Judge Recommends Suspension of 6 Games for Deshaun Watson

[jarntt]

If you click on the link there are 10 talking points listed








1. Judge Robinson, applying the "preponderance of the evidence" standard (more likely than not), found that Watson violated the PCP in three different ways: non-violent sexual assault; posing a danger to safety and well-being of another; undermining the integrity of the NFL.


2. The NFL submitted a 215-page investigation report, and it introduced evidence regarding five accusers. One was based on a media report, and Judge Robinson excluded it from the record. So there were four accusers whose claims were considered, not 24 or more.


3. Judge Robinson rejected Deshaun Watson's categorial denials of wrongdoing, along with his denial that he ever developed an erection during a massage. In the most tactful way possible, she concluded that he lied while testifying about the most important aspects of the case.


4. Judge Robinson found that Deshaun Watson: (a) intended to cause contact with his penis; (b) did so for a sexual purpose; and (c) knew such contact was unwanted.

5. As to the finding that Deshaun Watson's conduct undermined or placed at risk the integrity of the NFL, Judge Robinson pointed out that Watson invoked his status as an NFL player and used his ties to the Texans to reinforce his requests for massages focused on sensitive areas.


6. The NFL wanted a suspension of Deshaun Watson for all of the 2022 season, with reinstatement in 2023 hinging on specific conditions. The league said its request was unprecedented, because his conduct was unprecedented.


7. Judge Robinson concluded that the NFL was trying to change the standards for non-violent sexual assault without fair notice to the players. She called the proposed change to the rules "extraordinary."

8. Judge Robinson found two "aggravating factors": Deshaun Watson's expressed lack of remorse and his tardy notice to the NFL as to the first lawsuit. "Mitigating factors" were his status as first-time offender and his "excellent reputation" prior to this events.


9. Judge Robinson said that the league's stance on Deshaun Watson was a response to public outcry, and that the league is trying to impose a "dramatic shift" in the rules without fair notice to the players and others covered by the PCP.


10. Judge Robinson directs Deshaun Watson to limit massage therapy to club-directed sessions and club-approved therapists "for the duration of his career."


11. As to the comparison of Watson's punishment to the handling of owners, Judge Robinson acknowledged the legitimacy of the argument. It apparently didn't factor into her decision because of the unprecedented nature of the allegations. It could be an issue in future cases.

 

[shopson67]

You said "asking isn't a crime"
that's not necessarily true. I didn't say asking is "always" a crime.

I suspect if you go ask the next 13 year old you see for something you'll be charged with a crime.

The time? Directions?

Ridiculous example anyway, as age of consent was not involved in the Watson case whatsoever. You're all over the place.

 

[Manster7588]

In very interested to see what this does to precedent of the league doesn't appeal

Basically the rulingv equates to 1 quarter suspended per accuser, even if you up that to 1 game is still awful publicly

So if a guy has 1 accuser next year and gets 4 games he now has precedentv to appeal OR to file a lawsuit

When i first heard the ruling i thought it was light but i was like 50/50 on whether the league would appeal but as I've sat here and thought about what this means going forward i just don't see how they can't

Say another guy faces a Big Ben type accusation next year and he settles ouy of court with no charges then the league suspends him for 1 game for potentially raping someone ( as that's the new precedent )

How does that play out publicly??


I just can't see it

Personally I wouldn't look at it as 24 cases, I see it as one case with multiple extenuating circumstances.

 

[rmilia1]

False equivalency for the win.

I mean not really. Both cars were deemed insufficient to bring to criminal court and both were settled civilly. It's only a false equivalency if you are saying you believe the accusers. Which the league isn't doing

 

[jarntt]

Or if interested:

https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/22124209/deshaun-watson-suspension-ruling.pdf

 

[Manster7588]

So asking anyone for anything in Texas is a crime? Is that why everyone has guns?

Solicitation is a general term, not a crime.

In this case it's solicitation for sex which is illegal in Texas.

 

[rmilia1]

Personally I wouldn't look at it as 24 cases, I see it as one case with multiple extenuating circumstances.

Even if that's true the league can't say that publicly though. And their only real concern in public perception and how it impacts their money

 

[molsaniceman]

Personally I wouldn't look at it as 24 cases, I see it as one case with multiple extenuating circumstances.

doesnt matter amount of games is a crapshoot

 

[jarntt]

The time? Directions?

Ridiculous example anyway, as age of consent was not involved in the Watson case whatsoever. You're all over the place.

Come on. You can't be that stupid. Again, you said it isn't a crime. You didn't say it isn't always a crime. I never said it is always a crime.

 

[futballiscool]

The question isn't about criminality, but about violating the personal conduct policy. Would there have been a suspension for a single incident? Maybe not, but maybe.

Definitely seems like Watson got an "economy of scale" break here.

I will say that Watson seems like an ignorant, entitled child in these cases, and while it doesn't make any of it okay, he may honestly not have known better, having been coddled and having snatch thrown at him just for being good at football for most of his post-puberty life. Pre-frontal cortex still forming when he was doing this crap. He seemed genuinely surprised to find out women might get upset at him just offering them his junk - and had trouble processing what that meant.

Sorry about you feeling uncomfortable. Never were the intentions. Lmk if you want to work in the future. My apologies.​

"Lmk if you want to work in the future." I mean... wtf dude.

NFL should understand that a lot of these young guys don't have their impulse control and social processing down when they enter the league, and teams should sit the rookies down and make very clear what's not okay in the real world. 21-year-olds still make really bad decisions they wouldn't make five years later.

I think criminality is important when assigning appropriate punishment. I'm not arguing he shouldn't be suspended at all but rather it's very difficult to exceed 6 games when nothing criminal took place and it's personal conduct that doesn't effect the integrity of the game.

If the argument is that he sexually assaulted dozens of women but criminal charges aren't being pressed then we have an issue bigger than Watson, the Browns or the NFL

 

[Manster7588]

doesnt matter amount of games is a crapshoot

View attachment 303784

I agree, and the randomness is a big reason why I say the next correct discipline the NFL hands out will be the first.

 

[Wamu]

If you click on the link there are 10 talking points listed








1. Judge Robinson, applying the "preponderance of the evidence" standard (more likely than not), found that Watson violated the PCP in three different ways: non-violent sexual assault; posing a danger to safety and well-being of another; undermining the integrity of the NFL.


2. The NFL submitted a 215-page investigation report, and it introduced evidence regarding five accusers. One was based on a media report, and Judge Robinson excluded it from the record. So there were four accusers whose claims were considered, not 24 or more.


3. Judge Robinson rejected Deshaun Watson's categorial denials of wrongdoing, along with his denial that he ever developed an erection during a massage. In the most tactful way possible, she concluded that he lied while testifying about the most important aspects of the case.


4. Judge Robinson found that Deshaun Watson: (a) intended to cause contact with his penis; (b) did so for a sexual purpose; and (c) knew such contact was unwanted.

5. As to the finding that Deshaun Watson's conduct undermined or placed at risk the integrity of the NFL, Judge Robinson pointed out that Watson invoked his status as an NFL player and used his ties to the Texans to reinforce his requests for massages focused on sensitive areas.


6. The NFL wanted a suspension of Deshaun Watson for all of the 2022 season, with reinstatement in 2023 hinging on specific conditions. The league said its request was unprecedented, because his conduct was unprecedented.


7. Judge Robinson concluded that the NFL was trying to change the standards for non-violent sexual assault without fair notice to the players. She called the proposed change to the rules "extraordinary."

8. Judge Robinson found two "aggravating factors": Deshaun Watson's expressed lack of remorse and his tardy notice to the NFL as to the first lawsuit. "Mitigating factors" were his status as first-time offender and his "excellent reputation" prior to this events.


9. Judge Robinson said that the league's stance on Deshaun Watson was a response to public outcry, and that the league is trying to impose a "dramatic shift" in the rules without fair notice to the players and others covered by the PCP.


10. Judge Robinson directs Deshaun Watson to limit massage therapy to club-directed sessions and club-approved therapists "for the duration of his career."


11. As to the comparison of Watson's punishment to the handling of owners, Judge Robinson acknowledged the legitimacy of the argument. It apparently didn't factor into her decision because of the unprecedented nature of the allegations. It could be an issue in future cases.

Thanks for posting that.

 

[jarntt]

The time? Directions?

Ridiculous example anyway, as age of consent was not involved in the Watson case whatsoever. You're all over the place.

My point was about solicitation being a crime. That wasn't obvious?

 

[Iggloo]

It's going to be a total shit show when this guy takes the field. Lots of protests and rightly so.

 

[shopson67]

I mean not really. Both cars were deemed insufficient to bring to criminal court and both were settled civilly. It's only a false equivalency if you are saying you believe the accusers. Which the league isn't doing

Different offenses.

 

[shopson67]

Come on. You can't be that stupid. Again, you said it isn't a crime. You didn't say it isn't always a crime. I never said it is always a crime.

Solicitation is not a crime-specific word.

 

[shopson67]

Personally I wouldn't look at it as 24 cases, I see it as one case with multiple extenuating circumstances.

Besides, it was only 4 cases ultimately. The rest were either settled or thrown out.

 

[dtgold88]

If it's equal I believe the NFL lets it go.

Now do you think the screams will be equal?

I think they would be.....but the problem is the NFL does not hear the screams unless they appeal and I don't think they'll let it get that far.

 

[dtgold88]

there aint that many browns fans

While I did laugh at that watch the draft next time it's on. Goodell is not exactly liked and fans will be happy to complain about this decision if the league appeals and he rules on it.

 

[dtgold88]

Redirect Notice

www.google.com

Will the NFL exercise its right to appeal the decision to the Commissioner of the NFL?

For now, the league has not answered the question. Here’s the statement from the league, issued moments ago: “We thank Judge Sue L. Robinson, the independent disciplinary officer, for her review of the voluminous record and attention during a three-day hearing that resulted in her finding multiple violations of the NFL Personal Conduct Policy by Deshaun Watson. We appreciate Judge Robinson’s diligence and professionalism throughout this process. Pursuant to the Collective Bargaining Agreement, the NFL or the NFLPA on behalf of Watson may appeal the decision within three days. In light of her findings, the league is reviewing Judge Robinson’s imposition of a six-game suspension and will make a determination on next steps.”


I take that as "We ain't on board, with 6 games".

Since they have already said they wanted a year I think we knew they were not on board.