NFL Bucket Draft Semi-Final 2 : Milk vs Nos

[Nosferatu]

See, this is what gets me... All the stats in the world say ALlen's top 3 seasons were better... But because you SAW Campbell, and allen Play, you have a bias because Campbell impressed you...

See this is what bothers me, you think using AV or total yards makes Allen better. Allen was used way more receiving thats the only thing that makes him even close in yards. Campbell ran for 5000 yards in 3 years and took the league by storm, you'd need to use 6 seasons for Allen to get to 5000 yard. Earl could have caught more balls out of the backfield that just simply wasnt the best way to use him.

Bias? No, Campbell was a better RUNNING BACK thats a fact not my opinion. If you want to talk about whos was the better reciever then you have something but running back to me means running back, someone you hand the ball to and block for and Campbell blows Allen out of the freakin water as a running back. Impressed me, lolzzz what a DA...

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Milk, just please answer me one thing out of curiosity. Did you actually see Allen and Campbell play in their primes?

No I didn't... Born in 1985... But Like I have said many times I don't like or trust the eye test... I am and always will be a stats person(afterall that is what I majored in college)... I always use stats for my arguments, and always will...

I have said many times though that football is tough for me, despite watching it all my life and loving it all my life, by not trusting the eye test, and with knowing that football stats are not very individual based, makes me question every stat I see... This vote, I tried using AV in different ways... I do think it does a good job for what I was trying to use it for... I do understand it is not a great stat...

 

[Nosferatu]

No I didn't... Born in 1985... But Like I have said many times I don't like or trust the eye test... I am and always will be a stats person(afterall that is what I majored in college)... I always use stats for my arguments, and always will...

I have said many times though that football is tough for me, despite watching it all my life and loving it all my life, by not trusting the eye test, and with knowing that football stats are not very individual based, makes me question every stat I see... This vote, I tried using AV in different ways... I do think it does a good job for what I was trying to use it for... I do understand it is not a great stat...

This is something I will NEVER understand, no offense Milk but if you actually seen them play youd feel foolish right now.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

This is something I will NEVER understand, no offense Milk but if you actually seen them play youd feel foolish right now.

So stats lie?? there is so much into a game... and running backs need so much to be successful... In fact, when demarco murray left the cowboys and they were going to settle on using Darren McFadden, I heard a lot of analysts(not just dallas homers) say McFadden has more talent than Murray, and should be just fine with that offensive line...

 

[Nosferatu]

Stats dont tell the entire story

 

[UK Cowboy]

No I didn't... Born in 1985... But Like I have said many times I don't like or trust the eye test... I am and always will be a stats person(afterall that is what I majored in college)... I always use stats for my arguments, and always will...

I have said many times though that football is tough for me, despite watching it all my life and loving it all my life, by not trusting the eye test, and with knowing that football stats are not very individual based, makes me question every stat I see... This vote, I tried using AV in different ways... I do think it does a good job for what I was trying to use it for... I do understand it is not a great stat...

Milk, Nos and I are both 46, saw both guys. The best comparison to a modern guy for Campbell, to me, would be AP.
Allen....maybe a slower Jamal Charles?

 

[UK Cowboy]

So stats lie?? there is so much into a game... and running backs need so much to be successful... In fact, when demarco murray left the cowboys and they were going to settle on using Darren McFadden, I heard a lot of analysts(not just dallas homers) say McFadden has more talent than Murray, and should be just fine with that offensive line...

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Milk, Nos and I are both 46, saw both guys. The best comparison to a modern guy for Campbell, to me, would be AP.
Allen....maybe a slower Jamal Charles?

I don't question your knowledge, I do question everyone's memory... People are nostalgic by nature, and remember what they want to remember... That's why in music THE CLASSICS are the 50s 60s and 70s music... Ask anyone, and they will always say that the best players were from their youth... We just remember how those players make us feel... But do you really think stats lie??

 

[Nosferatu]

I don't question your knowledge, I do question everyone's memory... People are nostalgic by nature, and remember what they want to remember... That's why in music THE CLASSICS are the 50s 60s and 70s music... Ask anyone, and they will always say that the best players were from their youth... We just remember how those players make us feel... But do you really think stats lie??

So you are questioning our memory becuase it doesnt fit your opinions. Well isn't that special. Classics are 50's 60's and 70's because they are the best of yesteryear that is the definition of classic, what do you call a 1964 impala? A classic right? Because its the best of yesteryear, believe it or not some of the music today will someday be called classic.

We remember what we want to remember, hmmmm... So why would I WANT to remember Earl Campbell being better than Marcus Allen? I have always been a Raiders fan, you might recall my all time favorite player was a Raider. What do I gain by remember Campbell being better? I actually wasnt an Oilers fan until Warren Moon...

 

[UK Cowboy]

I don't question your knowledge, I do question everyone's memory... People are nostalgic by nature, and remember what they want to remember... That's why in music THE CLASSICS are the 50s 60s and 70s music... Ask anyone, and they will always say that the best players were from their youth... We just remember how those players make us feel... But do you really think stats lie??

I gave you a clear example of how meaningless stats could be in football. Its the same in all sports. A stat guy sees a guy with a higher on base % and says ok, that's it.....but the other guy laid down the bunt, hit behind the runner, took a pitch.....did things to win. The basketball stat guy says, ok, this guy averaged 24, other guy 20, 24 wins.....but the 20 also made the good pass, set the pick, didn't Jack up a 1 on 4 3 pointer. Come on man, surely you can see this

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Stats dont tell the entire story

Who said they do? I have never used only one stat to prove anything...

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Milk, I actually respect the Hell out of your sports knowledge. I just don't get how you can let a statsheet trump what you see on the field.

QB A throws for 150 yards and 1 TD. He hands the ball off the entire 2nd half, because his team is up 25(Russell Wilson)

QB B starts the game with a pick 6, takes 3 sacks, and gets down 25. In the 2nd half, the defense gets in a prevent, gives him open check downs that they can tackle in bounds to run the clock. He passes for 350 yards and 3 TD's, and loses by 10.(Jay Cutler)

Both guys have similar games all season long
QB A goes 13-3, wins a Super Bowl
QB B goes 6-10, misses playoffs(but has 2000 more yards)

Your AV stat might say QB B is better..I still say watch the game

Shoulda used Rivers for option B.

Holy Fuck did he pad his stats this past Sunday in a game they were getting shredded.

 

[UK Cowboy]

Shoulda used Rivers for option B.

Holy Fuck did he pad his stats this past Sunday in a game they were getting shredded.

Rivers.....Cutler...Stafford...

 

[Nosferatu]

Shoulda used Rivers for option B.

Holy Fuck did he pad his stats this past Sunday in a game they were getting shredded.

Thankfully too, my 2 QBs in my Minnesota league to start the season were Romo and Ben I was able to get Rivers and I ended up winning by 8 this week with him scoring 22. Another very good example of stats not telling the story.

 

[Nosferatu]

Who said they do? I have never used only one stat to prove anything...

hahahaha, never used 1 stat? So you saying you use multiple stats? Or in other words you only use stats? lolzzz if you dont have the eye stat what else you using? You sure aint using mine or UK's opinions...

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Thankfully too, my 2 QBs in my Minnesota league to start the season were Romo and Ben I was able to get Rivers and I ended up winning by 8 this week with him scoring 22. Another very good example of stats not telling the story.

Yup. I think he had like 2.5 at half? My buddy texted me during last nights game saying how close his match up was and i thought he was up by 40. Turns out Rivers and someone else just owned that garbage time. Tough world fantasy.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

hahahaha, never used 1 stat? So you saying you use multiple stats? Or in other words you only use stats? lolzzz if you dont have the eye stat what else you using? You sure aint using mine or UK's opinions...

Basically what you are saying to me is that I will never be as good as you guys in these mocks because I wasn't able to see players before my time, and since you guys have 16+ years on me you know more... OK!!!

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Also, what the fuck is AV?

 

[Nosferatu]

Basically what you are saying to me is that I will never be as good as you guys in these mocks because I wasn't able to see players before my time, and since you guys have 20+ years on me you know more... OK!!!

No what im saying is use whatever you want but dont tell us you dont trust our memory! I dont care what stats you use to form your opinions just dont pass them off as right and mine as wrong. And its not 20+ dammit!!! lolzzzz

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Also, what the fuck is AV?

It is a stat given by football-reference... Its approximate value...