2015-16 NBA Eastern Conference OFFICIAL THREAD

[bksballer89]

Ah, I forgot. Fan voting. It'll probably be Bosh then.

Nope Bosh is nowhere close. I think Drummond was starting last time I saw it

 

[Demonjoe93]

Nope Bosh is nowhere close. I think Drummond was starting last time I saw it

He's having a hell of a year.

 

[trojanfan12]

The Cavs are looking to trade Mozgov?

I wouldn't mind the Lakers giving up Sacre for him.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Nearly 34 years old and playing in his 13th NBA season, Wade is Flash no longer. Following multiple knee surgeries, he can no longer create easy separation with superior athleticism. His shooting numbers reflect the change.
D-Wade is registering career lows from the field, with a true shooting percentage (51.2) well below league average. In part, that's because his ability to draw shooting fouls has declined, as well.
Numerous athletic markers -- block rate, steal rate, free throw rate -- are all precipitously below Wade's career average.
The Heat are known for their defense, but they've actually been much better on that end when the aging 2-guard sits. In fact, Wade's -1.66 Defensive RPM rates below replacement level.
It all adds up to a surprisingly average overall RPM for Wade of -0.13. That's an acceptable impact for a rotation player, but it's far from the D-Wade we're used to.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Nearly 34 years old and playing in his 13th NBA season, Wade is Flash no longer. Following multiple knee surgeries, he can no longer create easy separation with superior athleticism. His shooting numbers reflect the change.
D-Wade is registering career lows from the field, with a true shooting percentage (51.2) well below league average. In part, that's because his ability to draw shooting fouls has declined, as well.
Numerous athletic markers -- block rate, steal rate, free throw rate -- are all precipitously below Wade's career average.
The Heat are known for their defense, but they've actually been much better on that end when the aging 2-guard sits. In fact, Wade's -1.66 Defensive RPM rates below replacement level.
It all adds up to a surprisingly average overall RPM for Wade of -0.13. That's an acceptable impact for a rotation player, but it's far from the D-Wade we're used to.

Point being?
He's had a hall of fame, top 5 all time shooting guard career.
Also has been a big part of 3 championship teams.

You don't think Heat fans know his career is winding down?

 

[bksballer89]

Point being?
He's had a hall of fame, top 5 all time shooting guard career.
Also has been a big part of 3 championship teams.

You don't think Heat fans know his career is winding down?

Yeah that's why I did not respond. I did not get the point of even posting that. He stated the obvious that all of us already know. Maybe his post would make sense if Wade was not 34/out of his prime?

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Yeah that's why I did not respond. I did not get the point of even posting that. He stated the obvious that all of us already know. Maybe his post would make sense if Wade was not 34/out of his prime?

Wiggy being Wiggy.

Maybe he doesn't know that Wade/James entered the league in the same year, but Wade has more rings.
And, Wade turned 34 today. By next year, I suspect his average salary per year will be moderate.
In 2017 when James signs his super max, he will be 33 I believe.
Any guesses how that contract will look towards the middle/end?

Like we've said all along, the Cavs window is shrinking.
There's a couple really good teams in the West.
If James is stuck on 2 when he signs that super max, chances are he stays there forever.[/QUOTE]

 

[WiggyRuss]

I just thought it was interesting to put something into empirical statistics that everyone had suspected.

There are some many differences between Wade and LeBron that lend LeBron to having a much longer all star level career its insane.

First- LeBron has never had a serious injury, ligament sprain, knee surgery, blah blah blah....we all know the well documented knee issues Wade has had.

Two- LeBron has so much more to his game than Wade is frightening. Wade never bothered to learn how to shoot. LeBron adds new stuff to his game every year.

Three- LeBron is a freak of nature.

Four- the Cavs are going to be ultra-careful with him.

Five- big men average more gracefully than guards- LeBron in his later years could morph into a ridiculous point-forward.

Six- having 2 all star level players that are just starting to enter their primes to carry the load should help

7. Hes LeBron James- and will be the 2nd best player of all time before all is said and done.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Your list is part accurate, part soiled.

Question, what has James added to his game since year 2 Heat?
His outside shooting has gotten worse and worse.
His go to move now, is what it was before. Attack as hard as possible and hope the refs give him the call because of who he is.


Now, as far as #2 all time.
For that to be the case, the ring count better jump up a bit.


Like I said, and I'll wait for response if you don't feel it's accurate, the window closes more and more every year.
His super max contract will not look very good when he's 35+ in age.

 

[ChrisGar15]

I wouldn't mind the Lakers giving up Sacre for him.

Maybe the Lakers will give up a #1 for him --like they did for Ramon Sessions.

 

[Hornsstampede2.0]

Lebron might have developed a shot in Miami.
But, he has never been a shooter in Cleveland.

He couldn't shoot there the first time around....and now he cannot shoot again.
It is very strange.

he is still a great scorer. He can still get a solid FG% and doesn't need the shooting touch honestly.
But, that assassin like shooting ability he found in Miami seems to not travel outside of South Beach.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Lebron might have developed a shot in Miami.
But, he has never been a shooter in Cleveland.

He couldn't shoot there the first time around....and now he cannot shoot again.
It is very strange.

he is still a great scorer. He can still get a solid FG% and doesn't need the shooting touch honestly.
But, that assassin like shooting ability he found in Miami seems to not travel outside of South Beach.

now...let me tell ya- this is an argument that isa LITTLE out there on a limb- but i think it holds some weight.

I think that these last 1 and a 1/3rd years he has been back in Cleveland- he hasnt had the ability to do the things like he did in Miami like work on his game- post game, shooting etc- that he improved so drastically in Miami.

He came to this team that was perpetually at the top of the lotto- a brand new coach, a pretty much brand new team- and 2 All Star teammates that had never before seen the post season. A team that had a lot of questions- and some questionable charaters (Dion), a lack of a center (until they got Mozgov), a lack of a real backup, and really a team that looked in a lot of upheaval last year around this time- until they made that trade- the team was 19-20.

I really think THIS MONTH- January- is the first time since LeBron has got to Cleveland, where things are finally settling down a little bit and he doesnt have to over-extend himself basically remaking the team. Last year- obviously the early season injuries, then the trades, then getting continuity- then the playoffs and all the injuries------ and then early this year- all the injuries, Thompsons holdout, LeBron having a sore back early on...trying to get Love mentally involved....managing without Kyrie until they got Kyrie back and then trying to get him back assimiliated.....

I really think this is the FIRST month since LeBron has been back - where he can take a deep breath, know that he has his full team, and know that the team is on the same page with a championship mentality. That has been his focus- getting these guys- a lot that really didnt have much experience, didnt really know how to win, and had basically NO postseason experience- to approaching the game with a Championship mentality on a nightly basis....I think that has taken away from him cleaning up stuff in his game that he could do before at times.

LeBron heard the critics with his shooting- and this month anyway- is up to 45% from 3 pt land....Obviously he wont keep up that clip- but i think we will start seeing a more efficient LeBron over the next couple months.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

now...let me tell ya- this is an argument that isa LITTLE out there on a limb- but i think it holds some weight.

I think that these last 1 and a 1/3rd years he has been back in Cleveland- he hasnt had the ability to do the things like he did in Miami like work on his game- post game, shooting etc- that he improved so drastically in Miami.

He came to this team that was perpetually at the top of the lotto- a brand new coach, a pretty much brand new team- and 2 All Star teammates that had never before seen the post season. A team that had a lot of questions- and some questionable charaters (Dion), a lack of a center (until they got Mozgov), a lack of a real backup, and really a team that looked in a lot of upheaval last year around this time- until they made that trade- the team was 19-20.

I really think THIS MONTH- January- is the first time since LeBron has got to Cleveland, where things are finally settling down a little bit and he doesnt have to over-extend himself basically remaking the team. Last year- obviously the early season injuries, then the trades, then getting continuity- then the playoffs and all the injuries------ and then early this year- all the injuries, Thompsons holdout, LeBron having a sore back early on...trying to get Love mentally involved....managing without Kyrie until they got Kyrie back and then trying to get him back assimiliated.....

I really think this is the FIRST month since LeBron has been back - where he can take a deep breath, know that he has his full team, and know that the team is on the same page with a championship mentality. That has been his focus- getting these guys- a lot that really didnt have much experience, didnt really know how to win, and had basically NO postseason experience- to approaching the game with a Championship mentality on a nightly basis....I think that has taken away from him cleaning up stuff in his game that he could do before at times.

LeBron heard the critics with his shooting- and this month anyway- is up to 45% from 3 pt land....Obviously he wont keep up that clip- but i think we will start seeing a more efficient LeBron over the next couple months.

In your previous post you flatly stated that James has added something to his game every year.
Now, after being called out on it, you're claim is that he's had no time to work on adding things to his game?

That's a joke.
He's had plenty of time to make a movie, endorse his other businesses, vacation, etc.

Like I said, he's added nothing and became a worse outside shooter.

 

[WiggyRuss]

In your previous post you flatly stated that James has added something to his game every year.
Now, after being called out on it, you're claim is that he's had no time to work on adding things to his game?

That's a joke.
He's had plenty of time to make a movie, endorse his other businesses, vacation, etc.

Like I said, he's added nothing and became a worse outside shooter.

I would say he DID do that and added it to his game- from information you yourself have said on here- trying to adapt the "Pat Riley winning ways"....

I think what LeBron did- instituting a total culture change- that started probably BEFORE he even formally announced he was coming to Cleveland is a bigger accomplishment then adding a post game. LeBron brought in his guys- Miller, Jones, etc. - and like a CEO - affected a total change of direction for the whole franchise. To me that is VERY VERY significant when you are dealing with the situation LeBron walked into with a coach that never coached in the NBA at any level, a total lack of "winning-know-how" between his most important teammates, in between major roster upheavals and injuries.

To me- that is probably the best work LeBron has done in a lot of ways.

 

[WiggyRuss]

It's the midseason mark of the NBA regular season, which means it's time to assess the 15 Eastern Conference teams.
Our NBA Insiders have assessed each team, and our panel of Kevin Pelton, Tom Haberstroh, Bradford Doolittle and Chad Ford has graded each team as well.
The grades are in. Let's see how the 15 East teams are doing.

Cleveland Cavaliers

Bradford Doolittle: The narrative for the Cavaliers entering the season was that the pursuit of the East's top seed was irrelevant. Cleveland just had to stay afloat until Kyrie Irving and Iman Shumpert got healthy, then build up for the postseason. The Cavs did a whole lot more than stay afloat. They went surfing.
The Cavs are on pace for 60 wins -- seven more than last season -- and have the best point differential in the East. Cleveland has done this while getting all of its rotation players back and despite playing a league-low 16 home games.
What's not to like? The Cavs are in the top five in the league on both ends of the floor. They are on pace to win the conference by nine or 10 games, so they may be resting guys for the playoffs by the beginning of April.
And there is a chance that Cleveland continues to get better. Irving is just beginning to round into form. Timofey Mozgov can play a lot better. And if the Cavs decide to make a splash, they've got a $10.5 million trade exception to work with.
Doolittle's grade: A | Panel's grade: A

 

[WiggyRuss]

couple other notables that are the Cavs "supposed" main competition according to some



Chicago Bulls

Doolittle: The Bulls needed to make hay during the first half of the season to take advantage of the East's most home-heavy schedule. Chicago is on pace for 48 wins -- two shy of ESPN's Summer Forecast -- so in that regard, it's been a passable start.
And the Bulls have some rationale for the so-so start, with a point guard constantly battling injuries and Fred Hoiberg in his first season as coach.
But it's hard to be all that optimistic right now about the Bulls. Chicago has the point differential of a 44-win team. The offense has floundered (No. 23 in efficiency) despite the emergence of Jimmy Butler as a superstar. And offense is the facet of the game in which Hoiberg is supposed to be an ace.
We're looking back right now, but it's the look forward that makes the lackluster first half so troubling. In addition to all the road games upcoming, Rose's play has been inadequate, Butler is banged up and Joakim Noah is done for the season.
Chicago has the talent and experience to make a run. But they need to put it together soon or they could drop fast in a competitive conference.
Doolittle's grade: C | Panel's grade: C+
Toronto Raptors

Ford: Toronto has quietly positioned itself to be the Cavaliers' main threat in the East. But are they really good enough to challenge Cleveland? Not yet.
Kyle Lowry and DeMar DeRozan have played like All-Stars in the backcourt. Ditto for young center Jonas Valanciunas since his return.
The Raptors are in second in the Eastern Conference and own a likely lottery pick this year (probably the Knicks' pick, from the Andrea Bargnani trade). They also have some talent they could move, as Bradford Doolittle spelled out in his Raptors trade profile last week. That puts them in position to start making deals -- if they find opportunities.
With a more dominant power forward and some help for the bench, Toronto might become a true contender in the East. General manager Masai Ujiri needs to get busy at the trade deadline.
Ford's grade: B+ | Panel's grade: A-
Miami Heat

Haberstroh: Compared to last season's miserable season, Heat coach Erik Spoelstra will take the cards he's been dealt this season a thousand times over. But that doesn't mean it's been smooth sailing at 601 Biscayne Blvd. With a relatively clean bill of health, he's had to juggle the egos of Goran Dragic, Dwyane Wade, Luol Deng, Chris Bosh and Hassan Whiteside. It's revealing that this hyped starting lineup has been outscored this season while on the floor.
They still have to figure out what they have in Whiteside, who's a 7-foot Rorschach test and a free agent this summer. He currently co-owns the best block rate in NBA history (tied with Manute Bol) and dunks practically everything he catches near the rim. But at the same time, the Heat improve immensely on defense when he goes to the bench and he is categorically allergic to passing.
Elsewhere, Tyler Johnson and Justise Winslow have anchored a surprisingly powerful bench unit, but with the starting lineup sputtering on offense, the Heat's season feels oddly underwhelming despite a cupcake schedule that had them at home for 19 of their first 28 games.
Haberstroh's grade: B- | Panel's grade: B-

 

[trojanfan12]

Maybe the Lakers will give up a #1 for him --like they did for Ramon Sessions.

To be fair, when they did that, it was a late first round pick that wouldn't have gotten them much anyway.

 

[WiggyRuss]

that Whiteside description is so crazy. What an enigma of a player to properly assess his value.

Best block rate in NBA history- AWESOME Field goal percentage and rebounding numbers- but the defensive numbers are SIGNIFICANTLY WORSE when he is on the floor- and he is "categorically allergic to passing"...lol...

whoever can put a correct value on this guy is smarter than I am.

 

[trojanfan12]

In 2017 when James signs his super max, he will be 33 I believe.
Any guesses how that contract will look towards the middle/end?

Probably about like Kobe's, but with fewer rings.

 

[WiggyRuss]

To be fair, when they did that, it was a late first round pick that wouldn't have gotten them much anyway.

it ended up getting the Cavs basically Tyler Zeller, and part of the way to that Russian that was supposed to be decent but hasnt done anything....Zeller is actually a pretty darn good rotational big in my estimation- if he could get the run. But yah- nothing too too significant.