I'd rather have Tristan or Whiteside Poll

[bksballer89]

I hear you... I haven't seen near enough of the Heat to have an opinion about that. Whatever you think about how much he fits in with the Heat or how much he contributes to them winning... the dude produces blocks and rebounds and points among other things.

The value of that production is off of the charts because of his very low salary. That's all I'm saying.

Wiggy watched less heat games than you dude but somehow he think he knows more than Heat fans and beat writers who follow this team around 24/7

 

[WiggyRuss]

And you just continue to ignore that Miami just had by far their best defensive month in January when Hassan in the games he played. I forgot the NBA season ended in December.

like i said- you have absolutely nothing to say except cherry picking 10 games. Please- try again in a month, or two months, or better yet - at the end of the season. Maybe by then Whiteside will have gotten a clue and realize that the team with the most blocks doesnt win.

 

[LAD]

obviously you dont believe Whiteside can behave himself...thanks...despite all this garbage youve been spouting on how he has changed BLAH BLAH BLAH

you wont even back up your boy and say that he can behave himself for February, March, April- thats pathetic and just so telling.

Incredible. All this time I was comparing your behavior to a 10 year old- now I see how wrong I truly was. Toddlers have nothing on you!

 

[WiggyRuss]

Wiggy watched less heat games than you dude but somehow he think he knows more than Heat fans and beat writers who follow this team around 24/7

Tom Haberstroh covers the Heat almost exclusively for ESPN and wrote one of the articles on how the Heat play better without Whiteside

The article that whiteside was crying about on Twitter was written by a Miami Heat beat reporter.

so nice try.

 

[WiggyRuss]

I hear you... I haven't seen near enough of the Heat to have an opinion about that. Whatever you think about how much he fits in with the Heat or how much he contributes to them winning... the dude produces blocks and rebounds and points among other things.

The value of that production is off of the charts because of his very low salary. That's all I'm saying.

i think you should word that as - his statistical production is off the charts in relation to his salary..... value implies a positive impact- which is not the same thing as is clearly evident. But i get what you mean.

 

[LAD]

Oh wiggy

This isn't a 'Will Whiteside behave himself' thread.

It's a clear Whiteside v Thompson poll and your boy tristan is losing by a wide margin!

And therefore let the diversion tactics begin!

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Maybe by then Whiteside will have gotten a clue and realize that the team with the most blocks doesnt win.

A Cavs fan lecturing someone about wins?!?

About time you guys dusted off those trophies:

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

again- can ya read?

The Heat hit a bump in the road lately, stumbling to three straight losses on a long West Coast road trip. After Wednesday night’s 14-point defeat to the Clippers, long-simmering conflicts seemed to surface. Both Dwayne Wade and Chris Bosh subtlety called out Hassan Whiteside, who they thought was babying his knee tendonitis:

http://deadspin.com/hassan-whiteside-on-his-monster-triple-double-aint-no-1753346150




Or how about embarassing himself by getting into a obscenity laced twitter fight with a reporter that was critical of him? lol AND again his teammates have to respond to questions about Whiteside being a big child.



or how about the fact that the team is better when he sits on the bench then when he plays-

Advance stats continue to tell a story that ends with the Heat simply being a better basketball team when Whiteside isn't on the court. All season long, the numbers have shown the Heat has a drastically better defense withoutits shot-blocking seven-footer standing in the paint. It's no longer too small of a sample size — the Heat is a better defensive team without Whiteside on the court. As it stands, the Heat has a defensive rating of 102.0 with Whiteside on the court and a 96.5 rating with him off the court. The defensive numbers — no matter how hard your eye-test tries to make you disagree — continue to suggest the Heat is a better defensive team when Whiteside doesn't play.

Last week, ESPN's Tom Haberstroh joined the 790 the Ticket's morning show crew to discuss the conundrum the Miami Heat finds itself in and what story the numbers tell regarding the Heat with/without Whiteside.

"When you look at the numbers, with Whiteside on the floor, Dwyane Wade scores just 20.6 points per every 36 minutes, and the Heat get outscored by 44 points. When Whiteside is off the floor, Dwyane Wade is averaging 26 points per every 36 minutes, and the Heat are outscoring opponents by two points," Haberstroh said.

In addition to dropping those concerning Wade-Whiteside stats on Heat fans' laps, Haberstroh also touched on how Whiteside's presence in the paint on offense might be doing more harm than good regarding the style the Heat wants to play with Goran Dragic.

"I think when it comes to Goran, he's one of the best finishers in the league at the rim when he's healthy," Haberstroh said. "It comes down to if you have one less big body that you have to deal with down there in the paint, it's going to be much easier for him to score."


pick one.

Another essay! You must have a lot of spare time!

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

ya know- that would also represent the # of playoff wins (not series wins) that you guys have had since Jimmy Buss took over! lol....

Smack talk from a cavs fan! C'mon dude this is just bordering on the pathetic.

 

[LAD]

People kill me when they try to exclude stats when they don't favor their argument.

 

[WiggyRuss]

he grand argument in Whiteside’s defense is that the mere threat of him rising to destroy shot attempts and egos deters enough shots for him to be a valuable piece, alone. But what if that's not the case?

Upon closer review, it doesn’t appear the highlight rejections are actually deterring the opposition from coming into the lane. Opponents aren’t just shooting better in the restricted area when Whiteside plays (64.3 percent compared to 60.7). They’re also getting to the rim more often.

So, let’s get this straight: Heat opponents are taking more shots in the restricted area, and they’re doing it at a higher efficiency when Whiteside plays. That’s the opposite of what’s supposed to be happening. Why?

Plenty of floating theories make sense.

There's the possibility that Whiteside is block-happy and ends up flying around the floor too aggressively after getting a couple of stuffs. Similar issues were present in younger versions of Serge Ibaka and DeAndre Jordan. The early-game swattery can be fool’s gold.

There's the occasional reluctance to rotate as a help defender, either because Whiteside recognizes offensive actions too late or because he doesn’t like leaving prime rebounding position to contest a shot that may or may not go in, anyway.

The nuanced hypothesizers use coach-speak and say something along the lines of, “It’s a little bit of both.” Just ask his teammates.

“When we go with a smaller lineup, you see more trapping. We’re playing faster,” said veteran swingman Luol Deng. “When Hassan is in the game, we want to take away the jump shots and kind of force guys to drive into him.”

If the Heat are forcing guys to the lane more, it’d make sense some would get lose in the restricted area. Still, allowing such a high efficiency at the rim is far from preferable.

 

[Mebert]

Interesting time for this article...

Rondo, Kanter, 5 most overrated NBA players

That being said, Whiteside is overrated, but still better than Thompson. I am not even sure why the thread decided to compare these two players, was there a previous thread where this argument broke out that I missed?

 

[bksballer89]

Interesting time for this article...

Rondo, Kanter, 5 most overrated NBA players

That being said, Whiteside is overrated, but still better than Thompson. I am not even sure why the thread decided to compare these two players, was there a previous thread where this argument broke out that I missed?

yes

 

[bksballer89]

he grand argument in Whiteside’s defense is that the mere threat of him rising to destroy shot attempts and egos deters enough shots for him to be a valuable piece, alone. But what if that's not the case?

Upon closer review, it doesn’t appear the highlight rejections are actually deterring the opposition from coming into the lane. Opponents aren’t just shooting better in the restricted area when Whiteside plays (64.3 percent compared to 60.7). They’re also getting to the rim more often.

So, let’s get this straight: Heat opponents are taking more shots in the restricted area, and they’re doing it at a higher efficiency when Whiteside plays. That’s the opposite of what’s supposed to be happening. Why?

Plenty of floating theories make sense.

There's the possibility that Whiteside is block-happy and ends up flying around the floor too aggressively after getting a couple of stuffs. Similar issues were present in younger versions of Serge Ibaka and DeAndre Jordan. The early-game swattery can be fool’s gold.

There's the occasional reluctance to rotate as a help defender, either because Whiteside recognizes offensive actions too late or because he doesn’t like leaving prime rebounding position to contest a shot that may or may not go in, anyway.

The nuanced hypothesizers use coach-speak and say something along the lines of, “It’s a little bit of both.” Just ask his teammates.

“When we go with a smaller lineup, you see more trapping. We’re playing faster,” said veteran swingman Luol Deng. “When Hassan is in the game, we want to take away the jump shots and kind of force guys to drive into him.”

If the Heat are forcing guys to the lane more, it’d make sense some would get lose in the restricted area. Still, allowing such a high efficiency at the rim is far from preferable.

You took that from something that was written on December 3rd when were barely over a month into the season.

 

[bksballer89]

And way to pick and choose what quotes to use from the article. You intentionally left out McRoberts quote which noted back then that Heat players probably gambled too much when Whiteside was in the game which led to those poor numbers in November and December.


“It helps to have Whiteside there behind you. That’s kind of the safety,” explained backup forward Josh McRoberts. “You know you can gamble a little bit and he’s right there behind you. You don’t have to foul, and you can kind of get a little bit out of position.”

So, maybe that contributes to the defensive numbers getting worse with Whiteside on the floor. Maybe Heat players see the flashy denials behind them and overestimate the help they have in Whiteside. Maybe they’re putting just a bit too much of the burden on him, and an already swarming defense becomes a little too pinbally.

 

[LAD]

oh yah....last time i checked the Lakers had lost a record amount of games in a row by double digits. lol.....i can see that you are a guy that lives in the past. What you should do is wait for those commercials where they sell DVDs from a teams championship season! its the only way you are seeing a Lakers playoff win for a stretch of over AT LEAST half a decade....so lets see- the Lakers have not won a playoff game since- is it the 12'/13' season? please correct me if im wrong- at this pace...hmmm...not happening next year.....oh yah...well over half a decade without a playoff win...have fun with that....

ill enjoy my Cavs playing deep into the playoffs for AT LEAST the next 5 years...not to mention- watching a once in a generation talent like LEbron- and superstars like Ky and Klove.....pretty awesome...


i know it can be entertaining watching Byron Scott blame young players for losing...lol...trust me! i know how that goes...id rather wash my eyes out with hydrochloric acid then go through that again.

Pretty hard to take a person serious when the team they're fanatic for has nothing but cob webs haning from the rafters in their gym.

Every team has a past and by comparison the Lakers have a past they can be proud of. All those trophies just gleaming in that trophy case.

How about the Cavs? The only thing that's gleaming from your past is the bitterness left behind when your franchise player jumped ship-literally in the middle of the night then broke up with ya'll on national tv. Oh, and can't forget that dear john letter from Gilbert either! Now those are CLASSICS!

 

[lakersrule]

ya know- that would also represent the # of playoff wins (not series wins) that you guys have had since Jimmy Buss took over! lol....

You do realize that Jimmy Buss is not the GM of the Lakers but has been active in the front office for about 10 years now? He's the one who lobbied to draft Andrew Bynum.

 

[lakersrule]

oh yah....last time i checked the Lakers had lost a record amount of games in a row by double digits. lol.....i can see that you are a guy that lives in the past. What you should do is wait for those commercials where they sell DVDs from a teams championship season! its the only way you are seeing a Lakers playoff win for a stretch of over AT LEAST half a decade....so lets see- the Lakers have not won a playoff game since- is it the 12'/13' season? please correct me if im wrong- at this pace...hmmm...not happening next year.....oh yah...well over half a decade without a playoff win...have fun with that....

ill enjoy my Cavs playing deep into the playoffs for AT LEAST the next 5 years...not to mention- watching a once in a generation talent like LEbron- and superstars like Ky and Klove.....pretty awesome...


i know it can be entertaining watching Byron Scott blame young players for losing...lol...trust me! i know how that goes...id rather wash my eyes out with hydrochloric acid then go through that again.

Yes they suck now. At least there's a past to enjoy looking back at. People who view that as a negative are always fans of teams that have a shitty past. The Lakers will get back though. Can you say the same for the Cavs once Lebron retires? Who the fuck really wants to live in Cleveland?

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

Thompson doesn't even make the Top 30 in bigs. 10ppg and 8rpg for his career?!? There are WNBA players who are better at the moment.

But hey the Cavs fans have to justify $18m a year somehow

Brittany Grinner would give him HELL in the post.

Candace Parker would just dominate him...lol

 

[lakersrule]

And way to pick and choose what quotes to use from the article. You intentionally left out McRoberts quote which noted back then that Heat players probably gambled too much when Whiteside was in the game which led to those poor numbers in November and December.


“It helps to have Whiteside there behind you. That’s kind of the safety,” explained backup forward Josh McRoberts. “You know you can gamble a little bit and he’s right there behind you. You don’t have to foul, and you can kind of get a little bit out of position.”

So, maybe that contributes to the defensive numbers getting worse with Whiteside on the floor. Maybe Heat players see the flashy denials behind them and overestimate the help they have in Whiteside. Maybe they’re putting just a bit too much of the burden on him, and an already swarming defense becomes a little too pinbally.

And that's the inherent problem of plus/minus numbers. There are 9 other players on the court contributing to the action.