them to be a 35 win team.

In other words, your guarantee is garbage.

@TurnUpTheHeat

You need to make a bet here.

 

[dtgold88]

anyone else that actually talks basketball have any thoughts on this?

Russell was a free agent, but because the Warriors did not have any cap room, they basically gave up 2 first rounders and Iguadala for the right to give Deangelo Russell a 4 year $117 million dollar contract.

Paying Russell damn near $30 million a year, on its own, seems like an overpay-- which is pretty much to be expected in free agency--- but committing about a 1/4 of your cap room to Deanglo Russell seems like a risk.

When you add in the price of 2 first round picks and losing Iguadala and his expiring contract- which might be spun for a late first rounder, or at least a pair of 2nd rounders, on its own....seems like a very steep price to pay.

if they trade Russell will they even be able to recoup what they spent in draft capital/players to get him? That is certainly debatable.

if they trade him, will they get something better than the equivalent of 2 first rounders and 2 second rounders and the corresponding cap flexibility.

I guess I get it if this is how it went down. Not sure they could get a better player than DLo and they probably figure only so much more time to try to win a title.

does the cap flexibility even matter as with Curry, Klay and Green taking up most of the cap not much else they can do.

 

[tlance]

I wouldn't rule them out to at least contend in the West, but do agree once this run is over possible they're no more likely than the cavs to contend again.

I disagree with that.

The Warriors have a larger market and a more temperate climate. That is a huge advantage in recruiting players.

 

[dtgold88]

The Heat have averaged 41.8 wins over the last 5 years and will almost surely be better than that in year 6.

That is obviously not great.

But Cleveland won 19 games last year. They will be better this year, but probably won’t be sniffing 40 wins. Most rebuild plans tend to top out in the 45-50 win range and I see no reason to project Cleveland will be better than that any time in the next 6 years.

So what is your claim based on?

Maybe Cleveland’s year 6 will have more wins than Miami’s. But that is a long ways out. And the harsh reality is that Cleveland is unlikely to average 42+ wins a year over the first 6 post LeBron given their start. To accomplish that, they would have to average 46.6 wins over the next 5. Which is very difficult for a rebuilding team in a non-destination market.

If they get 35 wins this season, they would need to average 49.5 over the last 4. Since their Vegas projection is only 24.5, very few expect them to be a 35 win team.

In other words, your guarantee is garbage.

@TurnUpTheHeat

You need to make a bet here.

I agree with you tlance if win total is the determining factor here. But knowing the cavs planned to tank at least 2 seasons doesn't seem wiggy would think Cavs would win more game over that time. Maybe he did, though

To me would think it's more once the tank is over can they win more or how about can the Cavs be where the Heat is after each had 6 years post Lebron? or 5 years? I would take the Cavs in that bet. Meaning will the Cavs win more games in the 22-23 or 23-24 season than Miami won after last season or the next one.

Where would you lean on that?

 

[CitySushi]

@CitySushi

just saw an interesting argument.

in order to get Russell, the Warriors of courses had to deal Iguadala, give Memphis a lightly protected first round pick AND send a first round pick to the Nets.

I read an article that thought the Warriors instead could have gotten significantly more for Iguadala's expiring contract (which may be worth a late first on its own), and the 2 first round picks they spent to get Russell--- then just Russell on his own.

I had not thought of it that way because of all the moves at the time kind of obscured the overall deal.

but essentially thats what it was---- 2 first round picks and Iguadala for Russell. In that context, do you like the move? If they move Russell- do you think they can get equal value back compared to what they already gave to get him?

Yeah it's an interesting argument. I don't believe Iguodala would have commanded that much in terms of return value because the Warriors needed to clear cap space out-right and not take back any salary. Most teams didn't have that kind of space available to just absorb Iguodala(or at least not the teams that actually want him) and would have most likely had to shed a contract back to the Warriors, and then provide them with compensation. So it would have essentially more or less be a trade of Iguodala's expiring for another bad contract and a pick.

Secondly the Nets draft pick is highly protected. I believe it's at least top 20 protected and if not conveyed, it turns into a 2nd round pick.

So essentially it's a lightly protected future first, a second round pick and Iguodala's expiring for D'Angelo Russell. In terms of trade value, I think that's a pretty fair bargain in the open market. If I told you that the Cavs could land a 23 year old all-star (on a long term contract) for a future 1st, 2nd and JR Smith's expiring, would you do it?

So all in all, I don't agree with the article that the Warriors could fetch much more for Iguodala, unless the Warriors were willing to absorb a bad contract in return. That's really the only way the Warriors could have acquired an asset for an expiring contract.

 

[dtgold88]

I disagree with that.

The Warriors have a larger market and a more temperate climate. That is a huge advantage in recruiting players.

I guess, but other than the GS dynasty and the Cavs recent run they have been pretty similar franchises the other 35-40 seasons.