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Geno Staying put

Anointed One

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Lock just needs to go and replace it with a late round pick.... that's not the answer. Seattle's cap has about $50M at the moment.... with a minimal roster thanks to the ridiculous money we're paying safeties... that's before increases... but $30M in year 1 with Geno is basically a non-starter, which means it has to be a longer term agreement.
I'm not saying I disagree with you... I just think Carroll/JS really like him... I feel like if they can convince him to sign as a backup they'd keep him...
 

Sharkonabicycle

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Those two weren't ranked as high as Geno was this year when negotiating their contract with ATL/CAR...

View attachment 319282

So is Seattle's offensive roster compared to Carolina/Atlanta.... Outside of Pitts and... uh... ........

And Waldron is a very good OC... we'll be lucky to retain him if we retain Carroll because I would fully expect him to be seeking a head coaching job... and Metcalf/Lockett are MILES above what Carolina/Atlanta has to offer. And Walker is also better than anything they have to offer... and Lucas is the best RT across those 3 teams and Cross is comparable... it's not even close.
 

JMR

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I'd be surprised if our QB room isn't making around 30-35 million next season... That is definitely a manageable number in today's NFL...

I believe they give Geno a 2-3 yr agreement worth 28-30 million along w/ Drew Lock 5-6 million to retain him... I feel that management believes that Lock can be a starter in this league...
I think you can get Geno re-signed on a fair deal (not a bargain, not a gross overpay) for multiple years and work the cap hit so it's only around $20M in 2023. Something like this:

5 years, $150M ($40M SB):
  • 2023: 14M base + 8M SB
  • 2024: 18M base + 8M SB
  • 2025: 22M base + 8M SB
  • 2026: 26M base + 8M SB
  • 2027: 30M base + 8M SB
You can get out from under that after 2 years if you really wanted to, and you could cut him after the 3rd year and save $10M. It's crude and I'm sure there would be all sorts of finer details, but something like that should be easily workable. If the cap is $225M next year as projected, a $22M cap salary would be less than 10%. Some would still squawk about $30M AAV, but those are the people who clearly don't want Geno back at any kind of realistic price.
 

MrS

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Geno is 33, why would we give him a 5 year deal? Unless the last two years are void years
 

flyerhawk

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He may get a five-year contract, but with an out after one or two.

Unless a team does something stupid, which is always possible.

Of course his contract will have lots of outs for the team on the back half. He's 32 years old and has one good season under his belt.

I don't watch a lot of Seahawks game - why were December/January less impressive for Geno? Looks like he was getting sacked more, throwing more interceptions, and his yards per attempt dropped.

The offensive line started to wear down. Having 2 rookie tackles started to show some cracks. The running game was non-existent. Tyle Lockett got hurt. And we played really good defenses.
 

flyerhawk

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Geno is 33, why would we give him a 5 year deal? Unless the last two years are void years

Most contracts have essentially voidable years to make the cap hit less painful.
 

wilwhite

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Those two weren't ranked as high as Geno was this year when negotiating their contract with ATL/CAR...

View attachment 319282
That's not a ranking, but yes, you're right.

My point was that yes, teams do sign starting QBs for <$10M

In fact Geno was signed as a FA this year for $3.5M, and they didn't have a more expensive QB (or highly drafted QB) on the roster.

Winston was signed as a FA in NO in 2021 for $5.5M, and Fitzpatrick in Washington for $10M. So it happens.
 

Anointed One

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The offensive line started to wear down. Having 2 rookie tackles started to show some cracks. The running game was non-existent. Tyle Lockett got hurt. And we played really good defenses.
Wasn't the main reason for the slight decline but losing Dissly looked like it played a factor in the run/passing game... He's such a great blocker and seemed to be Geno's favorite TE target... Seemed like when he went down with the season ending injury, it had some impact on the offense... The intangibles he brings to the offensive side of the ball are tough to replace...
 

JMR

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Geno is 33, why would we give him a 5 year deal? Unless the last two years are void years
Geno is 32. Won't be 33 for 9 more months. QBs can sustain their level of play at a later age than every other position, and Geno has barely played the last 6 years before this one. He's probably the youngest 32 year old in the league in terms of mileage. If he played 5 more years, he would still be younger at the end of it than Aaron Rodgers was at the end of the 2021 season. I really don't see how his age is a factor for this next contract.
 

MrS

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Geno is 32. Won't be 33 for 9 more months. QBs can sustain their level of play at a later age than every other position, and Geno has barely played the last 6 years before this one. He's probably the youngest 32 year old in the league in terms of mileage. If he played 5 more years, he would still be younger at the end of it than Aaron Rodgers was at the end of the 2021 season. I really don't see how his age is a factor for this next contract.
so he will be 33 at the start of the year.

being a QB isnt like being a RB, some guys lose arm strength as they age. 35 seems to be the peak age for most QBs, pretty rare when they are still at the top beyond that age. Brady doesnt count.

so give him 3 years, 4 if you want thin the cap hit out for the first year.
 

HaroldSeattle

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so he will be 33 at the start of the year.

being a QB isnt like being a RB, some guys lose arm strength as they age. 35 seems to be the peak age for most QBs, pretty rare when they are still at the top beyond that age. Brady doesnt count.

so give him 3 years, 4 if you want thin the cap hit out for the first year.
QBs lose their mobility as they age and get easier to sack and require a OL that gives them extra time and they decline to run even with nothing but green ahead of them because they don't want to take the punishment. The arm is the last to start fading but it does fade and if they had a cannon to begin with they can still throw with a fading arm, just not as well. RW had a cannon Geno arm is OK not a cannon though. Geno has a small handful of games he's played well, he's been playing to keep his career alive, fail in 2022 and he would be out of the NFL. Nobody was interested in signing him except Seattle last summer. The idea that Seahawks should give him a 40 million signing bonus is irresponsible line of thinking. Draft a rookie QB, have the advantage of saving a huge amount of cap on the QB position and you can use that cap to build the roster. Maybe sign Payne who would upgrade the DL immediately and immensely and you could also draft a nose tackle like Ika, a inside LB, a center, a guard ect. The cap advantage would continue for 4-5 years and the Seahawks are in the position of drafting one of the top prospects at QB and having their franchise QB.
TBH I'm sort of dumbfounded that fans are pushing to sign Geno even at great cost, he's not that player to take the Seahawks to the SB and he's more likely to fail than continue having success. A short bridge contract at bridge cost is fine, beyond that wish him luck and let him leave. There was a reason Geno only got a one year contract and that is because the plan was to move on from him after this season.
 

MrS

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QBs lose their mobility as they age and get easier to sack and require a OL that gives them extra time and they decline to run even with nothing but green ahead of them because they don't want to take the punishment. The arm is the last to start fading but it does fade and if they had a cannon to begin with they can still throw with a fading arm, just not as well. RW had a cannon Geno arm is OK not a cannon though. Geno has a small handful of games he's played well, he's been playing to keep his career alive, fail in 2022 and he would be out of the NFL. Nobody was interested in signing him except Seattle last summer. The idea that Seahawks should give him a 40 million signing bonus is irresponsible line of thinking. Draft a rookie QB, have the advantage of saving a huge amount of cap on the QB position and you can use that cap to build the roster. Maybe sign Payne who would upgrade the DL immediately and immensely and you could also draft a nose tackle like Ika, a inside LB, a center, a guard ect. The cap advantage would continue for 4-5 years and the Seahawks are in the position of drafting one of the top prospects at QB and having their franchise QB.
TBH I'm sort of dumbfounded that fans are pushing to sign Geno even at great cost, he's not that player to take the Seahawks to the SB and he's more likely to fail than continue having success. A short bridge contract at bridge cost is fine, beyond that wish him luck and let him leave. There was a reason Geno only got a one year contract and that is because the plan was to move on from him after this season.
Im starting to come around to this, but I think we are going to see geno resigned sooner than anticipated.

If that does happen, a trade down that nets us a future first should be a priority so we can trade up next year for a QB in a class that will most likely be loaded
 

Anointed One

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That's not a ranking, but yes, you're right.

My point was that yes, teams do sign starting QBs for <$10M

In fact Geno was signed as a FA this year for $3.5M, and they didn't have a more expensive QB (or highly drafted QB) on the roster.

Winston was signed as a FA in NO in 2021 for $5.5M, and Fitzpatrick in Washington for $10M. So it happens.

Yes, it happens... I do understand what you're saying... If Geno had not made the Pro Bowl and just had a mediocre year like Winston/Fitz did before signing, I could see us getting him for around 10-12 million... Winston's last starting Gig before signing that contract was a 30 interception season... We have a different situation than Fitz/Winston, imo... Also, those were contracts given out to those guys two years ago... It's now 2023... Cost of Goods has gone up... :D

But to your point, if we ended up signing a guy like Drew Lock instead, then I would expect us to sign him for 10 million or less - just like Fitz/Winston...
 
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flyerhawk

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QBs lose their mobility as they age and get easier to sack and require a OL that gives them extra time and they decline to run even with nothing but green ahead of them because they don't want to take the punishment. The arm is the last to start fading but it does fade and if they had a cannon to begin with they can still throw with a fading arm, just not as well. RW had a cannon Geno arm is OK not a cannon though. Geno has a small handful of games he's played well, he's been playing to keep his career alive, fail in 2022 and he would be out of the NFL. Nobody was interested in signing him except Seattle last summer. The idea that Seahawks should give him a 40 million signing bonus is irresponsible line of thinking. Draft a rookie QB, have the advantage of saving a huge amount of cap on the QB position and you can use that cap to build the roster. Maybe sign Payne who would upgrade the DL immediately and immensely and you could also draft a nose tackle like Ika, a inside LB, a center, a guard ect. The cap advantage would continue for 4-5 years and the Seahawks are in the position of drafting one of the top prospects at QB and having their franchise QB.
TBH I'm sort of dumbfounded that fans are pushing to sign Geno even at great cost, he's not that player to take the Seahawks to the SB and he's more likely to fail than continue having success. A short bridge contract at bridge cost is fine, beyond that wish him luck and let him leave. There was a reason Geno only got a one year contract and that is because the plan was to move on from him after this season.

Not all of us see drafting a QB as a panacea solution. Personally I think that building the defense is the highest priority, then the OL. Without that, it doesn't really matter who the QB is.

I think you are far more bullish on the QBs in this draft that I am.
 

JMR

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so he will be 33 at the start of the year.

being a QB isnt like being a RB, some guys lose arm strength as they age. 35 seems to be the peak age for most QBs, pretty rare when they are still at the top beyond that age. Brady doesnt count.
I agree: QBs have way more longevity than RBs (and pretty much everyone else). I didn't mention anything about Brady, but we have seen many QBs play just fine into their late 30s over the last couple decades. Geno is ~5 months older than Derek Carr and ~1 year older than Jimmy G.
so give him 3 years, 4 if you want thin the cap hit out for the first year.
A 5 year deal can easily be structured to effectively be a 3 year deal, when Geno would start the season at 35 years old.
 

JMR

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QBs lose their mobility as they age and get easier to sack and require a OL that gives them extra time and they decline to run even with nothing but green ahead of them because they don't want to take the punishment. The arm is the last to start fading but it does fade and if they had a cannon to begin with they can still throw with a fading arm, just not as well. RW had a cannon Geno arm is OK not a cannon though.

Father Time is still undefeated for sure, but Geno is still in the fat part of his prime curve for a QB. And very low miles for not playing much at all for 6 seasons. People who are bringing up age as a detriment to signing him are grasping at straws. Maybe it's different if he's 36 or 37, but he just turned 32 three months ago.

Geno has a small handful of games he's played well,
Bullshit. You can be against bringing Geno back but also tell the truth about how he played this year. You aren't, and it compromises your credibility in the discussion to the point where it is a clear waste of time to continue it with you.
 

HaroldSeattle

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Father Time is still undefeated for sure, but Geno is still in the fat part of his prime curve for a QB. And very low miles for not playing much at all for 6 seasons. People who are bringing up age as a detriment to signing him are grasping at straws. Maybe it's different if he's 36 or 37, but he just turned 32 three months ago.


Bullshit. You can be against bringing Geno back but also tell the truth about how he played this year. You aren't, and it compromises your credibility in the discussion to the point where it is a clear waste of time to continue it with you.
It's true he had more mediocre games than big games, and that includes most of the second half of the season. Fact.
 

flyerhawk

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It's true he had more mediocre games than big games, and that includes most of the second half of the season. Fact.

Making a subjective statement and then calling it fact isn't helping your argument.

What are you defining as a mediocre game? Which QBs do you think outplayed him this year? If you think that Geno had more mediocre games than good games that would imply that he was no better than a middle of the pack QB this year.
 

JMR

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Making a subjective statement and then calling it fact isn't helping your argument.
That's what he does though -- a bunch of subjective fluff strung together with speculative wind.
 
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