2019 Offseason Thread

[podsox]

I’ll never forget Broussard switching where Lebron was going every day the year of the decision. It was comical

 

[dtgold88]

How does me saying that Riley made mistakes translate to you asking me if I think they’ll contend?

Fact is, Cavs defied the odds, more then once , which equates to luck.

FACT READ BELOW

Just like 2011 when the Cavs vaulted up the draft board from the No. 8 spot, this was unexpected; owner Dan Gilbert didn't even bother attending.

Going in with a 1.7% chance, the Cavs started the night in the ninth position. Fans were waiting for the envelope to be pulled out, expecting the Cavs' logo to be unveiled. Instead, it was the Detroit's. No need to scout Doug McDermott or Aaron Gordon anymore, it's time for the Cavs to think big. They will have their choice - Andrew Wiggins, Joel Embiid or Jabari Parker.

People around the NBA were shocked. ESPN's Bill Simmons was unhappy.

so many mistakes in just a short period of time by you. Dan Gilbert didn't even bother to attend?


what form of deflection will you go with as opposed to simply saying you were wrong?

 

[bksballer89]

Cavs fans (excluding @Shanemansj13 ) obsession with the Heat is weird.

The Heat going to rebuild how they want and vice versa. Heat know people want to play for Miami so once they have money, they can almost always get a meeting with top free agents every year.

They don't play in a shitty place like Cleveland where top free agents would never sign unless they're from there like Lebron so there's no need for Miami to try and rebuild strictly through the draft ever

 

[dtgold88]

they had the best chance in the NBA to win the lottery that year...in fact, i dont know if in the last 20 years anyone has had a better chance to win the lotto than the Cavs did that year. I am pretty sure that is the case.

actually, not sure this is true going by memory. I think they had the second best chance and LAC was last which would be about a 22% chance. Team with highest chance is 25%

 

[dtgold88]

Cavs fans (excluding @Shanemansj13 ) obsession with the Heat is weird.

I think what is weird is making so many mistakes about your own team and another claiming a "win" because an owner didn't attend a lottery that he attended.

 

[WiggyRuss]

You're really overrating a Pacers team who are now without 3 of their top 5 or 6 players from the last 2 seasons.

PG: Brogdon/McConnell/Joseph
SG: Oladipo/Lamb
SF: Warren/McDermott
PF: Turner/Leaf
C: Sabonis/O'Quinn/Bitadze

That team is going to be a monster defensively. Its young, its athletic, it can switch just about anything, it has ball-handlers, shooters. It will be a very fun team to watch when Oladipo gets back. I am not big on taking big men that arent special high in the draft some im not suprised Bitadze fell, but where the Pacers got him was great value. Leaf, a former lotto pick, has had some time to devleop and I think is ready to become a legit stretch 4 off the bench.

Brogdon has just continued to get better and better. McConnell is a very solid player and Joseph remains one of the better backup PGs in the entire league. Lamb is in his prime and is a very solid player.

 

[Heatles84]

In the playoffs? I wont argue a decent chance. So they are what I suggested. A 6-7 seed at best. NBA Purgatory.

Better than being in tank mode for years.

And let the cycle begin.......again.

 

[bksballer89]

When is the last time the cavs got a meeting with a top free agent not named Lebron? Serious question

 

[tlance]

OK, but most said this pointing to Bosh being on the roster up until the end of the most recent season. Bosh has not been on the payroll since the 2016-17 season. How long can we allow The Great Riley to use this as an excuse? This will be year 3 without him and they are still no more than what seems like a middling playoff team with what appears to be no shot to scare anyone in the East.

and this is in a FA hotbed and a stud who wanted to play in Miami.

@WiggyRuss @Heatles84 @TurnUpTheHeat

Can we end this debate already?

It is like the biggest apples to oranges comparison ever.

Teams like the Cavs have to build a core through the draft and invest in future assets before they have any chance of signing/trading for the types of players that can help them compete beyond NBA purgatory.

The Heat do not. The cost of teams like the Heat taking the anti-tank approach is minimal. Because as soon as they clear their books they are threats to reload with big name free agents. The Heat do not have to rely on building through the draft, or “tanking” if you will.

And for every example of a non-destination market to find sustained success like the Warriors and Spurs, guess where their runs started? By building a core of players/tradable assets through the draft.

 

[dtgold88]

I am not most and didn't say what you claimed.



I already answered this as well.



To go after a top FA, you have to have cap space which they have not had except for maybe once or twice since Lebron left.

It does say something that Butler wanted to be traded there and apparently turned down a full max from Philly.

Might have said what I claimed, but you pretty sure you used it as evidence.

Not really

And why don't they have cap space? Because they spend money on middling players to win 35-45 games. Yes, Butler, a young, rich athlete enjoys South Beach. who has said this was not an advangtage....one they have not been able to take full advantage of?

 

[Black Adam]

Better than being in tank mode for years.

And let the cycle begin.......again.

didn't someone say at least GETTING to the playoffs is enjoyable...?

 

[dtgold88]

When is the last time the cavs got a meeting with a top free agent not named Lebron? Serious question

Cannot think of any times.....did you not understand what I meant when I said over and over Cleveland is not somewhere stud FAs want to go?

Miami is.....and to get a guy who wanted to go there they had to trade the guy who probably has their best contract based on value/ability AND a #1 pick.

If there was such a playe who wanted to come here next year the Cavs need only sign him.

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

@Mecca this is the first time I remember you missing most of FA....in all our time on various sports message boards.....I hope all is well with you, my sunshine.

Hawaii > Kawhimare

I knew the Clippers were gonna get left holding their Dicks.

So, I wasn't even on the internet.

He's going to the Lakers.

So, I'm not sure what all this waiting is about.

 

[bksballer89]

@WiggyRuss @Heatles84 @TurnUpTheHeat

Can we end this debate already?

It is like the biggest apples to oranges comparison ever.

Teams like the Cavs have to build a core through the draft and invest in future assets before they have any chance of signing/trading for the types of players that can help them compete beyond NBA purgatory.

The Heat do not. The cost of teams like the Heat taking the anti-tank approach is minimal. Because as soon as they clear their books they are threats to reload with big name free agents. The Heat do not have to rely on building through the draft, or “tanking” if you will.

And for every example of a non-destination market to find sustained success like the Warriors and Spurs, guess where their runs started? By building a core of players/tradable assets through the draft.

Agree 1000%

Sick of cavs fans acting like it is problem with the heat way of rebuilding.

Different situations

 

[trojanfan12]

@WiggyRuss @Heatles84 @TurnUpTheHeat

Can we end this debate already?

It is like the biggest apples to oranges comparison ever.

Teams like the Cavs have to build a core through the draft and invest in future assets before they have any chance of signing/trading for the types of players that can help them compete beyond NBA purgatory.

The Heat do not. The cost of teams like the Heat taking the anti-tank approach is minimal. Because as soon as they clear their books they are threats to reload with big name free agents. The Heat do not have to rely on building through the draft, or “tanking” if you will.

And for every example of a non-destination market to find sustained success like the Warriors and Spurs, guess where their runs started? By building a core of players/tradable assets through the draft.

Was literally about to post the same thing.

Teams in different markets have to take different routes to put together winning teams.

Heck, look at the Lakers. What have they done over the past 5 or so years to attract any top FA's? Yet they got Lebron last off-season, AD basically forced his way to them and they have a very good shot at adding Kawhi.

 

[WiggyRuss]

When is the last time the cavs got a meeting with a top free agent not named Lebron? Serious question

the Heat "got a meeting" with Hayward, Durant etc.

what did that do for them?

the simple fact is that the Heat were only ever good because they had stars- being Wade, and Shaq and then the Big 3. Jimmy Butler is a FAR cry from Wade or LeBron or Shaq- especially entering his age 30 season.

they will never win anything until they get that All NBA type talent again. Signing a 30 year old Jimmy Butler who has bounced around the league like a ping pong ball is a pathetic imitation of real star power and we will all see that in this coming year.

They got Wade because they bottomed out and got a high lotto pick. Wade, a true star in his prime, was able to attract others.

Until that happens, they will continue to wallow in mediocrity. Riley will never let it happen because he knows he doesnt have the time. His personal motives are holding back the team doing what it actually did do succesfully in the past---- bottom out and get a star--- and then bottom out, clear cap space (even though they took Michael Beasley in that draft which is nearly as bad as the Bennet pick- probably worse considering the guys avaliable in both drafts), a nd do it again.


The smartest thing the Heat could have done is continue to go down the road they were on---- develop the young guys like Winslow, Richardson, Bam, and now Herro--- and BEFORE those guys were due huge raises from their reasonable contracts 2 years from now--- sign a big time free agent.

Instead they sacrificed valuable assets to sign a 30 year old Jimmy Butler, who just does not move the needle in relation to their expectations.

 

[dtgold88]

@WiggyRuss @Heatles84 @TurnUpTheHeat

Can we end this debate already?

It is like the biggest apples to oranges comparison ever.

Teams like the Cavs have to build a core through the draft and invest in future assets before they have any chance of signing/trading for the types of players that can help them compete beyond NBA purgatory.

The Heat do not. The cost of teams like the Heat taking the anti-tank approach is minimal. Because as soon as they clear their books they are threats to reload with big name free agents. The Heat do not have to rely on building through the draft, or “tanking” if you will.

And for every example of a non-destination market to find sustained success like the Warriors and Spurs, guess where their runs started? By building a core of players/tradable assets through the draft.

Pretty much the point. "The Heat do not"....yet they still have been no better than NBA purgatory for what looks like year 6 after Lebron's departure.

 

[tlance]

Hawaii > Kawhimare

I knew the Clippers were gonna get left holding their Dicks.

So, I wasn't even on the internet.

He's going to the Lakers.

So, I'm not sure what all this waiting is about.

I don’t think Kawhi is 100% yet.

He should take his time. This is a huge decision that will affect the entire league.

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

Congrats, Heat Fans.

Hopefully Butler will flourish.

Confused why they didn't do that deal last year.

I love what Utah did.

Lol @the Knicks and Clippers.

 

[tlance]

Pretty much the point. "The Heat do not"....yet they still have been no better than NBA purgatory for what looks like year 6 after Lebron's departure.

True.

And yet, they are still a lot more likely to contend before the Cavs are despite all that.

The Heat have a rather large margin for error that small market teams frankly don’t.