NHL #1 Defenseman

[Cobiemonster]

Polls ends on Tuesday morning

 

[dash]

Nice to see Giordano on the list...

 

[sbb122]

PK

 

[RP-29]

In order to be the #1 defenseman, you must be elite on both end of the ice. Karlsson, Weber, Subban and Ekman-Larsson were scoring leaders among defensemen, but all had a minus +/-. To me, that disqualifies them from the equation.


The obvious choice is Keith, who was second in scoring among defensemen, was +22 on the season and lead the Hawks deep into the playoffs. However, Giordano had the most impressive season. He only played 64 games, but finished 11th among defensemen in scoring with 47 points and was +12 on a Flames team that most figured in the preseason would be drafting first or second overall in the 2014 draft.

 

[jstewismybastardson]

using plus/minus to determine who the better dman is ???

really ???

in the year 2014?

 

[RP-29]

using plus/minus to determine who the better dman is ???

really ???

in the year 2014?

+/- is still a pretty good indicator of who plays sound defense and who doesn't.

 

[jstewismybastardson]

+/- is still a pretty good indicator of who plays sound defense and who doesn't.

Just how ?horse shit? is the NHL?s official plus-minus stat? | Edmonton Journal

In the end, it’s safe to say that one third of the plus and minus marks handed out under the official plus-minus system are assigned to players who don’t deserve them, and the problem is greatest at the defensive end of the ice. This number of incorrect assignments is likely as high as 40 per cent of all plus-minus marks handed out.

 

[Abe Vigoda]

+/- is still a pretty good indicator of who plays sound defense and who doesn't.

yeah but in the case of PP Subban two seasons ago; his TOI was below the top ten but his pts. and +/- was up there because of all of his PP points.

 

[Nasty_Magician]

yeah but in the case of PP Subban two seasons ago; his TOI was below the top ten but his pts. and +/- was up there because of all of his PP points.

I don't believe you are rewarded with a + on the PP.

 

[RP-29]

Just how ?horse shit? is the NHL?s official plus-minus stat? | Edmonton Journal

In the end, it’s safe to say that one third of the plus and minus marks handed out under the official plus-minus system are assigned to players who don’t deserve them, and the problem is greatest at the defensive end of the ice. This number of incorrect assignments is likely as high as 40 per cent of all plus-minus marks handed out.

Cite the Edmonton Journal about +/-?

 

[jstewismybastardson]

Cite the Edmonton Journal about +/-?

weak comeback

 

[RP-29]

weak comeback

For future reference, I very rarely submit a message board post to make a "comeback". I prefer respectful running debates, discussions and dialogs; not feather-ruffling one-ups & trolling.

In this case, it was intended as a simple yet legitimate counter point: agenda. The existence of studies is the support of an agenda. Most often someone needs look only as far as the persons conducting the study to know that agenda and the result of the study.

 

[Cleaves2000]

Pk is my favorite..

Keith is a sparty so i like him also...

 

[jstewismybastardson]

For future reference, I very rarely submit a message board post to make a "comeback". I prefer respectful running debates, discussions and dialogs; not feather-ruffling one-ups & trolling.

In this case, it was intended as a simple yet legitimate counter point: agenda. The existence of studies is the support of an agenda. Most often someone needs look only as far as the persons conducting the study to know that agenda and the result of the study.

point taken ... but just because it came from a writer at the edmonton journal doesnt mean there is some sort of agenda ... thats weak to bring that up imo ... there have been many articles (from various cities) looking at how poor a stat =/- is

 

[Comeds]

point taken ... but just because it came from a writer at the edmonton journal doesnt mean there is some sort of agenda ... thats weak to bring that up imo ... there have been many articles (from various cities) looking at how poor a stat =/- is

Nice retort.

PK is my favorite but I do not think he is the very best. (same with Price)

 

[pixburgher66]

This may have been the toughest to vote on. Man. Doughty in the Olympics and the postseason this year made it hard to vote against him, but...I'm a big, big Subban fan.

 

[Nasty_Magician]

Shea Weber is arguably my favorite non-Devil so I have to go with him.

 

[RP-29]

point taken ... but just because it came from a writer at the edmonton journal doesnt mean there is some sort of agenda ... thats weak to bring that up imo ... there have been many articles (from various cities) looking at how poor a stat =/- is

Point taken. And to reiterate, I referenced it as an indicator, not gospel. That indicator is usually pretty consistent with the eyeball test.

We see guys like Subban skate out of position to make a big hit and the puck ends up in the back of his net. We see guys like Karlsson skate into empty space looking for an offensive rush and the puck ends up in the back of his net. Those are the guys who often end up with a minus +/-.

Then guys like Keith and Suter are almost never out of position defensively and very often make the correct read, consistently post huge plus numbers.

 

[RP-29]

Shea Weber is arguably my favorite non-Devil so I have to go with him.

I liked Weber until he slammed Zetterberg's head into the corner turnbuckle.

 

[Abe Vigoda]

This may have been the toughest to vote on. Man. Doughty in the Olympics and the postseason this year made it hard to vote against him, but...I'm a big, big Subban fan.

terrible mistake. You cant even compare the two.