Thoughts after the Lions/Vikings game..........

[Naughtymax]

Well done, though I'm not holding my breath that the Bucs beat the Packers.

 

[Wazmankg]

I like what you are saying Waz!

Go Bucs !




They haven't won a game at home all year, so they're due right ?

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Every throw Stafford gets smashed, aaaannndd we cant run. Is it really that hard to figure out why the offense doesnt go?

I'd like to say it is 100% on the offensive line and with a couple changes, it will be fixed. Problem is -- With the same offensive line last year, which included 3 first time starters (2 of which were rookies) -- Detroit was 5th or 6th overall in total offense and put up around 25 points a game. This was while playing with #4, 5 and 6 WR's as their #2 much of the year.

They add Golden Tate, draft the premier TE in the NFL and return the same group of offensive linemen -- Now they score about a touchdown less per game and have about 60 yards of offense less per game.

Is it all on the offensive line play or is it on the OC and the scheme he has brought over?? That is why I put -- I'm not sure who to blame. We have no idea if Lombardi's scheme is successful, as he has never been an OC in the NFL -- so we have nothing to compare it against.

As much as I'd like to blame the offensive line -- they had no problem giving Stafford time to throw in year's past. This year -- Pettigrew is basically an extra tackle, as he rarely runs route, as he has to stay in to block to try and give Staff time to throw.

As much as many of us hated Linehan -- I can say without hesitation -- I'd love to see what the Lions could do this year with Linehan at OC and Austin as the DC.

 

[gandydancer]

Well done, though I'm not holding my breath that the Bucs beat the Packers.

Neither am I... Just had to straighten out some misinformation.

I also did not see the Bills beating them either. It happened, so anything is possible.

I actually like having to win week 17 better. Make it mor interesting to watch with a title on the line.

 

[Coach_Ed_LPW]

Is it all on the offensive line play or is it on the OC and the scheme he has brought over?? That is why I put -- I'm not sure who to blame. We have no idea if Lombardi's scheme is successful, as he has never been an OC in the NFL -- so we have nothing to compare it against.

Linehan is running the shit out of the ball. I haven't seen them throw a screen all year either. Why do you think that is?

I'd like to say it is 100% on the offensive line and with a couple changes, it will be fixed. Problem is -- With the same offensive line last year, which included 3 first time starters (2 of which were rookies) -- Detroit was 5th or 6th overall in total offense and put up around 25 points a game. This was while playing with #4, 5 and 6 WR's as their #2 much of the year.

A lot of that was garbage time...and they were slinging the ball recklessly around last year...this year they have protected the football much better, less points, waaaayyy less turnovers, 10 wins.

They add Golden Tate, draft the premier TE in the NFL and return the same group of offensive linemen -- Now they score about a touchdown less per game and have about 60 yards of offense less per game.

3 Games with no Calvin, another 2-3 with a gimpy Calvin, 4th string tight end at one point. Waddle has barely played, just got hurt again, Warford missed some games, Sims seems like he hti a wall, just not the same guy. They havent really had the offense together at all this year. Not to mention they were down to a 4th string running back as well. All that together, to me at least, is going to translate into less points over the course of the season.

As much as I'd like to blame the offensive line -- they had no problem giving Stafford time to throw in year's past.

I think Linehan's playcalling effected that. Everything play was get rid of it quick. Also last year the line and Pettigrew were virtually injury-less.

 

[TheConfidante]

This team will live and die by how good its defense performs. The offense is too inconsistent, but I read an article that said that may be his plan. Manage the game, limit turnovers, etc and let your defense perform.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Linehan is running the shit out of the ball. I haven't seen them throw a screen all year either. Why do you think that is?

Dallas has one of the best RB's and best OL's in the NFL -- that is why they are running the ball so much. It is no different than when he was with Detroit -- we couldn't run the ball to save our life, so we threw the ball repeatedly. Dallas has a competent passing game -- with Romo, Dez Bryant and Terrance Williams, but when you can run the ball like they can and control the clock, keeping their defense off the field -- that is what they are going to do.

As far as screen passes -- I must be missing something. Murray has 54 catches. I'm guessing a nice chunk of those catches were on screens. So I'm confused by that response.

A lot of that was garbage time...and they were slinging the ball recklessly around last year...this year they have protected the football much better, less points, waaaayyy less turnovers, 10 wins.

It wasn't just last year though. It was 2011, 2012 and 2013. Last year was the worst they ranked in total offense in a few years and they were 6th. 2011, I believe they were 3rd overall. 2012, I believe they were 5th overall.

I have no issue with the taking care of the ball comments. I agree with that. I'd rather Stafford eat a sack than force a throw. The WR don't even have time to run their patterns this year, as Stafford is being pressured repeatedly. It isn't as if teams are bringing the house on the Lions over and over. Most time they are rushing with a base defense and still getting after him.

3 Games with no Calvin, another 2-3 with a gimpy Calvin, 4th string tight end at one point. Waddle has barely played, just got hurt again, Warford missed some games, Sims seems like he hti a wall, just not the same guy. They havent really had the offense together at all this year. Not to mention they were down to a 4th string running back as well. All that together, to me at least, is going to translate into less points over the course of the season.

I agree, injuries play a part. But the Lions were without Calvin for 2 games last year as well. They were without Titus Young for the year. Ryan Broyles for almost the whole year. Nate Burleson for over half the year. They also didn't have Golden Tate or the wasted 1st round draft pick.

So it goes both ways for them. They put up the stats I mentioned with Calvin injured much of the year (knee and hand) and Kris Durham as their #2 WR. Any way you want to cut it -- that is impressive and also why the hype was so big for this year.

IMO -- you would be hard pressed to find a fan of the team who has been.impressed with the offense and their production this year. After years of carrying the team -- the shoe is on the other foot now and the defense is the sole reason the Lions will make the playoffs. If Austin wanted to run for Mayor of Detroit -- he would win in a landslide. That is how revered he is right now for what he has done with our defense. If our offense can pitch in and win a game or two -- Detroit could make a run this year.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

I think Linehan's playcalling effected that. Everything play was get rid of it quick

If that is the case -- Lombardi needs to follow suit. When you have a QB throw for almost 15000 yards in 3 years and rank toward the upper half of QB's who are sacked the least. Go back to the drawing board and mimic what worked in the past.

The defense scrapped everything and rightfully so. To me -- the offense wasn't broke, so their was no need to fix it, unless they wanted a running game, which they would have to replace multiple players do achieve that, IMO.

 

[tpaulus_2]

Good luck with that, Coach Ed. Everybody and their brother knows that the o-line has been our biggest issue, but if TrustMe has decided that he's going to argue with you about it you might just as well spend your time teaching Mandarin to a dish sponge, because you'd probably have better luck with that then you will with getting him to be even somewhat reasonable.

He probably even agrees with you about the o-line, but now that you've offended him by commenting on something he posted (which is gospel, and should never, ever be questioned like you did) you're about to find out just how ironic his user-name really is...

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Good luck with that, Coach Ed. Everybody and their brother knows that the o-line has been our biggest issue, but if TrustMe has decided that he's going to argue with you about it you might just as well spend your time teaching Mandarin to a dish sponge, because you'd probably have better luck with that then you will with getting him to be even somewhat reasonable.

He probably even agrees with you about the o-line, but now that you've offended him by commenting on something he posted (which is gospel, and should never, ever be questioned like you did) you're about to find out just how ironic his user-name really is...

 

[Coach_Ed_LPW]

Dallas has one of the best RB's and best OL's in the NFL -- that is why they are running the ball so much. It is no different than when he was with Detroit -- we couldn't run the ball to save our life, so we threw the ball repeatedly. Dallas has a competent passing game -- with Romo, Dez Bryant and Terrance Williams, but when you can run the ball like they can and control the clock, keeping their defense off the field -- that is what they are going to do.

That was my point exactly. Our O-line sucked so Linehan didn't run. Now that he has a good one, he runs the shit out of the ball. Point being...Our o-line sucked last year but Linehan coached around it. Maybe Lombardi doesn't do that as well, I'll buy that. But we are winning and protecting the football. There is a lot to be said for protecting the football.

As far as screen passes -- I must be missing something. Murray has 54 catches. I'm guessing a nice chunk of those catches were on screens. So I'm confused by that response

Bell and Bush had 107 catches on 149 targets. 149....thats quite a number. Demarco has 54 on 61 targets. Add Dunbar's 20 in...thats still quite a reduction. Also, in last years Lions offense(if you remember)...that was really our only effective play(probably because its hard to differentiate the Lions lineman's normal blocking for their screens...zing).

Most time they are rushing with a base defense and still getting after him.

Agree completely.=O-line not good.

 

[Old Lion]

When fatass and sims are gone next year we can begin to get better on O-Line. Another solid guard and move swanson to center. We may not be great but we will be much better balanced run and pass blocking. Would not be surprised to see Lucas take over at RT. He has the rest of the season to prove he is better than Waddle. He will need to be better than he was at LT that is for sure. I think he is a more natural RT IMO so there is a chance.

 

[tpaulus_2]

When fatass and sims are gone next year we can begin to get better on O-Line. Another solid guard and move swanson to center. We may not be great but we will be much better balanced run and pass blocking. Would not be surprised to see Lucas take over at RT. He has the rest of the season to prove he is better than Waddle. He will need to be better than he was at LT that is for sure. I think he is a more natural RT IMO so there is a chance.

??

You lost me there... he dominated Jared Allen in his first start at LT a few weeks ago when Reiff was out... got rave reviews and all that jazz... not ringing any bells?

 

[gandydancer]

??

You lost me there... he dominated Jared Allen in his first start at LT a few weeks ago when Reiff was out... got rave reviews and all that jazz... not ringing any bells?

I would not say dominate, did a very good to great job. Allen had two sacks one of which was a strip sack he recovered. One hurry and four tackles. Helluva lot better than some of his past stat lines against us.

Just wondering what game the writers watched for their reviews?

 

[tpaulus_2]

I would not say dominate, did a very good to great job. Allen had two sacks one of which was a strip sack he recovered. One hurry and four tackles. Helluva lot better than some of his past stat lines against us.

Just wondering what game the writers watched for their reviews?

Neither sack came against Lucas. One was against Rob Sims on a stunt, the other was a clean-up sack when Stafford tried to escape the pocket and just went to the ground instead.

I'd imagine the writers probably watched the Lions-Bears game for their reviews. They have the advantage of game tape from every camera angle, so they can go back and watch each individual match-up and determine how each player did, rather than just taking a quick look at the stats and making up their mind that way...

 

[Mebert]

I would not say dominate, did a very good to great job. Allen had two sacks one of which was a strip sack he recovered. One hurry and four tackles. Helluva lot better than some of his past stat lines against us.

Just wondering what game the writers watched for their reviews?

Detroit Lions undrafted rookie Cornelius Lucas steps in and stymies 4-time All-Pro Jared Allen | MLive.com

Strip sack was against Sims, pressures came against Pettigrew. The one sack he allowed came on a broken play.

 

[tpaulus_2]

Detroit Lions undrafted rookie Cornelius Lucas steps in and stymies 4-time All-Pro Jared Allen | MLive.com

Strip sack was against Sims, pressures came against Pettigrew. The one sack he allowed came on a broken play.

Nice info Mebert. Those broken play sacks generally don't count against any particular lineman, since they've generally completed their assignment by then...

 

[gandydancer]

Neither sack came against Lucas. One was against Rob Sims on a stunt, the other was a clean-up sack when Stafford tried to escape the pocket and just went to the ground instead.

I'd imagine the writers probably watched the Lions-Bears game for their reviews. They have the advantage of game tape from every camera angle, so they can go back and watch each individual match-up and determine how each player did, rather than just taking a quick look at the stats and making up their mind that way...

Thanks Trevor! I knew it when I typed it that it was Sims. Been trying to engage conversation with you since the debacle a month ago. With no results. I knew a very negative post would do this. Now we can move forward if you wish or not? I can, can you?

 

[Old Lion]

Nice info Mebert. Those broken play sacks generally don't count against any particular lineman, since they've generally completed their assignment by then...

Guess I didnt see it that way in the Bears game, but I did think he showed some promise. He just needed to improve. I did not notice if he held his block long enough on the broken play or who was supposed to be blocking him on the stunt, but it would not surprise me if Sims was supposed to pick it up and did not. You know my thoughts about Sims play this year and the final 6 games last year.

Lucas needs to work on his footwork which was awful in the Pats game. I noticed that right away. He did not perform well in that one and maybe I weighted that more than the Bears game.

 

[tpaulus_2]

He definitely performed much better at left tackle than he had previously this season at right tackle.