Mariners trade deadline thread 2023

[ulmax]

Loser: Seattle Mariners​

Look, trading closer Paul Sewald won’t crush this team’s chances. No reliever carries that much heft. Yet despite a team that could’ve reasonably gone either way or stood pat, GM Jerry Dipoto seemingly pulled the trigger on a seller’s move for a less enticing return than others netted for pitching at this trade deadline.

Paul Sewald​

RP - ARI - #38
2023 SEASON
43.0
IP
21
SV
2.93
ERA
60
K
14
BB
Sewald, who is under team control for 2024, brought back three hitters — rookie outfielder Dominic Canzone, third baseman Josh Rojas and middle-infield prospect Ryan Bliss — from the Arizona Diamondbacks, but none of them charts as a likely difference-maker for a team lacking offensive punch and still craving moments in the sun of the playoffs. Even if the value calculation works out in the long term, it smacks of the same middling defeatism that nearly caused a team mutiny over a similar deal sending Kendall Graveman away in 2021.

There is enough eye-popping starting pitching talent in Seattle to make waves, but Dipoto keeps churning the rest of the roster without taking enough decisive action to put a full-fledged contender on the field. This feels like another example of that.




From Yahoo sports

You say .this .but if they traded..that starting
Pitching...they would have nothing...

Saying that .makes you ...less than..

.leave the rotation alone..Jackson..

 

[ulmax]

You say .this .but if they traded..that starting
Pitching...they would have nothing...

Saying that .makes you ...less than..

.leave the rotation alone..Jackson..

Ohh I see..yahoo.is east coasters..
Who are not mariners fans

..they are drooling..over the marines rotation..
East coaster are there

.own kind of freaks....
And accuse .the mariners of having a rotation...
Haaaaa....you bet we do...freak..

 

[ulmax]

Yeah I know mariners fans dont understand it either..
But..its a maney fold .thing..

1money....check
2.talent... ??I'll.check this one.for know .
3 minirs..check
4 future....check.
5lineup...re vamp...bench...almost .
With. Moore.left....
Also.to maney strike outs..

You mean..you put a strike out guy .in..
For a strike out guy ..?¿¿

Boggles
the brain.....

 

[ulmax]

But with moore still on board..they should have traded. Hernandez at least..

Grissom.seemed avaliable..if he could play outfield..he does not...

But he should..
What's up with that..Atlanta shooting themselves..in the foot..

But.india...is the guy Seattle needs..

Cabellero takes.over..for .Moore ..
India..for..cabellero.

1crawfird....ss
2 india ...2b..only strikes out at normal rate.
3ford...1b.DH..
4.france...
5 Julio.....strikes
6 kelenic......strikes
7 Suarez..3b..strikes..
8 canzone..
9 raliegh..catch...strikes

Bench..
Murphy...
Cabellero..
Rojas...

Hernandez...right..outfield..or traded..for.
A right .outfield .

With Hernandez .and Moore..gone..

Julio..
Kelenic..
Suarez...Rojas .platoon..

Raliegh .
Still..4x..strikes

 

[ulmax]

Julio could strike out less..he was an ave guy.
In AA..
Julio..is not playing like .Julio.

.we know..
The sruggles.of kelenic..he may.strike out..
Suarez .can cut his down as well
And moved up in the line up automatically does....and platoon Rojas .ok.
Julio and Suarez...

Kelenic ..ahh .work on it..
Raliegh. Same

Hernandez ..over at end of year .Moore..
Trade .

 

[ulmax]

If mariners..are down to.basicly..
Kelenic .strikes out..

Cuz raliegh..has Murphy..platoon..

Stuff is better ..
So we. Have to see...

India would have helped...,.no doubt..

 

[NWinAZ]

From ESPN+

Win, lose -- what does it all mean?​

Seattle Mariners

At the very least, you have to be happy for president of baseball operations Jerry DiPoto, who got to spend a lot of time on the phone the past few days and move players around here and there. I guess the Mariners offloaded? Or maybe they added? OK, I'm not sure what the Mariners did. Dealing away high-leverage reliever Sewald was likely a bigger short-term hit than the positives from any of the players DiPoto added. It wasn't that long ago that Josh Rojas was considered an exciting young hitter, but if he's coming to Seattle in search of his missing batting average, he's going to the wrong place.

 

[wazzu31]

The amount of Dipoto hate is crazy what trade did he lose out on I am curious? I don't know if people where expecting us to Ohtani in return for Sewald but I am actually surprised we got what we got for a 33 year old journey player with above average stats this season. We got back 2 starters and a prospect. We wouldn't be doing this if Mr. emotional Kelenic wasn't out here kicking things whenever something does go his way breaking his leg or continue with Wong at 2nd base we just landed other options moving forward.

They didn’t get two starters. They got two role players. People are upset with Jerry because objectively made the team worse when this was suppose to a season when they could challenge for a WS

 

[seattlefan75]

They didn’t get two starters. They got two role players. People are upset with Jerry because objectively made the team worse when this was suppose to a season when they could challenge for a WS

We got role players until they are not. Ty France was a role player coming from the Padres, Haniger was a role player coming from Arizona, JP Crawford was a bust coming from Philly, Marco Gonzales was damaged goods coming from the cardinals, Tom Murphy was a rotational guy in Colorado, Mike Ford was a back up journeyman, Paul Sewald was a nobody from the Mets.

I am not saying all his projects work out but I do think when he approaches teams looking to trade for a quality starting player under team control I am sure that the first thing teams inquire in return are names like Cole Young or Harry Ford. So going the approach of finding guys that may have the talent but just need some development and playing time.

Lasty and this is a personal opinion if it wasnt for that 22 game win streak in the middle of the season I dont think the Mariners would have made the playoffs. They are pretty much the same team from last year as this year.

 

[wazzu31]

We got role players until they are not. Ty France was a role player coming from the Padres, Haniger was a role player coming from Arizona, JP Crawford was a bust coming from Philly, Marco Gonzales was damaged goods coming from the cardinals, Tom Murphy was a rotational guy in Colorado, Mike Ford was a back up journeyman, Paul Sewald was a nobody from the Mets.

I am not saying all his projects work out but I do think when he approaches teams looking to trade for a quality starting player under team control I am sure that the first thing teams inquire in return are names like Cole Young or Harry Ford. So going the approach of finding guys that may have the talent but just need some development and playing time.

Lasty and this is a personal opinion if it wasnt for that 22 game win streak in the middle of the season I dont think the Mariners would have made the playoffs. They are pretty much the same team from last year as this year.

Your talking of moves when the team was in full rebuild mode, not in a winning window like Jerry had sold us. Rojas is a slight upgrade over Wong, Canzone is still basically a prospect. If any other team traded their closer for Wong and a rookie Kelenic would that be a buy or sell. Maybe these guys Jerry got will turn into studs the way JP developed eventually, but those 2 are role players on this current team and if you are in a playoff race you don’t trade your best bullpen arm for two role players, call it a day and consider it a success.

Your point is why there is legitimate hate for Jerry. None of the fans that are upset that Jerry didn’t do his core job at the deadline were ever asking to trade Cole Young or Harry Ford, nor did any bats go for the equivalent of Young or Ford except the Mets who bought prospects which the Mariners should’ve absolutely taken that deal. Fans weren’t begging for Ohtani or Soto or a star

Agree, but your last sentence is why the fans are mad. This still is essentially the same team as last year which means Jerry has failed.

 

[seattlefan75]

Your talking of moves when the team was in full rebuild mode, not in a winning window like Jerry had sold us. Rojas is a slight upgrade over Wong, Canzone is still basically a prospect. If any other team traded their closer for Wong and a rookie Kelenic would that be a buy or sell. Maybe these guys Jerry got will turn into studs the way JP developed eventually, but those 2 are role players on this current team and if you are in a playoff race you don’t trade your best bullpen arm for two role players, call it a day and consider it a success.

Your point is why there is legitimate hate for Jerry. None of the fans that are upset that Jerry didn’t do his core job at the deadline were ever asking to trade Cole Young or Harry Ford, nor did any bats go for the equivalent of Young or Ford except the Mets who bought prospects which the Mariners should’ve absolutely taken that deal. Fans weren’t begging for Ohtani or Soto or a star

Agree, but your last sentence is why the fans are mad. This still is essentially the same team as last year which means Jerry has failed.

Well then we just view failure and what direction the franchise should be going in way differently. If all you guys believe the right move was to trade our 1st round picks for a couple of 40 year old washed up pitchers all for the sake of making the playoffs you guys can throw away my vote. So it would be worth it to trade our prospects for these rental players and lose in the playoffs? We need long term thinking because there will be a 2024 season and beyond that and with no prospects and that rental player retiring or leaving we would be pressured into spending money on free agents and that's how franchises end up in bad spots like the Mets and Padres.

Also I will say I am a fan of Jerry because there was more success under his time here than what the Mariners have done since 2001. You have to give him credit as drafting/signing Logan Gilbert, George Kirby and Julio Rodriguez they are the best players this organization has seen since Felix Hernandez left. Jerry has been in charge for about 8 seasons and 6 of those were winning seasons I definitely believe this man knows baseball and knows what he is doing.

 

[wazzu31]

Well then we just view failure and what direction the franchise should be going in way differently. If all you guys believe the right move was to trade our 1st round picks for a couple of 40 year old washed up pitchers all for the sake of making the playoffs you guys can throw away my vote. So it would be worth it to trade our prospects for these rental players and lose in the playoffs? We need long term thinking because there will be a 2024 season and beyond that and with no prospects and that rental player retiring or leaving we would be pressured into spending money on free agents and that's how franchises end up in bad spots like the Mets and Padres.

Also I will say I am a fan of Jerry because there was more success under his time here than what the Mariners have done since 2001. You have to give him credit as drafting/signing Logan Gilbert, George Kirby and Julio Rodriguez they are the best players this organization has seen since Felix Hernandez left. Jerry has been in charge for about 8 seasons and 6 of those were winning seasons I definitely believe this man knows baseball and knows what he is doing.

What 40 year old washed up guys are you talking about that fans wanted? No one has ever said they had to sell all of their prospects but to just improve the team. His job is to win a WS championship, not to sustain a franchise who’s goal is a wildcard spot.

And that’s fine, we disagree, I don’t think anyone hasn’t given Jerry credit for his success of the rebuild but we also talk about his failures. No one is disputing he knows baseball or knows what he was doing, but you can’t say he did a great job with the rebuild then pretend they are still rebuilding. This stage of the game they should be World Series contenders not in sell off a closer for platoon players.

But it is a little silly that you can say his 6 successful years when we have the last couple (which we are all happy about) then a spectacular failure when he made dumb move after dumb move with the Cano, Cruz, Felix and Seager core.

 

[seattlefan75]

What 40 year old washed up guys are you talking about that fans wanted? No one has ever said they had to sell all of their prospects but to just improve the team. His job is to win a WS championship, not to sustain a franchise who’s goal is a wildcard spot.

And that’s fine, we disagree, I don’t think anyone hasn’t given Jerry credit for his success of the rebuild but we also talk about his failures. No one is disputing he knows baseball or knows what he was doing, but you can’t say he did a great job with the rebuild then pretend they are still rebuilding. This stage of the game they should be World Series contenders not in sell off a closer for platoon players.

But it is a little silly that you can say his 6 successful years when we have the last couple (which we are all happy about) then a spectacular failure when he made dumb move after dumb move with the Cano, Cruz, Felix and Seager core.

I am approaching this with a sense of empathy as in managing a franchise is hard. There are 29 other GMs with their own scouting department that are evaluating our players as well as theirs. In todays game teams are not wanting to give up their top prospects and take on veteran players that are hitting arbitration and free agency So what player do you think Jerry should have acquired at the trade deadline? Juan Soto? Are you prepared to pull the trigger to do what it takes to acquire Juan Soto? To pull that trade off that is looking like 3 of our top end prospects and with an agent like Scot Boras extending Juan would easily top 400 million. That is an expensive move and Juan Soto is already proving that he can be on your team and still suck. Signing Julio Rodriguez to 12 years 209 million was a SUPER great franchise changing move and I thank Jerry for that.

The only damaging move Jerry has done to the franchise was signing Robbie Ray but nobody can forecast a Tommy John injury. Lasty, whatever players were on roster before Jerry took over gets a pass for me. He didnt draft, trade nor develop them its only fair he shouldnt be responsible for them. I will say Evan White and Kyle Lewis are busts but their careers were ended with injuries but imagine how good this team would be if Kyle Lewis didnt get hurt and was maintaining his momentum from his rookie season.

 

[ulmax]

1crawford..ss .L/L
2 julio.....cf
3canzone..dh.L/L
4suarez..3b
5 hernandez...rf
6.kelenic..LF..L/L.
7raliegh..catch
8.france..,...1b
9.cabellero..2b/3b/ss .

Bench..
Murphy..
Moore..
Rojas..3b..a L/L.
Marlowe ..

Not to maney..trades..but one that is needed.
Too give ty France a break at times..

Tampa bay
Austin shenton..blocked by..
Meade..in path to mlb
Left handed .1b/3b..
Cheap..a pitcher..reliever

Cubs..shcrumpf..3b..AA....
He either makes it or don't .many many more behind ...cheap..reliever pitcher

Any 2b/3b/ss..at AAA...bats left .
To backup .Rojas ..or re-place.

Free agents..
Snell..best..era .in majors..
Gurriel...jr..the right guy...LF/RF

 

[ulmax]

I would love to see Rojas replace canzone.
At dh..
But ya gota hit baby
Or end up in the minors...

 

[wazzu31]

I am approaching this with a sense of empathy as in managing a franchise is hard. There are 29 other GMs with their own scouting department that are evaluating our players as well as theirs. In todays game teams are not wanting to give up their top prospects and take on veteran players that are hitting arbitration and free agency So what player do you think Jerry should have acquired at the trade deadline? Juan Soto? Are you prepared to pull the trigger to do what it takes to acquire Juan Soto? To pull that trade off that is looking like 3 of our top end prospects and with an agent like Scot Boras extending Juan would easily top 400 million. That is an expensive move and Juan Soto is already proving that he can be on your team and still suck. Signing Julio Rodriguez to 12 years 209 million was a SUPER great franchise changing move and I thank Jerry for that.

The only damaging move Jerry has done to the franchise was signing Robbie Ray but nobody can forecast a Tommy John injury. Lasty, whatever players were on roster before Jerry took over gets a pass for me. He didnt draft, trade nor develop them its only fair he shouldnt be responsible for them. I will say Evan White and Kyle Lewis are busts but their careers were ended with injuries but imagine how good this team would be if Kyle Lewis didnt get hurt and was maintaining his momentum from his rookie season.

The disconnect you are having is that anyone was asking to give up Harry Ford or Cole Young. No one advocated for tearing up the entire farm system as Bellinger was off the market. The dudes you are talking about that are “over the hill” guys A. Weren’t rentals B. Were pitchers, which the Mariners didn’t need. There were plenty of trades that the Mariners could’ve made that cost nothing in terms of top prospects at the moment. The teams needs before the deadline were a starting OF/DH and a starting 2B. The Mariners got role players and lost their best bullpen arm.

If Jerry had made the team better in the off-season then 100% I and any GM who wants to win would’ve traded the top 2 prospects for Soto. With how bad the Mariners offense was in the first half, add Soto to the team and they would’ve firmly been in control of at least a wildcard spot. I understand the he is going to hit free agency, but that is a loser mentality and why teams that have that philosophy don’t win championships. You can say the Padres suck with Soto but then that makes your defense of Jerry even worse. A. The Padres with Soto have had a lot more success than Jerry ever has. B. Then in your theory Jerry hasn’t done a good job of building a team if a star like Soto couldn’t put them over the top. Everyone is gave Preller praise for making the deal, even though he gave up to much, but he has been criticized for this season.

1000% disagree with you. Robbie Ray wasn’t devastating or remotely a bad deal. I would massively argue that him trading Chris Taylor was much worse, his Marco trade was much worse. In hindsight I think the Ketel Marte trade was worse. You could argue it led to JP Crawford but the Mariners could have gotten JP without the Ketel Marte for Haniger trade. You definitely can say what if Lewis or White stayed healthy, but reality is they didn’t and he didn’t correct those injuries. I give him an F for his first attempt to replace Lewis with Winker and a B (though it has been a failure) Teoscar. He hasn’t even attempted to replace White’s spot and he failed epically trying to find a replacement for Cano.

The Julio move is irrelevant and a dishonest Jerry talking point. Julio and Castillo are guys who were going to be a Mariners regardless so it isn’t franchise changing. Franchise changing would’ve been getting Semien or Seager or Turner. A real offensive free agent so it would signal to agents and players around the league that it is ok to come sign with the Mariners. It was the exact same thing as how the Seahawks became an ok destination for players to come after Lawyer Malloy.

I can see our disconnect on this one on two fronts, you want to defend Jerry because it appears you think Seattle 3/4th into a rebuild. Mine (and all of the fans that were pissed at his performance) is they are no longer in a rebuild. They graduated 3 top 100 position playing prospects along with having 2 top 10 and 4 top 20 pitchers in baseball. Jerry told us that they would be a World Series contender this year. He built the team to where they needed one star or two average position starters to be a World Series contender and in our opinion did nothing to make that promise come true. Then our second disconnect is you feel his moves are for sustained success. Mine is not. He idiotically put a window on this core. He told us 2026 is the end of window. Which means he cannot keep Kirby and Gilbert. And will have choices between Kelenic, Raleigh and JP. France may be in there too but I don’t think he fits into a 2027 roster. The GM I wish the Mariners had, would not to punt on this year like he has. Because a championship run depends solely on faith A-Z happens, I’d list all of them but I’ve written a novel, instead of A or B needs to happen for them not to be a World Series contender.

 

[wazzu31]

I am approaching this with a sense of empathy as in managing a franchise is hard. There are 29 other GMs with their own scouting department that are evaluating our players as well as theirs. In todays game teams are not wanting to give up their top prospects and take on veteran players that are hitting arbitration and free agency So what player do you think Jerry should have acquired at the trade deadline? Juan Soto? Are you prepared to pull the trigger to do what it takes to acquire Juan Soto? To pull that trade off that is looking like 3 of our top end prospects and with an agent like Scot Boras extending Juan would easily top 400 million. That is an expensive move and Juan Soto is already proving that he can be on your team and still suck. Signing Julio Rodriguez to 12 years 209 million was a SUPER great franchise changing move and I thank Jerry for that.

The only damaging move Jerry has done to the franchise was signing Robbie Ray but nobody can forecast a Tommy John injury. Lasty, whatever players were on roster before Jerry took over gets a pass for me. He didnt draft, trade nor develop them its only fair he shouldnt be responsible for them. I will say Evan White and Kyle Lewis are busts but their careers were ended with injuries but imagine how good this team would be if Kyle Lewis didnt get hurt and was maintaining his momentum from his rookie season.

And I could put 1000% wrong, but this is why I think Jerry isn’t a good GM.

 

[NWinAZ]

Next years free agent hitters. If you want a guy in his 20's, this isn't the market for you...lol. The good news is that outside of Ohtani no real superstars available. Mariners hate superstars so that is a plus.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Next years free agent hitters. If you want a guy in his 20's, this isn't the market for you...lol. The good news is that outside of Ohtani no real superstars available. Mariners hate superstars so that is a plus.

I came here to post exactly this.

Ranking the top 30 potential MLB free agents: Ohtani the big prize, Bellinger’s value surging

Here's an updated look at the potential 2023-24 free-agent class. For every player on this list, there's much at stake in the coming months.

theathletic.com

The Athletic posted this top-30 free agents. For those of you without a subscription, here are the position player rankings:

1. Shoehei Ohtani RHP/DH/OF
5. Matt Chapman, 3B
6. Cody Bellinger, OF
16. J.D. Martinez, DH
17. Whit Merrifield, 2B/OF
18. Harrison Bader, CF
19. Teoscar Hernandez, RF
20. Lourdes Gurriel Jr., OF
22. Jorge Soler, OF/DH
24. Michael Conforto, RF
26. Rhys Hoskins, 1B
27. Jung-Hoo Lee, CF
29. Hunter Renfroe, OF
30. Joc Pederson, OF

A number of those guys could've been signed last offseason. Most of those guys are OF/DH players which doesn't help our current situation.

 

[NWinAZ]

I came here to post exactly this.

Ranking the top 30 potential MLB free agents: Ohtani the big prize, Bellinger’s value surging

Here's an updated look at the potential 2023-24 free-agent class. For every player on this list, there's much at stake in the coming months.

theathletic.com

The Athletic posted this top-30 free agents. For those of you without a subscription, here are the position player rankings:

1. Shoehei Ohtani RHP/DH/OF
5. Matt Chapman, 3B
6. Cody Bellinger, OF
16. J.D. Martinez, DH
17. Whit Merrifield, 2B/OF
18. Harrison Bader, CF
19. Teoscar Hernandez, RF
20. Lourdes Gurriel Jr., OF
22. Jorge Soler, OF/DH
24. Michael Conforto, RF
26. Rhys Hoskins, 1B
27. Jung-Hoo Lee, CF
29. Hunter Renfroe, OF
30. Joc Pederson, OF

A number of those guys could've been signed last offseason. Most of those guys are OF/DH players which doesn't help our current situation.

The thing is if we sign one he is only replacing Teo. We need to build forward and not just replace.