How do the Hawks improve their pass D?

[Wolverine830872]

Seems as though there is a decent CB available in JAX. At 4-1 with a glaring hole on the roster, it seems like pulling the trigger on a trade might not be a bad idea.

 

[Sharkonabicycle]

Get Reed back so we're not giving QBs ridiculous time to throw the ball. Ansah is hopefully getting up to speed (he's been out of football for a while). Stop running an exclusive 4-3 when there's 4+ receivers on the field especially when you're dropping both safeties.

We had quite a bit of secondary players out this week too... including Blair (2nd rounder). Collier was also out... hopefully they both suit up next game. We'll need both against Chubb (Cleveland's main threat).

Not sure I'm a HUGE fan of a Ramsey trade (and he may reel his attitude if Minshew is the real deal - Jags will have plenty of cap room). We gotta extend Reed and if we decide to extend Clowney that's going to be EXPENSIVE... he very much seems to like it here and is a PERFECT replacement for Bennett given his rush defense is EXCELLENT and he still generates pressure. I'd rather have Clowney than Ramsey and lose the 1st or 2nd it's going to cost us.

 

[flyerhawk]

Our problem is safety. Not sure how Ramsey fixes that.

 

[JMR]

We didn't get in Goff's face enough last night. I don't much care about teams trying to kill us with papercuts, but the chunk play after chunk play has to be stopped by pressure. It just wasn't there consistently last night.

 

[Wolverine830872]

all good points, hopefully with some better game calling, and getting personnel back on the field, is all that is needed to right the ship. The Rams have an offense that can put up a ton of points, but the end of the first half and second half were mind boggingly frustrating.

 

[Warden]

Getting Reed back is the key, inside pressure is what is missing

I always thought if we can get through his six game suspension with a winning record this season turn out to be very special

Pete Carroll’s teams always have slow starts to the season we’re they are very unpolished and consistently get better as the season progresses.

Let’s not forget, the Rams are a good team

 

[Screamin12th]

Our problem is safety. Not sure how Ramsey fixes that.

I do not fully agree with this, McDougal i think is ok ( Not great but ok )but they do need a TRUE Kam style FS. Griffin and Flowers have not been so great or even good to be honest and lets be honest here, yes they have at TIMES looked good but too often they have been beat. Then you got Linebackers trying to cover slot receivers running crossing routes ... uhm yeah that NEVER works and will get abused every time a team see's a LB lined up on the inside Receiver.

Hawks need to stop using the base 4-3 so damn much when there are 3+ WR on the field. When this Defense played it's best they were not in the Base 4-3 formation but i do completely understand WHY they are using the 4-3 so much. Thats the strength of this team because they are not deep or talented in the CB/S room like years past but are extremely deep at LB with 3 extremely talented Linebackers..

The short comings of this roster wont be fixed this year, they need some talent on the back end and we will have to wait for the offseason unless they go completely bonkers and use up draft picks in trades for 2-3 Defensive STARTERS. I do not believe they would be that stupid.

 

[Screamin12th]

their was a play where the Rams had 3 WR stacked on the left side and they were covered by KJ, Kendricks and flowers i was like omg thats bad. It went for a big gain also.

 

[flyerhawk]

I do not fully agree with this, McDougal i think is ok ( Not great but ok )but they do need a TRUE Kam style FS. Griffin and Flowers have not been so great or even good to be honest and lets be honest here, yes they have at TIMES looked good but too often they have been beat. Then you got Linebackers trying to cover slot receivers running crossing routes ... uhm yeah that NEVER works and will get abused every time a team see's a LB lined up on the inside Receiver.

First off Kam wasn't a free safety. He was a strong safety. McDougald has been adequate but Tedric Thompson has been pretty poor.

I have absolutely no idea how you can say that Griffin and Flower have not been good and then go on to talk about how everyone else has been failing.

How many times was Griffin even targeted last night? 2? 3? Griffin has been maybe our best defensive player so far this season.

Hawks need to stop using the base 4-3 so damn much when there are 3+ WR on the field. When this Defense played it's best they were not in the Base 4-3 formation but i do completely understand WHY they are using the 4-3 so much. Thats the strength of this team because they are not deep or talented in the CB/S room like years past but are extremely deep at LB with 3 extremely talented Linebackers..

I actually agree with you here. I think Kendricks play has not justified him being on the field as much as he has been.

The short comings of this roster wont be fixed this year, they need some talent on the back end and we will have to wait for the offseason unless they go completely bonkers and use up draft picks in trades for 2-3 Defensive STARTERS. I do not believe they would be that stupid.

If Blair can step up that would go a long way to improving the secondary.

 

[Screamin12th]

First off Kam wasn't a free safety. He was a strong safety. McDougald has been adequate but Tedric Thompson has been pretty poor.

I have absolutely no idea how you can say that Griffin and Flower have not been good and then go on to talk about how everyone else has been failing.

How many times was Griffin even targeted last night? 2? 3? Griffin has been maybe our best defensive player so far this season.



I actually agree with you here. I think Kendricks play has not justified him being on the field as much as he has been.



If Blair can step up that would go a long way to improving the secondary.

I did mean to say SS and you know I KNOW Kam was a SS. As for Griffin and Flowers like i said they have played OK but they are always in chase mode not cover mode. Griffin is slightly better than Flowers right now but neither is close to a shut down CB. Both are fine for say a CB2 but you need a little more there. The Speed on the back end also is not to good. McDougal is not slow but i do not care what people run in a 40 i want to see closing speed from our FS and he lacks that a little. If Blair was out there i believe he would have the best closing speed on the Defense. When a CB is beat they do not adjust to the ball or look back for a ball and drive hard on the WR instead, this tends to lead to PI and or missed ints. Neither seem able to locate well on balls in the air.

I believe both are solid corners for a #2 or #3 job just neither is a true #1 CB that this team needs. 22nd against the pass speaks loud and clear. Now i will say more pressure up front will help cure a lot of these short comings but we have seen Hawks teams generate less pressure up front than this and still shut down the passing game much more often. Griffin had a solid Rookie season and i would take the Rookie griffin over the one we are seeing now. Don't know why he is 3-4 yards behind WR more often than not when that was not the case 2 years ago. Get ontop of those guys and turn to locate. Hell maybe it's the DB coach?

 

[JMR]

Getting Reed back is the key, inside pressure is what is missing

I always thought if we can get through his six game suspension with a winning record this season turn out to be very special

Pete Carroll’s teams always have slow starts to the season we’re they are very unpolished and consistently get better as the season progresses.

Let’s not forget, the Rams are a good team

I wholeheartedly agree with the first and last statements. We didn't get consistent pressure on Goff, and we've seen before how his game deteriorates when that happens -- most recently in the SB. Goff isn't a top 5 passer or anything, but he certainly has enough arm talent and weapons around him to do damage when he can sit in the pocket for 3+ seconds and find a target.

And even though the Rams have now lost 2 straight, they certainly are still a "good" team and aren't going to drop to 6-10 just yet. Even at 3-2, I think most people still expect them to win 10+ games. Absolutely nothing wrong with beating them at home by only 1 point.

 

[flyerhawk]

Well you always look to be the contrarian but PFF had Griffin as a Top 10 Corner through the 1st 4 games of hte season.

 

[Judge Fudge]

I think two solutions( 1 is two part).

1. We wait for Reed to be back. That will take away double teams on our Pass rushers.

2. We get Ramsey and kick Flowers to his natural position of S.

 

[flyerhawk]

I think two solutions( 1 is two part).

1. We wait for Reed to be back. That will take away double teams on our Pass rushers.

2. We get Ramsey and kick Flowers to his natural position of S.

Ramsey comes with a ton of risk.

 

[Screamin12th]

the Hawks have played the 24th ,23rd, 21st passing teams out of the 5 teams ( the other two are the 13th and 2nd "Rams" ) yet are one of the WORST pass defenses in the league. oof

31st in passing first downs

I think two solutions( 1 is two part).

1. We wait for Reed to be back. That will take away double teams on our Pass rushers.

2. We get Ramsey and kick Flowers to his natural position of S.

that is a interesting idea but the issue is then you HAVE to have Ramsey, He would cost a 1st and 2nd and most likely even more because he has 2 years left on his contract. The Hawks might have to give up a 1st and 2nd in 2020 and a 1st in 2021. I am not on board with that one bit not even for a 1st and 2nd only. Maybe if it was just a 1st with all the picks they have in 2020, but still iffy for me.

I think Flowers at safety would put a little more speed back there and he can then play with everything in front of him.

 

[Warden]

Ramsey is having lots of back issues

 

[Podunkparte]

Ramsey is having lots of back issues

Is he though? Stefon Diggs was also out with a cold today, conveniently after rumors that he wants to be traded.

 

[Judge Fudge]

Ramsey comes with a ton of risk.

the Hawks have played the 24th ,23rd, 21st passing teams out of the 5 teams ( the other two are the 13th and 2nd "Rams" ) yet are one of the WORST pass defenses in the league. oof

31st in passing first downs




that is a interesting idea but the issue is then you HAVE to have Ramsey, He would cost a 1st and 2nd and most likely even more because he has 2 years left on his contract. The Hawks might have to give up a 1st and 2nd in 2020 and a 1st in 2021. I am not on board with that one bit not even for a 1st and 2nd only. Maybe if it was just a 1st with all the picks they have in 2020, but still iffy for me.

I think Flowers at safety would put a little more speed back there and he can then play with everything in front of him.

Or draft a CB and move Flowers to FS next year

 

[flyerhawk]

IMO, the bigger problem is that we aren't getting enough pass rush. Hopefully Reed will make a difference.

 

[MrS]

We need our first round pick for OL next year, trading it away for a CB would be a waste at this point.