How do the Hawks improve their pass D?

[seahawksfan234]

penny is a finesse garbage back, thats why he isnt getting carries. goes down like a cheap whore at even the slightest contact.

Penny isn't getting carries because Chris Carson has been excellent and fits what the Seahawks want to do. Even if he is a "finesse garbage back" he has averaged 4.9 yards per carry in 119 rushing attempts. That's pretty solid for any NFL player. I can understand frustration over the fact that he's a first round pick who isn't out-performing Carson, but 4.9 yards per carry is pretty damn solid IMO.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Ziggy needs to be benched if he can't show improvement this game against a rivalry that we're chasing in the standings... If he can't get up for this game, then he probably won't be useful the remainder of the way... Take him out of the rotation and start Green in his spot would be my preference if Ziggy doesn't do squat again... He may just not have it anymore, who knows... What we do know, is he hasn't been productive by any stretch of the imagination...

I honestly believe that Ziggy Ansah has been the worst defensive lineman for the Seahawks this season. Against the run he seems to be blown off the line of scrimmage and I haven't noticed him generating pressure. I was a fan of the signing but I wonder if his shoulder injury never fully healed or if his conditioning is poor due to not being able to do many upper body exercises due to the injury. At this point I feel like he's only getting snaps out of the hope that he'll somehow figure it out.

 

[MrS]

Penny isn't getting carries because Chris Carson has been excellent and fits what the Seahawks want to do. Even if he is a "finesse garbage back" he has averaged 4.9 yards per carry in 119 rushing attempts. That's pretty solid for any NFL player. I can understand frustration over the fact that he's a first round pick who isn't out-performing Carson, but 4.9 yards per carry is pretty damn solid IMO.

Carson has fumbled what feels like 10 times and cost the team a game at home. IF penny was any good he would have taken all the carries at that point.

The fact he hasnt just shows how bad he really is.

 

[Podunkparte]

Carson has fumbled what feels like 10 times and cost the team a game at home. IF penny was any good he would have taken all the carries at that point.

The fact he hasnt just shows how bad he really is.

You're posting on the internet, where statistics are literally at your fingertips, yet you throw out numbers that "feel like" they're accurate?

Be better.

 

[JMR]

Carson has fumbled what feels like 10 times and cost the team a game at home. IF penny was any good he would have taken all the carries at that point.

The fact he hasnt just shows how bad he really is.

But Carson hadn't fumbled at all since week 3 until this last game, right? He had a fumbled in each of the first 3 games (1 of those actually charged to RW), but then none until this last game if I remember it correctly.

 

[dkmightyhammer]

But Carson hadn't fumbled at all since week 3 until this last game, right? He had a fumbled in each of the first 3 games (1 of those actually charged to RW), but then none until this last game if I remember it correctly.

His last one was a perfect "punch out" from behind by the defender too. That could (and does) happen to lots of guys. The only thing (which others have pointed out) is that he should have known to switch the ball to his outside arm.

 

[Anointed One]

But Carson hadn't fumbled at all since week 3 until this last game, right? He had a fumbled in each of the first 3 games (1 of those actually charged to RW), but then none until this last game if I remember it correctly.

... and Penny was hurt as well...

 

[dkmightyhammer]

Just for comparison sake I looked up Shaun Alexander and Marshawn Lynch's fumbles while they were in Seattle. Arguably our best two RB's ever.

Alexander:
2000 - 2
2001 - 4
2002 - 3
2003 - 4
2004 - 5
2005 - 5 (MVP year)
2006 - 6
2007 - 2

Lynch:
2010 - 3
2011 - 3
2012 - 5
2013 - 4
2014 - 3
2015 - 0

 

[Anointed One]

Just for comparison sake I looked up Shaun Alexander and Marshawn Lynch's fumbles while they were in Seattle. Arguably our best two RB's ever.

Alexander:
2000 - 2
2001 - 4
2002 - 3
2003 - 4
2004 - 5
2005 - 5 (MVP year)
2006 - 6
2007 - 2

Lynch:
2010 - 3
2011 - 3
2012 - 5
2013 - 4
2014 - 3
2015 - 0

That's pretty impressive for Lynch with all the contact that he procured...

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

That's pretty impressive for Lynch with all the contact that he procured...

I think you can honestly make the same point about Carson. The guy runs a very similar style. I hated the fumbles early on as much as anyone and not switching the ball to the outside arm this last game pisses me off but I think fans can sonetimes be far too critical of RB's at times as well.
Of course, as usual we have completely gone off track in this thread but hey, it's all good fellas. Cheers and looking for an entertaining back half to the season.

 

[Anointed One]

I think you can honestly make the same point about Carson. The guy runs a very similar style. I hated the fumbles early on as much as anyone and not switching the ball to the outside arm this last game pisses me off but I think fans can sonetimes be far too critical of RB's at times as well.
Of course, as usual we have completely gone off track in this thread but hey, it's all good fellas. Cheers and looking for an entertaining back half to the season.

True but he's fumbled 5x's already... He's on pace for 9 or 10 at this rate... That's a bit too high...

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

True but he's fumbled 5x's already... He's on pace for 9 or 10 at this rate... That's a bit too high...

And as was already said, once in the last what, 5 games? The whole" on pace" narrative is false. Always has been.

 

[Anointed One]

And as was already said, once in the last what, 5 games? The whole" on pace" narrative is false. Always has been.

He fumbled twice last week... We only lost one of them..

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

He fumbled twice last week... We only lost one of them..

You said fumbled 5xs and said on pace. That to me meant fumbles lost. But again, I am merely pointing out the falacy of the on pace BS.
Look, I'm not arguing that the fumbles are fine. If he has double digit turnovers at seasons end, you are right. It's bad. But predicting that based on his fumbling 4 times the first 3 games and once since is wrong. Quit reading more into what I said.

 

[boogiewithstu2007]

Here is a good read, and one I agree

https://www.google.com/amp/s/12thmanrising.com/2019/11/06/seahawks-defense-death-spiral/amp/

 

[MrS]

His last one was a perfect "punch out" from behind by the defender too. That could (and does) happen to lots of guys. The only thing (which others have pointed out) is that he should have known to switch the ball to his outside arm.

We all saw that fumble coming from a mile away. He is a threat to fumble every time he is running in open field.

Anyways thats not even the point, the point is that penny is a giant bust. A first round rb should be producing big very early. Year two and the guy cant beat out a chronic fumbler.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Carson has fumbled what feels like 10 times and cost the team a game at home. IF penny was any good he would have taken all the carries at that point.

The fact he hasnt just shows how bad he really is.

Carson is on pace for nearly 1400 yards rushing and is 5th in the NFL in rushing yards. Fumble issues aside, that is difficult production to replicate. Even if Penny were better than Carson, the fumbles by Carson are uncharacteristic and that's why the team hasn't taken carries away from him.

I can completely understand if you're pissed that a first round HB hasn't jumped Carson on the depth chart, but I don't think there is really a compelling argument that Penny has played poorly or that he should replace Carson. We might just have to agree to disagree.

 

[Anointed One]

You said fumbled 5xs and said on pace. That to me meant fumbles lost. But again, I am merely pointing out the falacy of the on pace BS.
Look, I'm not arguing that the fumbles are fine. If he has double digit turnovers at seasons end, you are right. It's bad. But predicting that based on his fumbling 4 times the first 3 games and once since is wrong. Quit reading more into what I said.

I'm not even arguing... I apologize if that's how you read that...

 

[seahawksfan234]

True but he's fumbled 5x's already... He's on pace for 9 or 10 at this rate... That's a bit too high...

I'm not very concerned about the fumbles. Last year he only had 3. It's not like he lacks some ability to hold on to the ball. If I recall correctly most of the fumbles were just a result of him holding the ball on the wrong side of his body when lowering his pads to make contact with the defender. IMO it's something that can be improved through coaching and an awareness on Carson's behalf.

 

[seahawksfan234]

On the subject of the pass defense, I'm wondering how many snaps the Seahawks should continue playing K.J. Wright. According to The Athletic Wright has six passes defensed and a game-clinching interception, but he has also allowed more yards (362) than any linebacker in the league, along with five explosive pass plays and a pair of touchdowns.

That's pretty concerning considering how much the Seahawks run their base 4-3 defense.