MLB Dynasty Draft

[broncosmitty]

Damn we all got great teams it's going to be really tough deciding a winner.

I do think its going to be a tight one, no matter how we do it. There are some bullpens that are a little suspect in comparison. A couple rotations that stand out and such. But I think the drafting went well. Other than bullpens there weren't many guys drafted that surprised me. And Im not exactly sure who else should have been drafted as a reliever that wasn't.

 

[Nosferatu]

I'd put Cobb/Bonds/Mays/Aaron ahead. Williams was definitely on their level (if not better), but he had a considerably shorter career than each of them.

Williams 19 seasons, lost 3 to the war.
Mays 22 seasons, lost 1 to the war
Aaron 23 seasons
Cobb 24 seasons
Bonds 22 seasons

So not really "considerably" shorter. He lost 3 prime years to the war age 24, 25 & 26. If he had played those seasons and averaged what he did for his career he would have over 600 HR's, over 2,000 RBI's and over 3,000 Hits. His career OBP is almost .100 points higher than Mays. Gehrig's numbers are as impressive as Williams'. He averaged nearly an RBI per game in his career, I don't care who he had batting around him that's insanely good. He had an amazing 163 triples in his career which is more than Mays and Mays had nearly 3,000 more plate appearances than Gehrig.

Bonds doesn't belong in this conversation IMO, he could have been in this conversation if not for the roids, he was already on his way to becoming at least top 10 player of all time and i'm sorry amphetamines is not in any way the same as steroids. Cobb was an amazing player but a different kind of player than the others we are talking about, but I won't argue him being top 5 but #2, I just don't think so.

 

[Nosferatu]

Sporting News and ESPN has Mays at #2.

Baseball Reference has him #4 but also has Wagner at #6 and Musial at #7. Baseball Reference also has Pete Alexander at #2 and Kid Nichols at #8 in pitching. I'll gladly use them as a reference.

I really don't use others opinions when judging players, I've loved baseball more than any sport by far for nearly 40 years and have formed my own opinions, no way Mays is #2 over Williams and Gehrig. I could also make an argument for Mantle being better than Mays but that is just my opinion.

 

[broncosmitty]

I will say, I love my team speed. Ricky, Cobb, Cool Papa, Molitor, George Davis, Larkin even Frank Robinson will be looking to swipe a bag. (Nowhere is stealing more respected than baseball.)

 

[Nosferatu]

Yeah smitty, we should have talked about the bullpen a little more, like Clayton said we got all the greatest players of all time on our teams then we got some relievers who never even made an all star team.

 

[Nosferatu]

I will say, I love my team speed. Ricky, Cobb, Cool Papa, Molitor, George Davis, Larkin even Frank Robinson will be looking to swipe a bag. (Nowhere is stealing more respected than baseball.)

Ever been to NYC?

 

[UK Cowboy]

Or should we just have people vote on the every position in the starting lineup, the backups, starting pitching & relief pitching?

I would do it based on who would win a series. I picked my team for pitching and defense, not fantasy stats lol

 

[da55bums]

found him

 

[Ritzarmy]

Who would be team captain on your team would be another amazing debate. Since I grew up a O's fan and even if I didn't I would say Cal Iron Man Ripken would be my teams Captain.

 

[broncosmitty]

Williams 19 seasons, lost 3 to the war.
Mays 22 seasons, lost 1 to the war
Aaron 23 seasons
Cobb 24 seasons
Bonds 22 seasons

So not really "considerably" shorter. He lost 3 prime years to the war age 24, 25 & 26. If he had played those seasons and averaged what he did for his career he would have over 600 HR's, over 2,000 RBI's and over 3,000 Hits. His career OBP is almost .100 points higher than Mays. Gehrig's numbers are as impressive as Williams'. He averaged nearly an RBI per game in his career, I don't care who he had batting around him that's insanely good. He had an amazing 163 triples in his career which is more than Mays and Mays had nearly 3,000 more plate appearances than Gehrig.

Bonds doesn't belong in this conversation IMO, he could have been in this conversation if not for the roids, he was already on his way to becoming at least top 10 player of all time and i'm sorry amphetamines is not in any way the same as steroids. Cobb was an amazing player but a different kind of player than the others we are talking about, but I won't argue him being top 5 but #2, I just don't think so.

It appears our opinions are going to be very far apart on a few things Nos. (Greenberg also missed three seasons on account of the war. ) Cuz if Im bumping Cobb to 3, it's Bonds that's slipping into the #2 spot. Hitting behind Ruth is definitely an advantage no other player got to expierience like Gehrig. Id like to point everyone's attention to the alltime runs list, if I could. (Since I have the top two (one of which is also 8th in RBI)and my 1,2,3 hitters are all top 15....).

 

[broncosmitty]

Who would be team captain on your team would be another amazing debate. Since I grew up a O's fan and even if I didn't I would say Cal Iron Man Ripken would be my teams Captain.

Cobb is my player/manager. Unless Frank Robinson is my player/manager. Or George Davis or Nap Lajoie. Im not sure Ill be able to figure out a Captain until after I figure out who's writing the lineup card.

 

[navamind]

Lineup projections, for shits and giggles.

 

[Nosferatu]

It appears our opinions are going to be very far apart on a few things Nos. (Greenberg also missed three seasons on account of the war. ) Cuz if Im bumping Cobb to 3, it's Bonds that's slipping into the #2 spot. Hitting behind Ruth is definitely an advantage no other player got to expierience like Gehrig. Id like to point everyone's attention to the alltime runs list, if I could. (Since I have the top two (one of which is also 8th in RBI)and my 1,2,3 hitters are all top 15....).

Greenberg was an awesome player but he's not in that top tier and you know it, also not surprised at you ranking him and Cobb so high, what team did they play for?

Gehrig hitting behind Babe wasn't as great as you might think. It's not like Babe left the bases full very often. And it's not like Gehrig had amazing players batting behind him, you could say Ruth batting in front of Gehrig helped Babe more than it did Gehrig.

In my opinion Bonds does not belong in the conversation with these guys. He's in the 2nd or maybe even 3rd tier of greats and like Ritz said the roids drop him down a little.

 

[Pack 500]

Williams or Gehrig would be #2 IMO.

Gehrig has better hitting stats so I went with Lou. Obviously splitting hairs

 

[navamind]

Better stats than Ted?

Williams: .344/.482/.634, 190 OPS+
Gehrig: .340/.447/.632, 179 OPS+

Williams had a 35 point advantage in OBP, which is pretty big. Gehrig averaged more RBI/runs scored, but Gehrig also played in a more hitter-friendly era than Williams did.

Major League Baseball Batting Encyclopedia - Baseball-Reference.com

 

[Pack 500]

Gherig .340 avg, .493 wOBA, 173 wRC+, 1.080 OPS > Mays .302 avg, .409 wOBA, 154 wRC+, .941 OPS

 

[Nosferatu]

Gehrig has better hitting stats so I went with Lou. Obviously splitting hairs

Not really.

162 game averages.

Gehrig .340 AVG .447 OBP 37 HR 149 RBI
Williams . 344 AVG .482 OBP 37 HR 130 RBI

But yeah, splitting hairs I guess...

 

[Ritzarmy]

Ok so how is the voting going to be?

 

[navamind]

Gherig .340 avg, .493 wOBA, 173 wRC+, 1.080 OPS > Mays .302 avg, .409 wOBA, 154 wRC+, .941 OPS

In that case, yeah, Gehrig was unquestionably the better hitter than Mays. However, Mays played a more demanding position (and Mays is widely considered to be among the best defensive CF of all-time, though the title of greatest probably belongs to Andruw Jones now) and Mays was a great baserunner. Mays also played a good portion of his career in a very pitcher-friendly era while Gehrig played in the live ball era.

 

[broncosmitty]

Greenberg was an awesome player but he's not in that top tier and you know it, also not surprised at you ranking him and Cobb so high, what team did they play for?

Gehrig hitting behind Babe wasn't as great as you might think. It's not like Babe left the bases full very often. And it's not like Gehrig had amazing players batting behind him, you could say Ruth batting in front of Gehrig helped Babe more than it did Gehrig.

In my opinion Bonds does not belong in the conversation with these guys. He's in the 2nd or maybe even 3rd tier of greats and like Ritz said the roids drop him down a little.

Im not trying to slip Greenberg into the Top Tier.(He may be the only GM who was drafted though, not sure.) Just mentioned him because Teddy Ballgame wasn't the only great to miss a chunk of their prime. If we're projecting numbers for vets it opens a door for a lot of players. (Cobb might have missed time in 1918. He was a Captain in the Army in WWI.)

Look at all those runs Babe scored. (Minus 714). Im guessing a good chunk of Gehrigs RBI were Babe crossing home plate.

I don't even know what to say about Bonds being 2nd or 3rd Tier. Barry didn't cheat anymore than all the guys Nava mentioned, in my eyes or the eyes of baseball at the time.