Trust The Climb

[bbwvfan]

Funny... if the Dana lovers hold Neal to the same standard as the Dana bashers... we’re attacked for it?

Everyone knew this year was going to be down. But, did anyone honestly think our offense would be this bad? The third worst rushing offense in the country bad...

I support Neal. He’s the head coach of my team. I bought my season tickets for this year. I’ll buy them again for next year. I’ve stayed at every game until the clock goes to 00:00.

It’s one thing to cite bare cupboard. It’s quite another to excuse this season’s lack of production on offense.

 

[bbwvfan]

Made it through 3 paragraphs and bailed out. He kind of lost me in the first sentence but in an attempt to be open minded I continued to Trust the Climb. This article did nothing for me as this is what every HC attempts to do. Place YOUR stamp on the program. I’m in support of HCNB at least to seasons 3 & 4 where I hope to see marketable improvement. If calling out what I feel is poor coaching and that is equated to pouring piss on him, then I guess I’m pissing.

I read this piece over on 247. I made comments there that Gibby was loved in similar ways as this guy loves Neal. What does any of that mean?

Seriously...

We all know that coaches fail when moving up moreso than they enjoy success.

I’m hoping we aren’t one of the failures...

 

[WVUDAD]

Funny... if the Dana lovers hold Neal to the same standard as the Dana bashers... we’re attacked for it?

Everyone knew this year was going to be down. But, did anyone honestly think our offense would be this bad? The third worst rushing offense in the country bad...

I support Neal. He’s the head coach of my team. I bought my season tickets for this year. I’ll buy them again for next year. I’ve stayed at every game until the clock goes to 00:00.

It’s one thing to cite bare cupboard. It’s quite another to excuse this season’s lack of production on offense.

I honestly expected better than what we have seen, I think Brown is a fine coach who can succeed here once he gets kids in who buy into what he wants to do. Year one with an entirely new coaching staff, few senior leaders left on the team, forced to play so many young kids due to the all in for last year of our previous staff, kids leaving due the coaching change, injuries, etc. I see some bright spots, the defense is a work in progress, but I do see potential. I knew the offense would be our weak link, as most of last years production was leaving. We have had offensive line issues all year, and a QB that just doesn't seem to get it, IF we had Grier this year, the offense would look much better, Kendall sat the bench at OU for a reason, which we can all see. As to holding Brown and Holgorsen to the same standard, we will see what year three brings, Holgorsen inherited a team with MOST of the starters back from the previous year, the entire defensive coaching staff intact, and some good senior leadership, Brown inherited a team with most of the offense gone, no coaching staff holdover, and few upperclassmen leaders.

 

[mad2mc]

I honestly expected better than what we have seen, I think Brown is a fine coach who can succeed here once he gets kids in who buy into what he wants to do. Year one with an entirely new coaching staff, few senior leaders left on the team, forced to play so many young kids due to the all in for last year of our previous staff, kids leaving due the coaching change, injuries, etc. I see some bright spots, the defense is a work in progress, but I do see potential. I knew the offense would be our weak link, as most of last years production was leaving. We have had offensive line issues all year, and a QB that just doesn't seem to get it, IF we had Grier this year, the offense would look much better, Kendall sat the bench at OU for a reason, which we can all see. As to holding Brown and Holgorsen to the same standard, we will see what year three brings, Holgorsen inherited a team with MOST of the starters back from the previous year, the entire defensive coaching staff intact, and some good senior leadership, Brown inherited a team with most of the offense gone, no coaching staff holdover, and few upperclassmen leaders.

This is why I stated in another thread that if Dana wasn’t forced to keep Gibby and hired a DC like who is in place today, what type of teams would we have seen during Dana’s tenure? Dana proved he could coach a less than mediocre QB up, something I don’t see this season. He has stud RBs, but doesn’t use them to help Kendall. I believe Kendall under Dana would be a hell of a lot better than what he is showing us.

 

[mad2mc]

Funny... if the Dana lovers hold Neal to the same standard as the Dana bashers... we’re attacked for it?

Everyone knew this year was going to be down. But, did anyone honestly think our offense would be this bad? The third worst rushing offense in the country bad...

I support Neal. He’s the head coach of my team. I bought my season tickets for this year. I’ll buy them again for next year. I’ve stayed at every game until the clock goes to 00:00.

It’s one thing to cite bare cupboard. It’s quite another to excuse this season’s lack of production on offense.

I wonder where ‘Stewmustgo’ and ‘Towmater’ are these days. Do you think Stewmustgo would have changed his screen name to Brownmustgo? Those 2 were the warmup act for King and Sleepy.

 

[bbwvfan]

I honestly expected better than what we have seen, I think Brown is a fine coach who can succeed here once he gets kids in who buy into what he wants to do. Year one with an entirely new coaching staff, few senior leaders left on the team, forced to play so many young kids due to the all in for last year of our previous staff, kids leaving due the coaching change, injuries, etc. I see some bright spots, the defense is a work in progress, but I do see potential. I knew the offense would be our weak link, as most of last years production was leaving. We have had offensive line issues all year, and a QB that just doesn't seem to get it, IF we had Grier this year, the offense would look much better, Kendall sat the bench at OU for a reason, which we can all see. As to holding Brown and Holgorsen to the same standard, we will see what year three brings, Holgorsen inherited a team with MOST of the starters back from the previous year, the entire defensive coaching staff intact, and some good senior leadership, Brown inherited a team with most of the offense gone, no coaching staff holdover, and few upperclassmen leaders.

Solid post DAD!

I’m not ready to offer an opinion on whether Neal is a fine coach... bad coach...

He obviously believes in his way of doing things. My impression is he’s more like Rich than he is like any of the Air Raid tree he’s from. What I mean, he is unwilling to adjust his offense to take advantage of the strengths of his players. He’s simply putting his offense in place, and the kids have to learn how to play hard within it. He’s no longer running Air Raid. I’m not sure what our offensive identity is at this point.

Maybe things will look better when he has had a chance to build and develop his kids. But, his Troy offenses when he was HC were not even close to elite. So, I think he’s past that.

Does he have a winning formula with an offense and defense and ST’s that wins? It did at Troy.

There is a ton of youth on the field. But, you know who else has a lot of youth on the field? Our next opponent.

Just have to Trust the Climb...

 

[Slaton10]

Good article to read

Coach Neal Brown: “Trusting The Climb” A Message to Mountaineer Nation — Inside The Hashes

Couple of things that stand out here for me...One Wv does not play in the Sunbelt Conference so turning around a program in a non power 5 school to me is an easier road...Second..he mentions Culture...did Wv have a Culture issue under Dana..If I am not mistaken in his time at Wv maybe 2 players showed up on a police ink blotter in 8 years which pales in comparison by a country ass mile to his two predecessors...and the team had consistently one the highest GPA's in the Big12 and the highest in the programs history 2018 cumulative 2.95GPA..

I recall very few players transferring out under Dana, I think the kids loved playing for him..for those who had next level ability...he got them there....what else could you ask as a player from your HC...

Now if he would have said HCNB changing the identity..maybe I would understand that comment a little better..

End of the day I don't see that happening yet...I think BBW or even Mad or Mike referenced it somewhere ...if there are those who think the CUPBOARD WAS BARE....what would call what Les Miles is working with out in Lawrence...that team may not be winning a lot of games yet but there is no way you can't watch what the Jayhawks are doing and not come to the conclusion that team is closer to turning the corner faster than Wv at the moment...

 

[tnapucco]

I was today years old when I realized the catch phrase is directly related to mountaineering.

My momma must have drank.

 

[bbwvfan]

I was today years old when I realized the catch phrase is directly related to mountaineering.

My momma must have drank.

Well said...

 

[Slaton10]

Solid post DAD!

I’m not ready to offer an opinion on whether Neal is a fine coach... bad coach...

He obviously believes in his way of doing things. My impression is he’s more like Rich than he is like any of the Air Raid tree he’s from. What I mean, he is unwilling to adjust his offense to take advantage of the strengths of his players. He’s simply putting his offense in place, and the kids have to learn how to play hard within it. He’s no longer running Air Raid. I’m not sure what our offensive identity is at this point.

Maybe things will look better when he has had a chance to build and develop his kids. But, his Troy offenses when he was HC were not even close to elite. So, I think he’s past that.

Does he have a winning formula with an offense and defense and ST’s that wins? It did at Troy.

There is a ton of youth on the field. But, you know who else has a lot of youth on the field? Our next opponent.

Just have to Trust the Climb...

I think we saw move in the right direction yesterday..

 

[Mac_Bridger]

I knew it was going to be pretty bad with all the kids who were transferring out. Had they all stayed, this was still a 6-6 team. How many kids left? I don't even recall, but want to say we had 9 kids bolt. Those who left were prospective starters, or at least players who would have been weekly contributors.

So why would you still expect 6 wins with a team that lost a bunch of production, on top of what was lost from graduation? Shit, we only won 8 games last year!

 

[bbwvfan]

I knew it was going to be pretty bad with all the kids who were transferring out. Had they all stayed, this was still a 6-6 team. How many kids left? I don't even recall, but want to say we had 9 kids bolt. Those who left were prospective starters, or at least players who would have been weekly contributors.

So why would you still expect 6 wins with a team that lost a bunch of production, on top of what was lost from graduation? Shit, we only won 8 games last year!

Every team in our conference lost a lot of production too!

KSU, TT, KU and us all had new HC's. UT and KU lost more production than us. ISU lost 2/3 of their offensive production from last year. TCU lost all of their QB's to transfer from last year's team.

Not sure why expectations should have been so low for our team.

Neal considers himself a QB whisperer... he knew he could improve our QB's last Jan. when he was hired.

Today is another opportunity for Neal to prove to Mountaineer Nation that it's worth it for us to Trust the Climb...

 

[Slaton10]

Every team in our conference lost a lot of production too!

KSU, TT, KU and us all had new HC's. UT and KU lost more production than us. ISU lost 2/3 of their offensive production from last year. TCU lost all of their QB's to transfer from last year's team.

Not sure why expectations should have been so low for our team.

Neal considers himself a QB whisperer... he knew he could improve our QB's last Jan. when he was hired.

Today is another opportunity for Neal to prove to Mountaineer Nation that it's worth it for us to Trust the Climb...

 

[WVUDAD]

I indeed trust it, there was no quit in this team!!! Unlike the last few years we saw a team improve as the year went on, we saw them play their hearts out tonight even when there was nothing to play for but this game. We saw some times in the season where we scratched our heads and wondered, but we saw a team these past three games that was head and shoulders better than the team that played those five game losses. I see great potential for the future, I see a team that will hold the other teams score down rather than just trying to outscore them and playing no defense. We are climbing!!!!

 

[Anotherwvufan]

Good to end with a win and obvious improvement. Let’s hope we can build an offensive line for next year.
Year 1 for HCNB in the Books. I’m not disappointed but not overly impressed. Lots of freshman saw a good bit of time. Recruit some more and trust the climb.

 

[Anotherwvufan]

Found an interesting quote regarding the situations inherited by Holgerson v. HCNB. It does point out that both coaches had to struggle with building their rosters after they arrived. With our tough schedules, we need significant depth to make it through the season. I guess building that is part of the climb.

Current situation: Under Dana Holgorsen, West Virginia would set aside three scholarships for specialists - a kicker, a punter, and a long snapper. There has been no indication that that will remain the same under Neal Brown, but it does sound like any one or three could earn a scholarship once they get the starting job. I would say WVU's specialist situation is very healthy right now, regardless of the scholarship count.

FINAL NUMBER - 69

Thoughts: I am almost at a loss for words. Sixty-nine scholarship players as things stand right now. Sure, the staff will add another seven to nine players through commitments, transfers, and blueshirts, but this number includes absolutely no more attrition this offseason. Not only is that unrealistic, but it's possible that just as many players decide to transfer/graduate in the next few months as come in (the 7-9 number I just mentioned).



5COMMENTS
As I've said before, this is somewhat similar to the situation Dana Holgorsen inherited when he arrived. When he took over as head coach, the Mountaineers were in the 50s and 60s on scholarship numbers. The difference is that Holgorsen got a couple years with a star-studded starting lineup (Geno, Tavon, Stedman, etc) before he had to regroup, and he also had the ability to go over the 25-man limit because there was no hard cap. There also wasn't a transfer portal that exacerbated the transfer problem in college football.



I would say the best-case scenario for Neal Brown is that he will head into 2020 with around 72 scholarship players, the same number as the limit on FCS programs. He'll ten have to fight the 25-man hard cap in recruiting, plus the never-ending allure of the transfer portal. Getting back up to eighty or more scholarships will be a tall task. Eighty-five is the limit, but I would consider - and have always said - eighty is a good number. You get there, then have a few extra scholarships to reward to walk-ons who have earned it (that 'carrot' can help improve your walk-on program, too) and have one or two in the holster in case of a late transfer that you just can't pass on.

 

[Slaton10]

Found an interesting quote regarding the situations inherited by Holgerson v. HCNB. It does point out that both coaches had to struggle with building their rosters after they arrived. With our tough schedules, we need significant depth to make it through the season. I guess building that is part of the climb.

Current situation: Under Dana Holgorsen, West Virginia would set aside three scholarships for specialists - a kicker, a punter, and a long snapper. There has been no indication that that will remain the same under Neal Brown, but it does sound like any one or three could earn a scholarship once they get the starting job. I would say WVU's specialist situation is very healthy right now, regardless of the scholarship count.

FINAL NUMBER - 69

Thoughts: I am almost at a loss for words. Sixty-nine scholarship players as things stand right now. Sure, the staff will add another seven to nine players through commitments, transfers, and blueshirts, but this number includes absolutely no more attrition this offseason. Not only is that unrealistic, but it's possible that just as many players decide to transfer/graduate in the next few months as come in (the 7-9 number I just mentioned).



5COMMENTS
As I've said before, this is somewhat similar to the situation Dana Holgorsen inherited when he arrived. When he took over as head coach, the Mountaineers were in the 50s and 60s on scholarship numbers. The difference is that Holgorsen got a couple years with a star-studded starting lineup (Geno, Tavon, Stedman, etc) before he had to regroup, and he also had the ability to go over the 25-man limit because there was no hard cap. There also wasn't a transfer portal that exacerbated the transfer problem in college football.



I would say the best-case scenario for Neal Brown is that he will head into 2020 with around 72 scholarship players, the same number as the limit on FCS programs. He'll ten have to fight the 25-man hard cap in recruiting, plus the never-ending allure of the transfer portal. Getting back up to eighty or more scholarships will be a tall task. Eighty-five is the limit, but I would consider - and have always said - eighty is a good number. You get there, then have a few extra scholarships to reward to walk-ons who have earned it (that 'carrot' can help improve your walk-on program, too) and have one or two in the holster in case of a late transfer that you just can't pass on.

This is what I am talking about..there is no quick turnaround to next year and just magically win 8 plus games...this is 2 more years away..but our delusional fan base doesn't understand simple math..

 

[BamaDude]

I'm guessing whoever started this post may have seen a little light at the end of the tunnel when the Mountaineers closed the season with two road wins in their last three games? After all, WV was only a touchdown away from bowl eligibility, and only a FG away from forcing Baylor into overtime. The 'eers did have to contend with a lot of injuries this season.

 

[Slaton10]

I'm guessing whoever started this post may have seen a little light at the end of the tunnel when the Mountaineers closed the season with two road wins in their last three games? After all, WV was only a touchdown away from bowl eligibility, and only a FG away from forcing Baylor into overtime. The 'eers did have to contend with a lot of injuries this season.

There were postives and negatives...and definite improvement but the Baylor game should have been blowout...in Wv favor...Baylor laid an egg in that game...and yet Wv could not receive a gift that was being given to them..

 

[BamaDude]

There were postives and negatives...and definite improvement but the Baylor game should have been blowout...in Wv favor...Baylor laid an egg in that game...and yet Wv could not receive a gift that was being given to them..

Things should improve as Coach Brown gets a feel for the program. While at Troy he often was able to pull off stunning upsets (like at LSU a couple of years ago, vs Clemson in 2016) or near-upsets (the 30-24 loss at Clemson in 2016). But he would often follow with an inexplicable loss the following week (35-3 home loss to Arkansas St. the week after the App. St. win & a 19-8 home loss to South Alabama the week after beating LSU).

Brown inherited a pretty crappy team at Troy that had gone through 3 losing seasons & one break-even season in the four years before his arrival, and had to play road games against N.C. State, Wisconsin, Mississippi St., and Appalachian St. in his first season as head coach. After finishing that first year at 4-8 and going 2-3 at home and 1-5 on the road, his next three teams went 10-3, 11-2, and 10-3, and went 15-3 at home and 12-3 on the road.

He also inherited a crap situation at West Virginia, and with a tougher slate of foes & a shortage of scholarship players on hand, it could take until year three or four until any real progress is noticeable.