Kobe shocking the world

[tlance]

@Tlance I agree on paper they would look similar, they would have a euro style F-C and an aging injured SG.

After that though they have a ton of pieces and management that has proved to be very competent where it has not been proven in LA recently. Also their F-C and SG are both in much better condition than the Lakers.

I agree that management and coaching are far better in Miami, but that doesn't change facts. If LeBron were to walk, the Heat would not have the cap space to sign another max player and Wade (at this point) and Bosh are not good enough to make that team a real contender. They would be in a spot where they needed to rebuild in order to be better than a 45-50 win team. That is a playoff team, but still irrelevant.

The Lakers may or may not fall short of the playoffs in the West this year, but the West is far superior to the East in terms of depth. There are about 4-5 teams out West who will battle for the final playoff spot that would waltz to a 6 or 7 seed in the East. The Lakers are one of those teams.

Riley is very good at what he does, but it would take him some time to get back to contention if Lebron left. And no, he would not be content with an irrelevant 48 win team. He is better then that.

 

[tlance]

Also Bot, Wade is not in great shape either. There are some serious doubts as to whether or not his knees will allow him to maintain an elite level of play. His style does not age as well as Kobe's because Kobe is a better shooter from distance. He could be a total shell of himself by 2014.

 

[lakersrule]

Actually, that is a very realistic possibility. If Lebron opts to leave in 2014, the Heat will look almost exactly like the Lakers do now.

And no, the Lakers are not relevant as far as being a contender because they opted to ride with D'Antoni over Howard. Howard may not ever get back to being the dominant player that we was in 2011 and before, but he will have a much better chance in Houston than he ever had with D'Antoni coaching him.

Dwight is still a Laker if PJ was hired instead of D'Antoni. I think Dwight does get back to being a dominant player. He was getting there towards the end of the season.

 

[Flauge]

I agree that management and coaching are far better in Miami, but that doesn't change facts. If LeBron were to walk, the Heat would not have the cap space to sign another max player and Wade (at this point) and Bosh are not good enough to make that team a real contender. They would be in a spot where they needed to rebuild in order to be better than a 45-50 win team. That is a playoff team, but still irrelevant.

The Lakers may or may not fall short of the playoffs in the West this year, but the West is far superior to the East in terms of depth. There are about 4-5 teams out West who will battle for the final playoff spot that would waltz to a 6 or 7 seed in the East. The Lakers are one of those teams.

Riley is very good at what he does, but it would take him some time to get back to contention if Lebron left. And no, he would not be content with an irrelevant 48 win team. He is better then that.

I agree. But Miami could sign another max deal player as they would have the option to amnesty bosh if Lebron walked. Im not 100% sure on the amnesty rules.. I just know you can do it once on a contract from before the current CBA, and Miami hasnt used it yet.

Bosh/Wade get's you to playoffs, but youre not winning a title as you said. The ceiling on that team would be ECF because of the weakness of the East. If lebron walks and goes to a western conference team... we very well could be looking at early 2000 type finals. Where the real NBA finals is the WCF.

 

[Flauge]

Dwight is still a Laker if PJ was hired instead of D'Antoni. I think Dwight does get back to being a dominant player. He was getting there towards the end of the season.

i agree with this. dwight will be back. lakers screwed the pooch here. laker fans need to be worried about their front office abilities to put things together if they couldnt get this right. this is a statement that hasnt been able to be said in probably 40+ years.

 

[BOTSLAYER]

Also Bot, Wade is not in great shape either. There are some serious doubts as to whether or not his knees will allow him to maintain an elite level of play. His style does not age as well as Kobe's because Kobe is a better shooter from distance. He could be a total shell of himself by 2014.

I accounted for this. They have a lot of depth in the 1-3 where Wade would not have to play a lot and Bosh would shine for at least a few years to make them a 50 win team...but no not a contender.

With every one coming off of their books and not many stars will want to play with a hobbled Kobe I think they will be in the shitter until Kobe retires.

Also there is a good chance Riley leaves if the Big 3 are broken up...so there goes guaranteed superior management.

No matter what there most obvious next play would be to get a top 10 center.

 

[lakersrule]

i agree with this. dwight will be back. lakers screwed the pooch here. laker fans need to be worried about their front office abilities to put things together if they couldnt get this right. this is a statement that hasnt been able to be said in probably 40+ years.

I think they blew it. I'm not that excited about the FAs next summer. I don't think Lebron or Carmelo go anywhere. Not resigning Dwight really hurts the reload process for post-Kobe (whenever the hell that will be!).

 

[tlance]

I accounted for this. They have a lot of depth in the 1-3 where Wade would not have to play a lot and Bosh would shine for at least a few years to make them a 50 win team...but no not a contender.

With every one coming off of their books and not many stars will want to play with a hobbled Kobe I think they will be in the shitter until Kobe retires.

Also there is a good chance Riley leaves if the Big 3 are broken up...so there goes guaranteed superior management.

No matter what there most obvious next play would be to get a top 10 center.

What depth? They have a bunch of guys like Allen, Battier and Miller who signed minimum deals to play with LBJ and have a shot at a ring. If LeBron leaves, their ability to attract bargin vets like that goes with him.

Flauge is correct that they could amnesty either Bosh or Wade and try to deal the other to sign another max player or two, but then they are starting over which was my point from the beginning.

Getting a top 10 center sounds good and all, but even if you put Dwight or Hibbert on that team instead of LBJ, I think they fall short.

 

[Heatles84]

I agree. But Miami could sign another max deal player as they would have the option to amnesty bosh if Lebron walked. Im not 100% sure on the amnesty rules.. I just know you can do it once on a contract from before the current CBA, and Miami hasnt used it yet.

Bosh/Wade get's you to playoffs, but youre not winning a title as you said. The ceiling on that team would be ECF because of the weakness of the East. If lebron walks and goes to a western conference team... we very well could be looking at early 2000 type finals. Where the real NBA finals is the WCF.

Slight correction Flauge, but this is the last season that the Heat or any team can use the amnesty. So we'd have to hope that Bosh and Wade would opt out and resign for less. But yes, if Lebron were to walk and we filled out the roster with capable players. I'd still say that we're behind the Pacers and Bulls if Lebron walks in 2014. Alot of what ifs though.

 

[Heatles84]

I accounted for this. They have a lot of depth in the 1-3 where Wade would not have to play a lot and Bosh would shine for at least a few years to make them a 50 win team...but no not a contender.

With every one coming off of their books and not many stars will want to play with a hobbled Kobe I think they will be in the shitter until Kobe retires.

Also there is a good chance Riley leaves if the Big 3 are broken up...so there goes guaranteed superior management.

No matter what there most obvious next play would be to get a top 10 center.

Where is he going?

 

[tlance]

Slight correction Flauge, but this is the last season that the Heat or any team can use the amnesty. So we'd have to hope that Bosh and Wade would opt out and resign for less. But yes, if Lebron were to walk and we filled out the roster with capable players. I'd still say that we're behind the Pacers and Bulls if Lebron walks in 2014. Alot of what ifs though.

Did not realize that. I thought any deal made before the latest CBA could be amnestied so long as the team hasn't used it before. Good info.

 

[trojanfan12]

Where is he going?

Uh, he could retire!! Folks have been known to do that when they get to Riley's age, especially when they are set for life!! Also, Riles has always been very good at knowing when it's time to move on. Not saying that it's time or will be if the big 3 break up, but it's certainly not out of the question and he has always seemed to have a good read on when it's time!!

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

What depth? They have a bunch of guys like Allen, Battier and Miller who signed minimum deals to play with LBJ and have a shot at a ring. If LeBron leaves, their ability to attract bargin vets like that goes with him.

Flauge is correct that they could amnesty either Bosh or Wade and try to deal the other to sign another max player or two, but then they are starting over which was my point from the beginning.

Getting a top 10 center sounds good and all, but even if you put Dwight or Hibbert on that team instead of LBJ, I think they fall short.

Actually, none of the 3 players you named is playing for the minimum.

Anyway, this conversation could me much easier simplified.

Whatever team James plays for will more then likely be favored to win the title every year for the foreseeable future.

There is no way to even begin to guess what Riley would do to try to revamp the Heat roster into if James leaves next summer.

You take away his versatility and all of the sudden you have way more holes to fill then you could even imagine.

 

[BOTSLAYER]

What depth? They have a bunch of guys like Allen, Battier and Miller who signed minimum deals to play with LBJ and have a shot at a ring. If LeBron leaves, their ability to attract bargin vets like that goes with him.

Flauge is correct that they could amnesty either Bosh or Wade and try to deal the other to sign another max player or two, but then they are starting over which was my point from the beginning.

Getting a top 10 center sounds good and all, but even if you put Dwight or Hibbert on that team instead of LBJ, I think they fall short.

I forgot how old that team was, they would have to almost completely rebuild but that will be far less an issue with Wade and Bosh rather than Kobe.

I will concede you are right about most. Look at this though:

Chalmers/Cole (both play decent D and are not selfish)
Wade/A young up comer...maybe even Wade coming off the bench
This would need to be filled as well...maybe the slide Varnado in here for a bit
Bosh-every one sells him short, his stats was the biggest sacrifice he took to come to Miami
Howard or Hibbert

That is not as far off a rebuild as it looks, whether it goes to the finals depends on who they can get to play the 3. Cole could even play the 2 with Wade at the 3 in a pinch.

Where is he going?

He has mentioned retirement and something to the effect of he was just enjoying the ride as long as it lasts.

 

[tlance]

Chalmers/Cole (both play decent D and are not selfish)
Wade/A young up comer...maybe even Wade coming off the bench
This would need to be filled as well...maybe the slide Varnado in here for a bit
Bosh-every one sells him short, his stats was the biggest sacrifice he took to come to Miami
Howard or Hibbert

My point though, is that without Howard or Hibbert, who would both be very unrealistic gets, this roster is very mediocre. Just like the current version of the Lakers.

 

[BOTSLAYER]

Some how I factor in their age when I say how old they are now and forget that a year down the road? Like wtf LOL.

I would rather they get someone cheaper than a max contract who plays solid D and rebounds like you read about, a Ben Wallace would be just fine. The PGs Wade and Bosh can score.

You are right they both are mediocre, but on the scale of 100...

100 = 87 Lakers / 96 Bulls

65 = Heat 2 3rds and a big give a roseless bulls all they can handle in a 7 game series

50 = Bucks 1st round and out every year

43 = Kobe trying to get players to be his bitch while he is in a wheel chair

0 = Bobcats

 

[BOTSLAYER]

65 may even be steep...but so is 43.

 

[chicityfan2013]

Kobe has a good enough well rounded game to still be a threat this year

 

[HammerDown]

 

[TexasMan]

It's really remarkable How fast Kobe is makinG tHis return.