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NBA OFF TOPIC THREAD

dtgold88

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Does he really have leverage though?
If he's truly willing to sit out I guess he does, especially if he could play baseball (though might be in contract he cannot)....but, sure, the team could call his bluff and not like he's gonna just retire.
 

thunderc

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If he's truly willing to sit out I guess he does, especially if he could play baseball (though might be in contract he cannot)....but, sure, the team could call his bluff and not like he's gonna just retire.
I just don’t understand him taking this stance now. The team has a couple more weeks to pick up a $29 M option for the following year. I guess in effect he is saying that $34 M over 2 years is not enough. Maybe they will blink, but the Bidwells aren’t exactly the smartest folks around. Perhaps that is what he is counting on.
 

fightinfunbags

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Rookie contracts are slotted.

Very little room there.

No issue with Kyler using leverage to get a better deal. If anyone here was in Kyler’s position and had leverage in their side, they would be foolish not to do the same.
The Players Union has to do a better job of reinventing the game of football. The problem is that only about 10-12 guys on a 53 man roster can afford to actually hold out long enough. So the players union has to try and make the roster around 17-22 people deep and then they can actually do something. The fact that they haven’t reinvented the game is totally on them.
 

trojanfan12

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The Players Union has to do a better job of reinventing the game of football. The problem is that only about 10-12 guys on a 53 man roster can afford to actually hold out long enough. So the players union has to try and make the roster around 17-22 people deep and then they can actually do something. The fact that they haven’t reinvented the game is totally on them.

The bold is the key to the whole thing. How do you get salaries to the point that all 53 can afford a longer holdout? Unless they figure out a way to get enough money to the bottom half of the roster to be able to withstand a long holdout, they're always going to have this issue at every CBA.
 

thunderc

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The bold is the key to the whole thing. How do you get salaries to the point that all 53 can afford a longer holdout? Unless they figure out a way to get enough money to the bottom half of the roster to be able to withstand a long holdout, they're always going to have this issue at every CBA.
The minimum salary in the NFL is $660k. If the players would get together they could damn sure work something out to be able to go a full season without pay. That’s what it would take to make real change. I personally think it’s the higher paid guys that have more power that don’t want to sacrifice the big numbers. The owners are always going to use that to their advantage.
 

trojanfan12

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The minimum salary in the NFL is $660k. If the players would get together they could damn sure work something out to be able to go a full season without pay. That’s what it would take to make real change. I personally think it’s the higher paid guys that have more power that don’t want to sacrifice the big numbers. The owners are always going to use that to their advantage.

I agree. But @tlance makes a good point that NFL careers are so short that sitting out 1 season could cost a guy any shot he had at sticking in the league because every practice and every second on the field is very important for them.
 

tlance

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Then, they need to wait their turn or they can take their chances like Kyler Murray is.

But that isn't what the discussion was about. If he chooses to hold out, he isn't honoring the contract he signed. Another poster tried to argue that teams don't honor their contracts when that isn't true.

He is using his leverage to threaten a hold out.

Trying to say that is a bad thing is crazy.

If he sits out the season?

Then maybe you have a point. Threatening to do so though is how the game is played.
 

trojanfan12

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He is using his leverage to threaten a hold out.

Trying to say that is a bad thing is crazy.

If he sits out the season?

Then maybe you have a point. Threatening to do so though is how the game is played.

Never said it was a bad thing. I said he's not honoring his contract if he refuses to play. Whether it's a good thing, a bad thing or a nothing burger...is subjective.

I do have a point and the point is that he is not honoring his contract if he refuses to play.

How long he sits out is irrelevant. Every day that he is supposed to be at work and he isn't there is a day that he's not honoring his contract.
 

fightinfunbags

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The bold is the key to the whole thing. How do you get salaries to the point that all 53 can afford a longer holdout? Unless they figure out a way to get enough money to the bottom half of the roster to be able to withstand a long holdout, they're always going to have this issue at every CBA.
And that’s the root of my position. The logic here is a cat chasing it’s tail. That condition of getting the whole 53 to that level is a pipe dream. And it’s impossible in the existing CBA ha. That’s why in my opinion it’s disingenuous to say “oh well, collectively bargain better”. They can’t. This is legitimately the best they can collectively do. That’s why I’m saying it’s paramount for a dude in Murray’s position to act when he is in a position of leverage. And it bothers me when people throw this back on the player especially when those people can seemingly see the same issues with this being slanted as what I’ve pointed out.
 

trojanfan12

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And that’s the root of my position. The logic here is a cat chasing it’s tail. That condition of getting the whole 53 to that level is a pipe dream. And it’s impossible in the existing CBA ha. That’s why in my opinion it’s disingenuous to say “oh well, collectively bargain better”. They can’t. This is legitimately the best they can collectively do. That’s why I’m saying it’s paramount for a dude in Murray’s position to act when he is in a position of leverage. And it bothers me when people throw this back on the player especially when those people can seemingly see the same issues with this being slanted as what I’ve pointed out.

But at the end of the day, if he holds out...he's not honoring his contract. Also, why do it now? Why not honor what he signed, then when it's up, he can holdout if the Cardinals won't pay him what he thinks he's worth?
 

fightinfunbags

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But at the end of the day, if he holds out...he's not honoring his contract. Also, why do it now? Why not honor what he signed, then when it's up, he can holdout if the Cardinals won't pay him what he thinks he's worth?
Because this is the way he maximizes his revenue. Why play for 14 mil a year when you can negotiate for 45 mil? You get the bag when you can. Isn’t that what we all do in our walks of life? We want to maximize our income and get paid relative to our value.
 

trojanfan12

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Because this is the way he maximizes his revenue. Why play for 14 mil a year when you can negotiate for 45 mil? You get the bag when you can. Isn’t that what we all do in our walks of life? We want to maximize our income and get paid relative to our value.

Just can't complain if it doesn't work out how you want it to and if you want to do it in the middle of a contract you signed, don't complain when people call you out for not honoring your contract.
 

fightinfunbags

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Just can't complain if it doesn't work out how you want it to and if you want to do it in the middle of a contract you signed, don't complain when people call you out for not honoring your contract.
The not working out? I’m on board. Going for great reward will also entail risk. I’m saying the player has the right to weigh that and act. Disagree with the commentary from the peanut gallery. I think that’s dismissive of the facts on the ground in assessing this system.
 

bksballer89

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I just don’t understand him taking this stance now. The team has a couple more weeks to pick up a $29 M option for the following year. I guess in effect he is saying that $34 M over 2 years is not enough. Maybe they will blink, but the Bidwells aren’t exactly the smartest folks around. Perhaps that is what he is counting on.

34 over 2 years is mediocre qb numbers
 

DJ Fieri

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Then, they need to wait their turn or they can take their chances like Kyler Murray is.

But that isn't what the discussion was about. If he chooses to hold out, he isn't honoring the contract he signed. Another poster tried to argue that teams don't honor their contracts when that isn't true.
This.
 
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