It's football vs. forest in Va. Tech sports facility controversy

[HoHumHokie]

Didn't you know these woods were sacred fucking grounds to the various Inidan tribes of SW Virginia. Pocahontas' cousin, Pokahotass, lost her virginity to Chief Long Knife in these woods.

 

[MattB4VT]

Didn't you know these woods were sacred fucking grounds to the various Inidan tribes of SW Virginia. Pocahontas' cousin, Pokahotass, lost her virginity to Chief Long Knife in these woods.

The real reason they don't want to cut them down is because the hippies who so dearly want to save them will have to go find a new place to smoke weed on campus.

 

[sparko]

Why you hatin on hippies??

And when we move to the SEC, our football players will be smokin there too #GodsConference #PuffPuffGive #YOLO

SEC lenient on discipline for marijuana, investigation says - ESPN

 

[Hokie200proof]

Why you hatin on hippies??

And when we move to the SEC, our football players will be smokin there too #GodsConference #PuffPuffGive #YOLO

SEC lenient on discipline for marijuana, investigation says - ESPN

Fuck you Sparko for typing "YOLO" on this GD board. Even in jest.




ARE THERE NO SAFE HAVENS FROM THE STUPIDITY OF THE INTERWEBS!!??? IS NOTHING SACRED!!???


I had hoped we could insulate ourselves from things like that here... I'm all for free speech...












... but some words should never be uttered.

 

[ACC_HOKIES]

I see a lot of good information and discussion here. A couple things to add, just from my opinion (not a planner or eco expert).

- The master plan does indeed show the practice facility at the current tennis courts. Master plans however are never followed to the detail. They are first and foremost visions of work to be done in the future, and how to go about doing that work. The planners typically do not do the design services for what is on the master plan, and most planning projects go very shallow into the details (planning and engineering are two completely different tasks and skill sets. If one were to go back several iterations at Tech, there would be some noticeable differences in what you see on campus today.

- "Green space" in general is fungible. It's a percentage of total area. There are preferred areas that make obvious sense (Duck Pond, Drill Field, Stadium Woods, etc). There are ways to create an enforced preservation, but even then it is possible to undo that with enough will-power. To my knowledge, there are no legal or systemic protections for the woods. The Stadium Woods should be judged based on the value of its resources (and they are significant), not a "green space" label.

- The woods as a resource is difficult to estimate. As previously mentioned being old does not make something significant. Being old and rare is only slightly significant. What gives this forest value is the ecosystem. The forest stand functions in several ways including as a habitat for critters, classroom for certain students, recreation for other students, boundary for campus, and a filter for air and water. It is an asset of sorts to the school that cannot be recreated (at least not for a couple hundred years). There are substitutes for these functions, including mitigating off site (again a commonly accepted practice), but it is a tough balance.

- The practice facility will have a larger footprint than the building itself. There will be access, parking, utilities, storm water facilities, temporary erosion controls, and significant grading. It will take some creativity to minimize these impacts, even if the facility is built at the tennis court location.

- IMO, that small area of forest is already in danger. It is more susceptible to wind damage and other natural forms of destruction. Removing more forest will increase these threats. The stadium, interestingly enough, probably helps being that it is down hill yet still so tall. My biggest worry isn't the immediate impact of the facility. I more worry about the health of the remaining forest.

- I don't think it's been brought up yet, but I think the athletic department messed up when it built the basketball facility where it did. Unless the basketball teams need to go back and forth between the practice and game facility, I fail to see why the basketball facility couldn't be further away. A continous practice compound is optimum, while the game day facility can be disconnected IMO. Maybe there is a tunnel connection to basketball practice facility? Do the basketball teams walk into Cassell from the practice locker room like the football team does in Lane Stadium? The location of the basketball facility makes me think the AD had the woods location as their primary site all along.

 

[ckhokie]

Just to add, my roommate works for a construction company and has told me that they will be submitting a bid on a contract that would be adding an overpass to 460 and an additional exit for the expansion of the Corporate Research Center, as well as expansion of the VT airport (mainly for the CRC tenants) that would eventually replace the 460 'entrance' into Tech from Southgate, to a new one that would cut across where the rec sports fields are currently, which would explain why the school isn't more open to putting the indoor facility up there

 

[sparko]

Fuck you Sparko for typing "YOLO" on this GD board. Even in jest.

ARE THERE NO SAFE HAVENS FROM THE STUPIDITY OF THE INTERWEBS!!??? IS NOTHING SACRED!!???

I had hoped we could insulate ourselves from things like that here... I'm all for free speech...

... but some words should never be uttered.

woah 200!! I'm just poking a little fun at Matt and his not-on-twitter hashtags and today's youths' YOLO bullshit ... it's like the teenager buzz word in high school now

but it's funny .. one who drops #YOLO down everywhere and then pokes a little fun at the hippies, who basically live by the mantra "You only live once"

Matt: If you trully feel that #YOLO, you should be in the woods smoking a fatty with those hippies. Bet they're a lot cooler than most people are ... and I bet they have good pot too. ... but i'm not in the mood for arguing .. just havin a little fun .. don't take me so seriously

 

[ACC_HOKIES]

Just to add, my roommate works for a construction company and has told me that they will be submitting a bid on a contract that would be adding an overpass to 460 and an additional exit for the expansion of the Corporate Research Center, as well as expansion of the VT airport (mainly for the CRC tenants) that would eventually replace the 460 'entrance' into Tech from Southgate, to a new one that would cut across where the rec sports fields are currently, which would explain why the school isn't more open to putting the indoor facility up there

This is true. My company was teamed up for a group interested in working with the airport, and I got to see some interesting layouts. Unfortunately for us (but good for the airport) they were comfortable with the group they already had. There will be a lot of change in that area, specifically an eventual rerouting of Tech Center Drive. I think I can find something worth posting for that area if anyone has interest.

 

[hunzworth]

the baseball field isn't THAT far away.. i think college athletes can handle walking a 1/4 mile to their practice facility? if it was across campus i'm with you, but the baseball field is just down the hill?

its not about being able to "handle" a 1/4 mile walk. Its about the time that it takes to move. If a lightening storm pops up they wont have time to make the walk so instead of just stepping a few feet and carrrying on with practice, practice may have to be cancelled. You also have to consider the logistics of moving gear and such from one field to the other.

Not trying to argue but i can think of 20 good reasons that the practice facility needs to be close to Merryman and the other sports facilities, can you tell me why the rec tennis courts need to be there?

 

[hunzworth]

Just to add, my roommate works for a construction company and has told me that they will be submitting a bid on a contract that would be adding an overpass to 460 and an additional exit for the expansion of the Corporate Research Center, as well as expansion of the VT airport (mainly for the CRC tenants) that would eventually replace the 460 'entrance' into Tech from Southgate, to a new one that would cut across where the rec sports fields are currently, which would explain why the school isn't more open to putting the indoor facility up there

I have some digital drawings (ill try to find and post) of what the cloverleaf exchange on 460 will look like. this has already been aproved by Vdot so its not a matter of if but when it will be built.

 

[hunzworth]

- I don't think it's been brought up yet, but I think the athletic department messed up when it built the basketball facility where it did. Unless the basketball teams need to go back and forth between the practice and game facility, I fail to see why the basketball facility couldn't be further away. A continous practice compound is optimum, while the game day facility can be disconnected IMO. Maybe there is a tunnel connection to basketball practice facility? Do the basketball teams walk into Cassell from the practice locker room like the football team does in Lane Stadium? The location of the basketball facility makes me think the AD had the woods location as their primary site all along.

agree the ground that the bball facility sets on would have been ideal for football.

 

[VTscores]

Efficiently using practice time is a big deal, as the NCAA limits it.

Just ask Maryland, who self imposed a limit of 17.5 hours a week last year, after exceeding the limit by 2 hours a week in 2010. Schools are looking for every edge they can get, and the NCAA limit is 20 hours a week.

So I can see where 20-minutes of additional time to move between facilities might be a big deal to a program that's trying to optimize its practice time.

 

[hunzworth]

Efficiently using practice time is a big deal, as the NCAA limits it.

Just ask Maryland, who self imposed a limit of 17.5 hours a week last year, after exceeding the limit by 2 hours a week in 2010. Schools are looking for every edge they can get, and the NCAA limit is 20 hours a week.

So I can see where 20-minutes of additional time to move between facilities might be a big deal to a program that's trying to optimize its practice time.

exactly.

 

[bigesse16]

What is historically significant about these trees? Everything that happened in the past is historical, but not everything is significant. If someone wiped their ass under one of these trees in the fall of 1798, that's quite historical... but also quite insignificant. It's not like a famous treaty was signed there or something.

I think what you really mean by historical significance is actually significance based on the uniqueness of their age, which is something different. That is a case that can be made. But I would counter that unless there is some immediate usefulness (are we going to start having a bunch of scientists come here to study these trees for some reason?) that is not terribly important. You don't preserve something old just because it's old. Especially when there are a whole lot of other trees of this type in SW VA and so forth that are aging every day... if we discover some useful study of 300 year old white oaks 100 years from now, well, by then there will be more somewhere else (besides the ones that they're not talking about cutting down in this case).

SW VA is pretty broad, so I'd say to VT's campus, these trees represent historical significance because there doesn't appear to be any others on the campus.

You preserve something because it has meaning to you and these trees have meaning to VT. They may not mean something to you, but they mean something to others. It doesn't matter how useful they actually are.

 

[awaz]

its not about being able to "handle" a 1/4 mile walk. Its about the time that it takes to move. If a lightening storm pops up they wont have time to make the walk so instead of just stepping a few feet and carrrying on with practice, practice may have to be cancelled. You also have to consider the logistics of moving gear and such from one field to the other.

Not trying to argue but i can think of 20 good reasons that the practice facility needs to be close to Merryman and the other sports facilities, can you tell me why the rec tennis courts need to be there?

i'm not trying to argue either, i even said my defense of the tennis courts was mostly in jest, as long as they plan on building new ones somewhere else

Efficiently using practice time is a big deal, as the NCAA limits it.

Just ask Maryland, who self imposed a limit of 17.5 hours a week last year, after exceeding the limit by 2 hours a week in 2010. Schools are looking for every edge they can get, and the NCAA limit is 20 hours a week.

So I can see where 20-minutes of additional time to move between facilities might be a big deal to a program that's trying to optimize its practice time.

i didn't know there was a limit on practice time (that was enforced to the degree that 5-10 minutes would matter), that changes the story some.. i stand by down by the baseball fields not being that much further than the tennis courts though.. i bet there's maybe 3 minutes different in walking to either site (and one would assume that most equipment that would need moving, would be present at both locations to simplify this process)

not trying to fight, just stating that 'down by the baseball field' isn't the worst idea on the planet.. it might not be the best option, but it could be 3rd, or 2nd best if saving the trees is important to you

 

[MattB4VT]

Why you hatin on hippies??

And when we move to the SEC, our football players will be smokin there too #GodsConference #PuffPuffGive #YOLO

SEC lenient on discipline for marijuana, investigation says - ESPN

Rep for using a #uselesshashtag #YOLO

 

[hokiegrad]

SW VA is pretty broad, so I'd say to VT's campus, these trees represent historical significance because there doesn't appear to be any others on the campus.

You preserve something because it has meaning to you and these trees have meaning to VT. They may not mean something to you, but they mean something to others. It doesn't matter how useful they actually are.

How is historical significance derived from there not being any others on campus? These trees don't mean anything to VT. They may mean something to an individual such as this prof, but not to VT as a whole. When have you seen them on the cover of the alumni mag, or a VT website, or anything like that (other than as a result of an article about this stink)?

 

[Hokie200proof]

woah 200!! I'm just poking a little fun at Matt and his not-on-twitter hashtags and today's youths' YOLO bullshit ... it's like the teenager buzz word in high school now

but it's funny .. one who drops #YOLO down everywhere and then pokes a little fun at the hippies, who basically live by the mantra "You only live once"

Matt: If you trully feel that #YOLO, you should be in the woods smoking a fatty with those hippies. Bet they're a lot cooler than most people are ... and I bet they have good pot too. ... but i'm not in the mood for arguing .. just havin a little fun .. don't take me so seriously

It originated from Matt?

GD it. Whoever it was, fuck that shit. I don't make the rules around here, but I'm making this is one - This board is a no YOLO zone. It's also a no Juggalo zone as well and I feel like they're related (read retarded) phenomenon.

 

[hunzworth]

It originated from Matt?

GD it. Whoever it was, fuck that shit. I don't make the rules around here, but I'm making this is one - This board is a no YOLO zone. It's also a no Juggalo zone as well and I feel like they're related (read retarded) phenomenon.

hey, you only live once!

 

[Hokie200proof]

hey, you only live once!

WTF... that was... this is... Right after issuance of the GD rule!








I almost have to salute you for the ballsy, fuck the police attitude.


But...



Fuck you.