Gilmore Holding Out?

[nefansince75]

Is this you today pick every fucking word apart. Or are you being intentionally obtuse if you don't get the point I don't know what to say

I'm doing neither. I was just emphasizing he should play this year based on his old contract, and be willing to do so since he will already have the new contract and some of it's money in hand.

 

[Southieinnc]

I never read or heard he would not agree to a physical with us? Is the fact or speculation?

Speculation.

He has been alluding to showing up for camp but not being able. That would prevent the fines unless a team doctor said he is fit to practice.

 

[BigKen]

I never read or heard he would not agree to a physical with us? Is the fact or speculation?

At the mandatory OTA every player is given a physical so that by league rules he is cleared medically to compete.
Gilmore did not show up. The team only does medical exams as dictated by the CBA and can't force a player to have any kind of medical exam other than those agreed in the CBA. Gilmore had a surgical procedure to repair a partially torn quad. The surgeon that performed must give the league/team a full report on the entire procedure and the end result of the that procedure. Then he recommends an itinerary of rehabilitation. The player (Gilmore) can follow that itinerary or can follow another one as long as it's approved medically.

Gilmore had not been to Gillette, by his own admission publicly. If he admits to not attending those mandatory OTAs and not being to Gillette, one can only surmise that the Patriots staff has not had an opportunity to examine or test him.

Since he stated two weeks ago that he was not 100% yet, then one can only surmise that he hasn't completed his rehab.

It's not horse racing. You don't lay out the cash and hope you win. IN the NFL, nothing is a sure thing but when making a bet, you want the odds in your favor to greatest degree.

 

[Southieinnc]

At the mandatory OTA every player is given a physical so that by league rules he is cleared medically to compete.
Gilmore did not show up. The team only does medical exams as dictated by the CBA and can't force a player to have any kind of medical exam other than those agreed in the CBA. Gilmore had a surgical procedure to repair a partially torn quad. The surgeon that performed must give the league/team a full report on the entire procedure and the end result of the that procedure. Then he recommends an itinerary of rehabilitation. The player (Gilmore) can follow that itinerary or can follow another one as long as it's approved medically.

Gilmore had not been to Gillette, by his own admission publicly. If he admits to not attending those mandatory OTAs and not being to Gillette, one can only surmise that the Patriots staff has not had an opportunity to examine or test him.

Since he stated two weeks ago that he was not 100% yet, then one can only surmise that he hasn't completed his rehab.

It's not horse racing. You don't lay out the cash and hope you win. IN the NFL, nothing is a sure thing but when making a bet, you want the odds in your favor to greatest degree.

That may be a ploy to not practice and not be fined.

 

[YankeeRebel]

At the mandatory OTA every player is given a physical so that by league rules he is cleared medically to compete.
Gilmore did not show up. The team only does medical exams as dictated by the CBA and can't force a player to have any kind of medical exam other than those agreed in the CBA. Gilmore had a surgical procedure to repair a partially torn quad. The surgeon that performed must give the league/team a full report on the entire procedure and the end result of the that procedure. Then he recommends an itinerary of rehabilitation. The player (Gilmore) can follow that itinerary or can follow another one as long as it's approved medically.

Gilmore had not been to Gillette, by his own admission publicly. If he admits to not attending those mandatory OTAs and not being to Gillette, one can only surmise that the Patriots staff has not had an opportunity to examine or test him.

Since he stated two weeks ago that he was not 100% yet, then one can only surmise that he hasn't completed his rehab.

It's not horse racing. You don't lay out the cash and hope you win. IN the NFL, nothing is a sure thing but when making a bet, you want the odds in your favor to greatest degree.

None of this means he refused or will refuse a physical exam

 

[BigKen]

None of this means he refused or will refuse a physical exam

He's avoiding it. Two reasons and two only.

1. He's not healed and is not ready to compete.
2. The surgery didn't fix it.

If it's #1, no way in hell the Pats negotiate until he's well enough.

If it's #2, he's farting up wind. He knows he's done and it's over.

If he's holding out and it's #1 or #2, the contract is invalid unless there's a specific clause referring directly to that injury. Shit gets very complicated and he will have to submit to a medical exam before he gets a penny.

 

[YankeeRebel]

He's avoiding it. Two reasons and two only.

1. He's not healed and is not ready to compete.
2. The surgery didn't fix it.

If it's #1, no way in hell the Pats negotiate until he's well enough.

If it's #2, he's farting up wind. He knows he's done and it's over.

If he's holding out and it's #1 or #2, the contract is invalid unless there's a specific clause referring directly to that injury. Shit gets very complicated and he will have to submit to a medical exam before he gets a penny.

No one knows he refused anything that is all 100% conjecture. We do know he is holding out, it's believed for more money but both sides are smart enough to know that deal won't happen without a physical. This is a game of chicken between the player and agent vs the franchise. You or anyone else saying he is refusing a physical simply cannot be proven so don't say it.

 

[Yankee Traveler]

I'm just hoping he's in Foxborough to pick off Brady Ty law/Peyton Manning style.

 

[BigKen]

No one knows he refused anything that is all 100% conjecture. We do know he is holding out, it's believed for more money but both sides are smart enough to know that deal won't happen without a physical. This is a game of chicken between the player and agent vs the franchise. You or anyone else saying he is refusing a physical simply cannot be proven so don't say it.

I just went back to June 15 and read every one of my posts. Not once did ever say he has "REFUSED" a physical. You did.

I did say that he would have to pass one, needed one and have talked all around it and today, I said avoid it.

Could you go back and find where I said he has refused to take a physical or be examined by a doctor? Post it and I'll accept it. Otherwise, I'll accept your apology for charging me a third time.

 

[Southieinnc]

No one knows he refused anything that is all 100% conjecture. We do know he is holding out, it's believed for more money but both sides are smart enough to know that deal won't happen without a physical. This is a game of chicken between the player and agent vs the franchise. You or anyone else saying he is refusing a physical simply cannot be proven so don't say it.

Sort of.
He could do a pysical but that would show:
1) he is not ready to play. - bad position to negotiate long term deal
2) he is ready to play. - if he holds out, he will incur fines.

 

[YankeeRebel]

He's avoiding it. Two reasons and two only.

1. He's not healed and is not ready to compete.
2. The surgery didn't fix it.

If it's #1, no way in hell the Pats negotiate until he's well enough.

If it's #2, he's farting up wind. He knows he's done and it's over.

If he's holding out and it's #1 or #2, the contract is invalid unless there's a specific clause referring directly to that injury. Shit gets very complicated and he will have to submit to a medical exam before he gets a penny.

I just went back to June 15 and read every one of my posts. Not once did ever say he has "REFUSED" a physical. You did.

I did say that he would have to pass one, needed one and have talked all around it and today, I said avoid it.

Could you go back and find where I said he has refused to take a physical or be examined by a doctor? Post it and I'll accept it. Otherwise, I'll accept your apology for charging me a third time.

 

[Yankee Traveler]

If someone here twits....
I just read on Reddit that Field Yates Twitted that Gilmore reported with Vets and was put on PUP...?

Can anyone confirm?

 

[Yankee Traveler]

Here's more...

NFL Rumors: Patriots' Stephon Gilmore Present At Training Camp

New England Patriots cornerback Stephon Gilmore reportedly was present for the start of training camp despite being amid a contract battle.

nesn.com

 

[Southieinnc]

So by showing up and going PUP, he can't be fined. Story to follow!

 

[Yankee Traveler]

So by showing up and going PUP, he can't be fined. Story to follow!

I would think it would also lessen his bargaining power.
Gilmore: "Bill, Robert, I want more money, you know I can ball."
Bill: "I know you can when your healthy, but I gave you half of this years salary last year and you finished on IR and look, your STILL physically unable to perform. Why should I give you a raise to sit in the tub?"

 

[Southieinnc]

I would think it would also lessen his bargaining power.
Gilmore: "Bill, Robert, I want more money, you know I can ball."
Bill: "I know you can when your healthy, but I gave you half of this years salary last year and you finished on IR and look, your STILL physically unable to perform. Why should I give you a raise to sit in the tub?"

Who's going to flinch?
Everybody knows what is really going on. (sort of)

 

[BigKen]

Yep. He reported and BB immediately put him on PUP.

!0 others were put on it too.

Guess who??? Would you believe Jarrett Stidham??

 

[YankeeRebel]

So by showing up and going PUP, he can't be fined. Story to follow!

And BB is the one to put the player on PUP correct? If so to me this means one of two things. 1. He was placed on PUP because he never took the team physical so BB needs that assessment before he is willing to talk about a deal, if there is one. I cannot see the Pats making a deal without knowing the full extent of his recovery. 2. Sitting him so other team doctors from a team he may be traded to can make their medical assessment. Fines are not something I think either side is to worried about.

Are the Pats a better defense with him on the field? Yes I think that is true. As I eluded to before do we give him more money or think about JC Jackson and what it may take to keep him.

 

[YankeeRebel]

Stidham on PUP is curious to me.

 

[Yankee Traveler]

And BB is the one to put the player on PUP correct? If so to me this means one of two things. 1. He was placed on PUP because he never took the team physical so BB needs that assessment before he is willing to talk about a deal, if there is one. I cannot see the Pats making a deal without knowing the full extent of his recovery. 2. Sitting him so other team doctors from a team he may be traded to can make their medical assessment. Fines are not something I think either side is to worried about.

Are the Pats a better defense with him on the field? Yes I think that is true. As I eluded to before do we give him more money or think about JC Jackson and what it may take to keep him.

I say extend him with an incentive contract and resign JC Jackson too.