Is Baker Mayfield a Top 10 QB

[Battlelyon]

Baker has never thrown a touchdown late in a tied game, he has 3 game winning drives the last two seasons. Of course he is at his best when leading. He has only threw 1 TD in 3rd and long situation, and 8 interceptions. So his biggest problem is he a gambler and sometimes forces something even if it isn't there. He should improve in that area with more experience. Right now he is around 10-15th best quarterback in the NFL.

Mahomes, Brady, Rodgers, Wilson, Big Ben, Lamar, Allen, Dak, Murray, Stafford, Herbert, next range

 

[Schmoopy1000]

Baker has never thrown a touchdown late in a tied game, he has 3 game winning drives the last two seasons. Of course he is at his best when leading. He has only threw 1 TD in 3rd and long situation, and 8 interceptions. So his biggest problem is he a gambler and sometimes forces something even if it isn't there. He should improve in that area with more experience. Right now he is around 10-15th best quarterback in the NFL.

Mahomes, Brady, Rodgers, Wilson, Big Ben, Lamar, Allen, Dak, Murray, Stafford, Herbert, next range

I like a lot of what you said.
but I dont see Big Ben as a top 10 QB anymore. Still in the range of discussion, but I probably wouldnt count him in the top ten.
I would put him in that 2nd range as well.

 

[shopson67]

That's how I view Baker. An NFL QB, but nothing special. I think he could be more successful than Baker in that stacked offense.

Well, compare Goff's numbers last year with LA to Baker's with Cleveland, largely without ODB. Baker threw less, lower completion %, had more TDs, fewer INTs, similar yards/attempt, better QBR and QB rating.

 

[dtgold88]

He had another guy open early in the 4th and underthrew him.

He is somewhere between 9th and 14th imo. I do think the Browns have a good shot at "#1 overall offense" this year with all of the pieces they have. If Baker is 9th or 10th best QB then I think he could get that done

Those are 2 he'd want back. Nearly all of his other 26 passes were really good or even elite level. I think he's closer to 9 but 14 I guess not too far off from where I'd say floor is.

Agree on your last assessment.

 

[dtgold88]

Until late in the game I thought he looked very sharp yesterday. But as he showed when the game is on the line, he’s subpar with game-winning drives.

If they are playing a balanced offense then he can look like a top 5 QB. But if the game is on the line and he needs to deliver, he looks more like a middle of the pack QB. I’ll say he’s fringe top 10. I’d put him in the 9-13 range.

Delivered last year against Cinci in a very precarious situation with a perfect throw to a 6th round rookie. Before you say not a good team he led a drive to take the lead late vs. Bmore. Not his fault the D couldn't get a stop.

Led GW drives as a rookie against the Jets (first ever game), Bmore and Denver. Even under worst coach ever the next year against Buffalo.

But I think 9-13 is fair.

 

[dtgold88]

Likely closer to 15 than 10. He's got a lot of talent around him and maybe the best running game in the league.

I guess, but by that "logic" how much would you downgrade Montana? Had a really good line, Craig, Taylor, Clark and that Rice fellow.

 

[RememberTheKoy]

Well, compare Goff's numbers last year with LA to Baker's with Cleveland, largely without ODB. Baker threw less, lower completion %, had more TDs, fewer INTs, similar yards/attempt, better QBR and QB rating.

Baker had better talent around him. But still but that was the only season that Baker had a better year than Goff. I have very little doubt that if Goff was put in the Browns offense he would put up better numbers than Baker.

 

[dtgold88]

He has around top 5 arm talent but he is likely around 12 at this point, if you look at the list. Most nailed it saying he is around 12.

Top 10 (in no order) - Mahomes, Brady, Wilson, Rodgers, Allen, Dak, Stafford, Murray, Tannehill, Watson

Then you have a cluster of QB's you put at 11-14 - Cousins, Baker, Carr, Herbert.

Hebert's one year isn't enough, if he does it this year that could catapult Herbert into the top 10 maybe even top 7. Not enough track record.

Big Ben and Ryan seemed to be regressing as we speak.

I think you could make a case for him being ahead of stafford and tannehill for sure. same knocks on Baker could be made against Dak. some key INTs to lose games and he's 2-10 vs. good teams, I think. watson? Who knows?

 

[RememberTheKoy]

I guess, but by that "logic" how much would you downgrade Montana? Had a really good line, Craig, Taylor, Clark and that Rice fellow.

Montana won a Super Bowl before Rice got there. Baker Mayfield is nowhere near close to Montana.

There are great QBs with great supporting casts, see Mahomes. Baker Mayfield just flat out isn't a great QB though. He is surrounded by some really good talent and what I consider the best running game in the league and he's just middle of the road with all of that.

 

[dtgold88]

Baker had better talent around him. But still but that was the only season that Baker had a better year than Goff. I have very little doubt that if Goff was put in the Browns offense he would put up better numbers than Baker.

Better RBs and TEs. Not WRs. Not really close.

 

[dtgold88]

Montana won a Super Bowl before Rice got there. Baker Mayfield is nowhere near close to Montana.

There are great QBs with great supporting casts, see Mahomes. Baker Mayfield just flat out isn't a great QB though. He is surrounded by some really good talent and what I consider the best running game in the league and he's just middle of the road with all of that.

Except you are ignoring his #1 WR has not played and his #2-4 WRs last year were Higgins, Hodge and a 6th round rookie. Also won a playoff game without 2 starting lineman AND their backups.

 

[dtgold88]

Herbert is without question better than Baker. You say one year isn't enough for Herbert but it was vastly better than any year that Baker has had.


Also I don't agree with the top 5 arm talent statement at all.

you could "not agree with the statement" but would have a hard time disproving it. Has tremendous accuracy and a very strong arm.

 

[dtgold88]

I have him around the 18th best QB in the league. I'll give him the slight edge over Jimmy G because Jimmy G can't stay healthy at all.


1. Mahomes
2. Brady
3. Wilson
4. Rodgers
5. Jackson
6. Dak
7. Herbert
8. Stafford
9. Watson
10. Murray
11. Tannehill
12. Big Ben
13. Carr
14. Burrow
15. Wentz
16. Cousins
17. Goff
18. Baker
19. Garoppolo
20. Ryan

Hard to take you seriously as anything other than someone who just doesn't like the kid.

 

[dtgold88]

I think if you took any QB ranked above Baker on my list and stuck them on the Browns right now, the Browns would be a better team with that QB than they are with Baker right now.

cool

 

[dtgold88]

I disagree. Wentz and Cousins turn a 12 win (their likely total, imo) into a 10 win team (at best). Checkdown Charlies, both of them and bad turnovers at bad times. Carr, Tannehill I think might be on par with Baker. Goff to me has zero leadership intangibles. I'm not a big fan of Mayfield, btw. He's arrogant, cocky and often tries to do more than he is capable of. I've just seen enough of those others to know they just aren't very good. Talented? Yes, but not what I would want in a QB.

Have to say I didn't like the kid before and during the 2019 season but seems like with an adult in charge he has grown up. Teammates seem to love the guy.

 

[dtgold88]

Wentz has one of the strongest arms in the league. Baker does not. Wentz is capable of making throws due to this a strength that Baker simply is not capable of throwing.

Wentz has a 2% interception percentage in his career and baker a 2.9%. Last year was a. Disaster for Wentz but prior to that he had thrown just 7 interceptions in 3 straight seasons.

Baker did make the farthest throw last season of 70-72 yards. Tremendous on deep outs. Also not afraid to throw downfield.

 

[dtgold88]

Maybe not top 10, but maybe top 12, or 13., right now. Could easily crack the top 10 . That said, I'll have to admit that I think he is the best QB the Browns have had in recent memory. The Browns have a history or ruining Qb's and Mayfield has hung in there and has the Browns as a legit contender.

Curious......what QB (other than maybe Couch) do you think the Browns ruined as opposed to just not being a very good QB?

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

Have to say I didn't like the kid before and during the 2019 season but seems like with an adult in charge he has grown up. Teammates seem to love the guy.

I agree. He does appear to have good leadership ability. His biggest issue now is to not try to play super hero. I want to see if he can become a guy that can be counted on when they need him late in games trailing. Take what the defense gives him and don't let the clock be a factor in his thinking. Guys like Brady, Mahomes, Wilson all have that calmness and belief. If Baker gets that, he can be very good.

 

[dtgold88]

Nice long windup stepping into it with his everything. Baker doesn't have the arm that Wentz has as seen by the below two throws Wentz made purely off of his elite arm strength.

cool. Do you have a 73 yard pass thrown by Wentz end of half or game?

 

[dtgold88]

I agree. He does appear to have good leadership ability. His biggest issue now is to not try to play super hero. I want to see if he can become a guy that can be counted on when they need him late in games trailing. Take what the defense gives him and don't let the clock be a factor in his thinking. Guys like Brady, Mahomes, Wilson all have that calmness and belief. If Baker gets that, he can be very good.

True. But seems many are overlooking he's had a 5-6 or so comebacks he has led. More if you include the ones where he did his job but the D did not hold the lead (Bmore, TB and Oakland).