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Haskins...Yes or No?

Should Dwayne Haskins start immediately?

  • 1. YES

    Votes: 10 33.3%
  • 2. NO

    Votes: 13 43.3%
  • 3. Maybe (explain)

    Votes: 7 23.3%

  • Total voters
    30

tomcat1

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Even if they miss the playoffs but are competitive & the young players contribute that will be a very good sign. This is not necessarily a team built to win now (although they could) but rather a team designed to compete on a longer term basis. Make no mistake - there are still holes that need to be addressed, but they are potentially building a solid nucleus.

IMO the first 3 rds of the draft are the key. That is where you have to build your foundation. In the last 3 seasons the Skins appear to be doing that (although 2018 draft is a little shaky - Anderson & Moreau need to step up). Look at the Skins drafts from 2005-2016. With a few exceptions (Kerrigan, Scherff, Orakpo, Reed, etc) the first 3 rds were a disaster. That is 12 years of drafting with precious little to show - not a good way to build a team. Later picks can help build the team, but you are not going to win relying mainly on those guys.

If Haskins, Sweat & McLaurin can contribute (along with virtual rookie Guice) that will be a great sign regardless of the win-loss total. We will see.

Well said! However, at the end of last season we were an embarrassment to even be called an NFL team due to injuries along with any other reasons that one would want to use. And now we've got some Redskins fans saying that we will possibly be a playoff contender this coming season. The odds are slim and none that we can turn things around this quickly regardless of the great draft we had. There are just too many unknowns at this point for me to buy into all the hype that many Redskins fans are buying into with unproven rookies, undetermined starting positions, annual history of key injuries, annual history of inept management, lack of depth at key positions, a tough schedule, and the list goes on. I am happy with what we have done in the last two drafts towards building for the future but I'm also very concerned that our front office will find a way to screw this up too. Except for the Eagles the rest of the NFC East looks weak to me and I just don't see a wildcard team coming out of this division. I hope I will be pleasantly surprised!
 

SoCalWizFan

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Well said! However, at the end of last season we were an embarrassment to even be called an NFL team due to injuries along with any other reasons that one would want to use. And now we've got some Redskins fans saying that we will possibly be a playoff contender this coming season. The odds are slim and none that we can turn things around this quickly regardless of the great draft we had. There are just too many unknowns at this point for me to buy into all the hype that many Redskins fans are buying into with unproven rookies, undetermined starting positions, annual history of key injuries, annual history of inept management, lack of depth at key positions, a tough schedule, and the list goes on. I am happy with what we have done in the last two drafts towards building for the future but I'm also very concerned that our front office will find a way to screw this up too. Except for the Eagles the rest of the NFC East looks weak to me and I just don't see a wildcard team coming out of this division. I hope I will be pleasantly surprised!

I see your pt & agree with a lot of it. In the end getting to the SB is all that matters. Nobody cares about a team that gets to the playoffs periodically, is bounced early & then falls flat the following season. That has been the Skins MO over the last 20 years. With some of the recent moves the Redskins may be moving in another direction. That is one of the reasons why I am as much or more concerned about an infusion of young talent than just Ws & Ls. You are absolutely correct that several things can & will go wrong next season. Almost a given that some of their picks won't stick, but if several make significant contributions it will be yet another year of using the draft successfully.

I share your concerns about the front office, but we may be seeing a trend of that area being handled differently moving forward. Bruce Allen appears to be leaning more towards running admin & PR type duties & leaving personnel duties to others. It is quite possible that the A. Smith/Cousins debacle may have helped influence some of this. We will see if they keep operating in this mode - hope so.
 

Shanemansj13

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Thought I would drop this here:


I think the Big Ben comparison is a good one by Simms.
 

tomcat1

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I see your pt & agree with a lot of it. In the end getting to the SB is all that matters. Nobody cares about a team that gets to the playoffs periodically, is bounced early & then falls flat the following season. That has been the Skins MO over the last 20 years. With some of the recent moves the Redskins may be moving in another direction. That is one of the reasons why I am as much or more concerned about an infusion of young talent than just Ws & Ls. You are absolutely correct that several things can & will go wrong next season. Almost a given that some of their picks won't stick, but if several make significant contributions it will be yet another year of using the draft successfully.

I share your concerns about the front office, but we may be seeing a trend of that area being handled differently moving forward. Bruce Allen appears to be leaning more towards running admin & PR type duties & leaving personnel duties to others. It is quite possible that the A. Smith/Cousins debacle may have helped influence some of this. We will see if they keep operating in this mode - hope so.

You indeed make some excellent points! I'm excited about our young talent and in particular I hope that Harmon, who played his college football in my backyard, makes it with his OBJ type hands when it comes to catching a football. Also, Love, who played his high school football in almost my backyard, is a guy I'm really cheering for to be 100% in a year from now and hopefully sooner. I'm looking forward to watching all of our drafted young talent develop that make our roster. We're certainly putting some good pieces into place for the future but whenever this translates into winning is anyone's guess.
 

skinsdad62

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I see your pt & agree with a lot of it. In the end getting to the SB is all that matters. Nobody cares about a team that gets to the playoffs periodically, is bounced early & then falls flat the following season. That has been the Skins MO over the last 20 years. With some of the recent moves the Redskins may be moving in another direction. That is one of the reasons why I am as much or more concerned about an infusion of young talent than just Ws & Ls. You are absolutely correct that several things can & will go wrong next season. Almost a given that some of their picks won't stick, but if several make significant contributions it will be yet another year of using the draft successfully.

I share your concerns about the front office, but we may be seeing a trend of that area being handled differently moving forward. Bruce Allen appears to be leaning more towards running admin & PR type duties & leaving personnel duties to others. It is quite possible that the A. Smith/Cousins debacle may have helped influence some of this. We will see if they keep operating in this mode - hope so.

To make the playoffs consistently you have got to start somewhere , why not now ?
 

Sportster 72

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Teams turn around in a year or two. Five year building programs are things of the past. You need a core of guys, then the right pieces to compliment them. Four years in the league is a long time these days. Injuries, performance, contracts force things to change on a constant basis.

Lets look at the defensive line just for an example Ironman - year 4; Allen - year 3; Payne - year 2 …. add 4 years … how many are still here and we all know these are 3 good football players. Where do you think the three of them will be 4 years from now?
 

tomcat1

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Teams turn around in a year or two. Five year building programs are things of the past. You need a core of guys, then the right pieces to compliment them. Four years in the league is a long time these days. Injuries, performance, contracts force things to change on a constant basis.

Lets look at the defensive line just for an example Ironman - year 4; Allen - year 3; Payne - year 2 …. add 4 years … how many are still here and we all know these are 3 good football players. Where do you think the three of them will be 4 years from now?

I get your point and I guess this is why good drafting is so important which we have done well for the past couple of years. Build Skins Build!
 

SoCalWizFan

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To make the playoffs consistently you have got to start somewhere , why not now ?

Absolutely - I don't disagree with that at all. I like that fact that it appears at this time like they are trying to build with youth & primarily via the draft. They certainly have not done that very well in the past. Again I believe that one of the keys is likely leaving Allen out of most personnel decisions - at least the major ones. Again - if they miss the playoffs but show signs of progress being fueled by younger players then that will be a very good sign. We will see.
 

SoCalWizFan

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Teams turn around in a year or two. Five year building programs are things of the past. You need a core of guys, then the right pieces to compliment them. Four years in the league is a long time these days. Injuries, performance, contracts force things to change on a constant basis.

Lets look at the defensive line just for an example Ironman - year 4; Allen - year 3; Payne - year 2 …. add 4 years … how many are still here and we all know these are 3 good football players. Where do you think the three of them will be 4 years from now?

Absolutely & I am not suggesting a 4-5 year rebuilding period - just not trying to turn everything around in one year (like the Redskins have unsuccessfully done many times in the past while throwing away picks & $$ in the process). I think that we are basically on the same page. Looking forward to the upcoming season.
 

Sportster 72

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Absolutely & I am not suggesting a 4-5 year rebuilding period - just not trying to turn everything around in one year (like the Redskins have unsuccessfully done many times in the past while throwing away picks & $$ in the process). I think that we are basically on the same page. Looking forward to the upcoming season.

I am not suggesting spending tons of money on FAs or giving up a lot of draft picks. I don't favor either of those ideas. Just stating that 4 years in the NFL is a long time.
 

SoCalWizFan

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I am not suggesting spending tons of money on FAs or giving up a lot of draft picks. I don't favor either of those ideas. Just stating that 4 years in the NFL is a long time.

Yep - even a two year plan is a good one. Just saying that trying to it done in one year is a bad idea especially with a team like the Redskins who have plenty of holes (this idea that the Redskins only issue was injuries is nonsense).

The teams who magically turned things around in one season in almost all cases already had a solid nuclear in place. It is not as if they went from no talent at all to SB contenders. They were just missing some pieces. Again - Redskins appear to be in better shape in this area & IMO will continue to get better if Allen just sticks to TV interviews & admin related matters.
 

skinsdad62

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well if gruden is let go, then what ? you are looking at a possible 4-5 year rebuild because new staffs means new ideas and new ideas can mean different types of players

i think we can contend , the next step is being a perennial playoff team

playing haskins should only be considered if he is the best qb to get wins . if he isnt then sit him and let him learn .
in my opinion CK is just as likely to lead us to wins as CDC was . hence my displeasure with the ASS trade
 

tomcat1

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Yep - even a two year plan is a good one. Just saying that trying to it done in one year is a bad idea especially with a team like the Redskins who have plenty of holes (this idea that the Redskins only issue was injuries is nonsense).

The teams who magically turned things around in one season in almost all cases already had a solid nuclear in place. It is not as if they went from no talent at all to SB contenders. They were just missing some pieces. Again - Redskins appear to be in better shape in this area & IMO will continue to get better if Allen just sticks to TV interviews & admin related matters.

This is exactly what you and I have been agreeing on. A two year plan to be a playoff contender makes sense but right now we lack depth at many positions. Just go back to last season and look at our makeshift offensive line with a different starting lineup almost every game due to the lack of depth. Where have we corrected this to any extent all of a sudden? Like you said, injury issues has not been our only issues and once we build depth an injury won't be so glaring but it takes more than a year to build depth.
 

Sportster 72

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It is really not a 2 year plan or a 5 year plan. What you guys have been saying is correct. High importance on the draft, fill holes with moderate priced FAs. It is a one year plan … every year. In three years some of your best players will be gone.

What if the team has relatively good health and Martin works at LG. What if a healthy Quinn, McLaurin and Richardson work out. You have potentially three good RBs and that isn't counting Love.

How awesome could the pressure be with Kerrigan, Ironman, Payne, Allen and Sweat. Maybe the addition of Collins is a big deal and the CBs play well.

Maybe something doesn't work … but that is how it happens.
 

tomcat1

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It is really not a 2 year plan or a 5 year plan. What you guys have been saying is correct. High importance on the draft, fill holes with moderate priced FAs. It is a one year plan … every year. In three years some of your best players will be gone.

What if the team has relatively good health and Martin works at LG. What if a healthy Quinn, McLaurin and Richardson work out. You have potentially three good RBs and that isn't counting Love.

How awesome could the pressure be with Kerrigan, Ironman, Payne, Allen and Sweat. Maybe the addition of Collins is a big deal and the CBs play well.

Maybe something doesn't work … but that is how it happens.

You presented a lot of IFS and we all know that the Redskins are not very good at IFS, right?
 

Sportster 72

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You presented a lot of IFS and we all know that the Redskins are not very good at IFS, right?

Sure but anyone needs things to go right to win also. I presented reality also. Build a core, draft well every year. If you ask me have the Skins done that then the answer is no and I don't really expect they will but I know you can't wait 5 years. How many players that will be on the team this year will be here in 5 years? 10-15?
 

tomcat1

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Sure but anyone needs things to go right to win also. I presented reality also. Build a core, draft well every year. If you ask me have the Skins done that then the answer is no and I don't really expect they will but I know you can't wait 5 years. How many players that will be on the team this year will be here in 5 years? 10-15?

I've always appreciated and respected your posts. Like you, I live in the real world too, and unlike a few other Redskins fans here I just can't see the turnaround as quickly as they do. I do think we are moving in the right direction but I don't believe in overnight success.
 

skinz2winz

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It has been essentially since Theismann was our field general that I can remember having a qb who had me believing the Skins could win week in week out. Let's hope Haskins brings that resurgence of faith in the position as he begins to take over. Whenever that may be.
 

Sportster 72

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It has been essentially since Theismann was our field general that I can remember having a qb who had me believing the Skins could win week in week out. Let's hope Haskins brings that resurgence of faith in the position as he begins to take over. Whenever that may be.

You had one but the FO blew that deal. The one that just left was going to smash Theismann's stats …. without the running game and defense Theismann had. Hopefully the new No. 7 can play as well as the guy we let walk.
 

SoCalWizFan

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Sure but anyone needs things to go right to win also. I presented reality also. Build a core, draft well every year. If you ask me have the Skins done that then the answer is no and I don't really expect they will but I know you can't wait 5 years. How many players that will be on the team this year will be here in 5 years? 10-15?

Until about 3 years ago I would agree that the Skins didn't use the draft well & were not building a solid foundation. They didn't draft well & didn't value draft capital. IMO that was due to incompetent FO leadership (Vinny, Allen), poor feedback from others (Spurrier, Zorn, etc) & great football minds who were not necessarily good personnel men (Gibbs, Shanahan). As I have shown in previous posts this resulted in bad drafts (possibly the worst draft history in NFL over an extended time). Even their one legit GM (SM) didn't do a good job w/ the draft during his short tenure.

I truly believe that the ones actually making the picks over the last 3 years have done a very good job & this likely will bode will for the future if they retain most of the FO & keep Bruce Allen out of personnel matters. The Alex Smith trade was bad, but it may wind up being a blessing in disguise since it may have been a wakeup call to stop making moves that are sexy, short sighted ones. I truly believe that the Skins FO from several years ago would have panicked & traded up for Haskins & we would be viewing him in a somewhat different light rt now.

I am with you in terms of hoping for success rt away but am encouraged that if that doesn't happen they have a good chance of being well positioned for 2020 & beyond. HTTR
 
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