Mariners trade deadline thread 2023

[ulmax]

For.3b..there are.not that many..ready to come up at any one time..
So a possable..opertunitys..at westburg.
Would be fairly big...
Cuz.baltimre has..gunner Henderson...

The next.gunner Henderson..in the draft
From.hs..mississipi...
Guys.name..is Pratt.forgot.his 1st name..
But yeah..
But they don't want to wait that long..for a 3b.

.

 

[ulmax]

Baseball..operations..that means all..
He reports to..the owners..
He helps where.he thinks he is needed.
If..
Like with the new..gm..maybe..
There.a.team.still are...just hollander.does.
All the work..
Jerry..comes and sayes ok.lets ba ba ba..
What ever..

 

[ulmax]

The thing is, really how much money is he making them though? Record profits are definitely hard to argue against but they created a position for the business side and already had an established one of the better PR and marketing staffs in pro sports. Then it came out prior to the season start than Hollander has been the real GM for a few years now just not in name.

My bias is obvious but I’m not sure of how much credit or blame Jerry gets for anything anymore. If he gets the credit for the record profit then they are wasting high 6 figures on whatever the ladies name is, and if he gets the blame then they are wasting 6 figures on Hollander.

Ok I get what you are .saying..let's look at it a bit.differant..all.thuoghs offeice..personal..
Work..for dipoto...he's the boss..
In..every..baseball 0peration..
Of the.mariners..

If that helps ,.understanding....
He can't do it all..he delegates..everything.
And oversees...everything..

 

[ulmax]

Remember the Howard Hughes story.in.the begining...the guy with the suit..talking to Howard getting hired.for the job..
That is dipoto..
He runs the boat..so..the owners don't have to.

 

[NWinAZ]

The thing is, really how much money is he making them though? Record profits are definitely hard to argue against but they created a position for the business side and already had an established one of the better PR and marketing staffs in pro sports. Then it came out prior to the season start than Hollander has been the real GM for a few years now just not in name.

My bias is obvious but I’m not sure of how much credit or blame Jerry gets for anything anymore. If he gets the credit for the record profit then they are wasting high 6 figures on whatever the ladies name is, and if he gets the blame then they are wasting 6 figures on Hollander.

He has built a team that hangs around long enough to keep our attention and gets our money. He talks big which keeps a large fanbase talking him up. He runs a great baseball side of it if you are an investor. Higher than ever profits with no real backlash.

I don't anything about Hollander being the real GM for years. He does all the background work I am guess as an assistant would, but final call would have always been Dipoto's. He is too much of a control freak not to have his name be the final stamp of approval. Again, if you are a stock holder, Dipoto is your man.

 

[seahawksfan234]

No I was serious. They love him because he makes them $$$$$

I know over the years I've gone on and on about how this ownership group runs this franchise more like an investment that prioritizes profits/appreciation on investment over investing in the product on the field, but I really do believe that.

I don't know why this is just hitting me, but do you know where ownership has spent money the last two offseasons? Renovation of the third level concourse, renovation of the Diamond club, signed a 23 year lease for the building that used to be the Pyramid brewery and renovated it into what they call "Steelheads Alley." The money they've spent on the team has been to increase the amount of revenue they bring in, but not through improving the on field product.

 

[NWinAZ]

I know over the years I've gone on and on about how this ownership group runs this franchise more like an investment that prioritizes profits/appreciation on investment over investing in the product on the field, but I really do believe that.

I don't know why this is just hitting me, but do you know where ownership has spent money the last two offseasons? Renovation of the third level concourse, renovation of the Diamond club, signed a 23 year lease for the building that used to be the Pyramid brewery and renovated it into what they call "Steelheads Alley." The money they've spent on the team has been to increase the amount of revenue they bring in, but not through improving the on field product.

I don't think that is any different than any other Mariners ownership. It is an investment for all of them but the Nintendo group who I truly believe did it for the fans and were repaid by MLB by not allowing them to make any decisions on their team.

All owners want to make money, but some organizations do it while honestly trying to win. Winning is a byproduct for Seattle owners. Howard Lincoln said it best years ago.

 

[seahawksfan234]

The thing is, really how much money is he making them though? Record profits are definitely hard to argue against but they created a position for the business side and already had an established one of the better PR and marketing staffs in pro sports. Then it came out prior to the season start than Hollander has been the real GM for a few years now just not in name.

My bias is obvious but I’m not sure of how much credit or blame Jerry gets for anything anymore. If he gets the credit for the record profit then they are wasting high 6 figures on whatever the ladies name is, and if he gets the blame then they are wasting 6 figures on Hollander.

I don't know how this compares to other franchises, but here are a few relevant reasons why ownership likely loves Dipoto. Here are some numbers since he was hired in 2015.

2014 revenue: $250m
2023 revenue: $363m

2014 franchise value: $800m
2023 franchise value: $2.2b

Additionally, Mariners home attendance average is at it's highest since 2008.

From an investment perspective, ownership has the right guy running the ship.

 

[seahawksfan234]

So far..I'm sure.owner shp is.happy with..
What jedi.has.done....but they must.continue.
With more young guys..
Jordan westburg..of baltimore..is a prime.target...and.baltimore..is starting to.
Need bull pen guys....westburg so far..
16..at bats..for 313..ave..ok..not a huge sample..but mariners need..him..
Mariners need..a 3b of the future..

Jedi..must not fail..in.this.and a 2b..
Especially..2b..all fans know it...
It's time .to do something about it..

Westberg is actually a really interesting option. We don't really have any organizational depth at 3B.

 

[wazzu31]

I don't know how this compares to other franchises, but here are a few relevant reasons why ownership likely loves Dipoto. Here are some numbers since he was hired in 2015.

2014 revenue: $250m
2023 revenue: $363m

2014 franchise value: $800m
2023 franchise value: $2.2b

Additionally, Mariners home attendance average is at it's highest since 2008.

From an investment perspective, ownership has the right guy running the ship.

I can’t honestly make a legitimate rebuttal. I am just trying to play devils advocate cause every teams revenue and value has gone way up since Dipoto was hired and the Mariners also have a huge advantage because with zero input from Jerry they purchased Root Sports which tv deals going bankrupt are a big issue now in baseball.

 

[seahawksfan234]

I don't think that is any different than any other Mariners ownership. It is an investment for all of them but the Nintendo group who I truly believe did it for the fans and were repaid by MLB by not allowing them to make any decisions on their team.

All owners want to make money, but some organizations do it while honestly trying to win. Winning is a byproduct for Seattle owners. Howard Lincoln said it best years ago.

I know they are imperfect examples, but look at the Rangers, Mets and Padres. The Rangers have given out probably a billion in contracts the last two offseasons, all while spending a billion on building a new stadium (idk how much the city of Arlington fronted). The Mets are owned by one of the greatest hedge fund investors of all time and spared no cent in adding players. I have a friend who works for his hedge fund, and even there he spares no expense when it comes to attracting the best talent. Shit, their Hudson Yards office looks like something out of a fucking sci-fi film.

I think your last point hits it on the head. If they win, that's great. If they don't, well they're not going to buy players to win.

Unless something drastically changes I think this is just an unfortunate reality we will have to live with.

 

[NWinAZ]

I know they are imperfect examples, but look at the Rangers, Mets and Padres. The Rangers have given out probably a billion in contracts the last two offseasons, all while spending a billion on building a new stadium (idk how much the city of Arlington fronted). The Mets are owned by one of the greatest hedge fund investors of all time and spared no cent in adding players. I have a friend who works for his hedge fund, and even there he spares no expense when it comes to attracting the best talent. Shit, their Hudson Yards office looks like something out of a fucking sci-fi film.

I think your last point hits it on the head. If they win, that's great. If they don't, well they're not going to buy players to win.

Unless something drastically changes I think this is just an unfortunate reality we will have to live with.

Good story on Cohen. Glad to see someone treat their people right.

Ya Texas got bashed for their spending last offseason yet their two year plan beat our five year plan in a second. Good for them. I love what they have done so I will root for them when we are done.

 

[seahawksfan234]

I can’t honestly make a legitimate rebuttal. I am just trying to play devils advocate cause every teams revenue and value has gone way up since Dipoto was hired and the Mariners also have a huge advantage because with zero input from Jerry they purchased Root Sports which tv deals going bankrupt are a big issue now in baseball.

Fair enough. I think they see him as a guy who has delivered record revenue, incredible franchise appreciation and broke a 20 year playoff drought, all while not spending a commensurate amount on payroll.

As far as the Root Sports thing goes, honestly I have no idea the financials with that. I haven't heard anything about Root Sports being a financial liability and I know nothing about the networks that were having issues, so I could be talking completely out my ass here, but I'd imagine the networks that were having issues were perhaps just the ones that weren't as diversified in terms of product offerings as Root is. Root Sports I believe has the broadcasting rights to the Mariners, Trailblazers and Kraken which gives them year round offerings. The regional networks that focused only on baseball are probably the ones having issues as they don't have anything to offer in those off months.

Once again that's me completely blind guessing and I could be incredibly wrong on all of the above, but if I had to guess with minimal knowledge of the situation that would be it.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Good story on Cohen. Glad to see someone treat their people right.

Ya Texas got bashed for their spending last offseason yet their two year plan beat our five year plan in a second. Good for them. I love what they have done so I will root for them when we are done.

The irony about her situation is that the bonus she received from his fund was so large that when she saw how much was taken out in taxes she started thinking about moving out of Manhattan lol.

 

[wazzu31]

Fair enough. I think they see him as a guy who has delivered record revenue, incredible franchise appreciation and broke a 20 year playoff drought, all while not spending a commensurate amount on payroll.

As far as the Root Sports thing goes, honestly I have no idea the financials with that. I haven't heard anything about Root Sports being a financial liability and I know nothing about the networks that were having issues, so I could be talking completely out my ass here, but I'd imagine the networks that were having issues were perhaps just the ones that weren't as diversified in terms of product offerings as Root is. Root Sports I believe has the broadcasting rights to the Mariners, Trailblazers and Kraken which gives them year round offerings. The regional networks that focused only on baseball are probably the ones having issues as they don't have anything to offer in those off months.

Once again that's me completely blind guessing and I could be incredibly wrong on all of the above, but if I had to guess with minimal knowledge of the situation that would be it.

Yeah I am 100% grasping at straws in my devils advocate role. Stanton and co obviously are thrilled with Jerry otherwise he wouldn’t have gotten the big promotion. I am blind on it cause as a fan I don’t care about revenue so I keep leaving that out when I make my arguments.

I honestly don’t know alot about the other regional networks that are going bankrupt and what their programming is. I know one of the big ones that was going bankrupt owned a fairly big wrestling promotion that had to be sold off. But while it was going down a solid argument that the Mariners are in great position when it comes to that though. And are in amazing position if the Sonics come back….and why I fully expect them to use all the power they can to keep pro baseball out of Portland.

I’m also talking out of my ass pretending I know business and it obviously is a lot more complicated than I am making it out to be as you can see with all of arguments minimizing the profit they are bringing in.

 

[ulmax]

I know they are imperfect examples, but look at the Rangers, Mets and Padres. The Rangers have given out probably a billion in contracts the last two offseasons, all while spending a billion on building a new stadium (idk how much the city of Arlington fronted). The Mets are owned by one of the greatest hedge fund investors of all time and spared no cent in adding players. I have a friend who works for his hedge fund, and even there he spares no expense when it comes to attracting the best talent. Shit, their Hudson Yards office looks like something out of a fucking sci-fi film.

I think your last point hits it on the head. If they win, that's great. If they don't, well they're not going to buy players to win.

Unless something drastically changes I think this is just an unfortunate reality we will have to live with.

This.is..depotos.point..whitch..i.agree.with.
Up.to.a.point..
He wants a sustained.winner...and he is close.
To that ...
the trades.that.will.help.at.this.point..
For 2 players..that he can go forward.
With..are.not..just.poping.up.at.him..

It has to be in an..other..teams.interest.
To do..the .trade..such as westburg.trade.
Enven though..I would..like him.
The chances.are not .good....
Will..Baltimore..have some available..2b/3b.
Yeah sometimes soon..I don't know exactly when..and I don't know..that it will be westburg...as they..see..him.in.a cris.taylor.
Way..10th guy ..
They have maney other middle infields.
They will.not be able to keep..them..all.
So..a lesser.trade. .may still be possable.

 

[ulmax]

So waiting for one to come available.is.
Also..take.time maybe.not..
Cinncinati.is.somewhat.in he same boat.
Over a bit more time .
So waiting is in..the mariners interest..
It is what they..should do for.the long..
Run..
If we.can use..the Mets as an..example..

There.a.train..wreck...they did not win.anything...
They spent .till.they could spenr no more..
And still..nothing...
What does it .mean...????.

.what it means..is this..you take it easy.
Get the guys who..are available..

Gurriel..jr..RF..in..free.agentsy...why..??.

Cuz he hits for..power..and average..
Hanigar..and.gurriel jr .are really..close.
And what.the mariners.need....

Yes..Julio..can do..this..he hits..for average.
And power...he is just..not..himself..this year..
In prior..years..he was .average..over..power.
He needs to..
Do that again.

Soon..johnaton..clase..they will want..to.
Leadoff..
With..Crawford..2nd

A line up..

1.clase.....LF
2.crawford..left.young.left

3.france..1b..is..this..a.prob...yeah.france.2arb..like..a demming hitter..1b.R/R.would be good.solve.it before it gets here..is a good idea

4garcia..2b.left.shanuel..1b.left
5Julio
6gurriel..jr .dh.locklear..dh.1b

7kelenic..rf......left
8raliegh..catch


9..3b..left..so this becomes.the unsolvedvprob

Bench.
Ford .
Moore .
Cabalero..
Deloach.....
Santana ...maybe .

 

[ulmax]

Yes they..may .be able to get..Garcia..
Or.some..one.like.him..is the other prob.

 

[ulmax]

Yeah I use demming..as an example.for.
France..
Cuz .his slg is..915..best in NCAA .
And he is better .at 1b.as.france.is..

 

[ulmax]

Yeah I know..it's 3 1b..but .ya gotta have.
A dh..just what it is .
And Shcanuel too.good.to pass up..
Average .and power..he has it..