Detroit Tigers Ongoing 2015 Thread

[MiamiVice]

It could honestly be argued that Miguel Cabrera has seen more 100 mph fast balls in one inning than Ted Williams and Babe Ruth saw in there entire career combined.

 

[broncosmitty]

While the Glog is fresh on my brain....

I remember this one day, I got off work at lunch. And started drinking. Tigers had a day game. Sucks and I went back and forth aboot Chaldeans for hours. Lol. Don't know why I remember that, but I do.

That and BizzyBone.

 

[MiamiVice]

Davis Ortiz is is 39 years old and very similar body type to Miguel Cabrera... He has 36 HR and over 100 RBI this year... and he never was the hitter Miguel Cabrera is.... I am pretty sure Miguel Cabrera will still be hitting a baseball well above average into his late 30's and early 40's... I think Miggy still has a good 3 years of playing first base left in him to be honest.

 

[broncosmitty]

It could honestly be argued that Miguel Cabrera has seen more 100 mph fast balls in one inning than Ted Williams and Babe Ruth saw in there entire career combined.

True.

But hitters also have a batters eye in center, more night games(or night games period) and clean balls coming at them, no spit, no scuffs, no dirt.

Still doesn't outweigh the worldwide talent though.

 

[broncosmitty]

Davis Ortiz is is 39 years old and very similar body type to Miguel Cabrera... He has 36 HR and over 100 RBI this year... and he never was the hitter Miguel Cabrera is.... I am pretty sure Miguel Cabrera will still be hitting a baseball well above average into his late 30's and early 40's... I think Miggy still has a good 3 years of playing first base left in him to be honest.

I wouldn't bitch if he played third, again.

 

[jdwills126]

Starting next spring, the Detroit Tigers will be paying Miggy an average of $30mil a year for the next eight seasons. At the expiration of that contract, Mr. Cabrera will be 41 years old (at least we hope that age is correct?

And yet if he was put up for trade at the deadline 4-5 teams would be offering multiple prospects.

Guys that hit 300 plus and can hit for power. I just don't think the tigers ever have the balls to trade him. He still has 3 good years left. Then it becomes more of a dice roll. I like his long term prospects better than Fielders.

 

[Iffster]

1961 vs 2015. No question. 1961 baseball was better. Fewer players, deeper talent. Players were men, not pampered children. I would imagine that baseball in Latin American countries today might still have some of the old school flavor of pre-free agent baseball.
So lets end this "debate" right now. 50-60s baseball was better than today's. And, I imagine, 30s baseball may have been better than that. Why? Because I said so....and I know I am right. The End.

(I'd love to see Jose Iglesias spear a ball in the hole with the glove used by Billy Rogell. LMAO)

 

[MiamiVice]

I wouldn't bitch if he played third, again.

to be honest... i wouldn't either.

 

[MiamiVice]

And yet if he was put up for trade at the deadline 4-5 teams would be offering multiple prospects.

Guys that hit 300 plus and can hit for power. I just don't think the tigers ever have the balls to trade him. He still has 3 good years left. Then it becomes more of a dice roll. I like his long term prospects better than Fielders.

3 good years? He is 32... Great hitters hit well into their late 30's.. the best hit into their mid 40's. Its not like Miggy is a swing and miss power hitter.. the guy hits .321 for his career and strikes out about the same amount of times as he walks.. which is unheard of. Miggy is slow as shit and still leads the league in on base percentage... without the benefit of legging out a single... ever. Think about this for a second... Miguel Cabrera leads the league in OBP... by over 40 points.. over Mike Trout who is supposed to have olympic speed.

 

[jdwills126]

Its not even a question. The level of play today is unquestionably higher than 100 years ago. Its not even up for debate. Miguel Cabrera hitting .350 is a much more impressive feat than Ted Williams hitting .350 back in the 1950's... Miguel Cabrera is going against a level of pitcher that Ted Williams NEVER saw.

Don't sell the old timers short. An upper 90s fastball is still an upper 90s fastball. Miggy would have been just as good in that time but I think Williams, Kaline, and Mantle would still be good today.

The only difference is pitchers back then pitched every 4th day and players today get on planes and stay in nice hotels. I have read about the trains and places teams stayed in back in the day. Not early as nice.

I will give in on the number of quality pitchers is better. Didn't have the Latin Americans, Asians, and minorities like play today. Improves the quality greatly. But then they didn't have human growth hormones.

 

[MiamiVice]

1961 vs 2015. No question. 1961 baseball was better. Fewer players, deeper talent. Players were men, not pampered children. I would imagine that baseball in Latin American countries today might still have some of the old school flavor of pre-free agent baseball.
So lets end this "debate" right now. 50-60s baseball was better than today's. And, I imagine, 30s baseball may have been better than that. Why? Because I said so....and I know I am right. The End.

(I'd love to see Jose Iglesias spear a ball in the hole with the glove used by Billy Rogell. LMAO)

LOL.. the average fastball from the 1930's was probably in the upper 70's... yeah.. I bet that was magical to watch.

 

[MiamiVice]

Don't sell the old timers short. An upper 90s fastball is still an upper 90s fastball. Miggy would have been just as good in that time but I think Williams, Kaline, and Mantle would still be good today.

The only difference is pitchers back then pitched every 4th day and players today get on planes and stay in nice hotels. I have read about the trains and places teams stayed in back in the day. Not early as nice.

I will give in on the number of quality pitchers is better. Didn't have the Latin Americans, Asians, and minorities like play today. Improves the quality greatly. But then they didn't have human growth hormones.

There were no upper 90's fastballs in the 1960's... NOBODY was throwing 96+ NOBODY.

 

[jdwills126]

3 good years? He is 32... Great hitters hit well into their late 30's.. the best hit into their mid 40's. Its not like Miggy is a swing and miss power hitter.. the guy hits .321 for his career and strikes out about the same amount of times as he walks.. which is unheard of. Miggy is slow as shit and still leads the league in on base percentage... without the benefit of legging out a single... ever. Think about this for a second... Miguel Cabrera leads the league in OBP... by over 40 points.. over Mike Trout who is supposed to have olympic speed.

It may be higher but I think 3 is a good over under for MVP type play. Big guys don't hold up as well. Unless they want to get him out of the field. Can he play till 41....most definitely and I bet he still is a plus hitter but not a 30 million dollar player.

 

[MiamiVice]

Luke Putkonen would have been a god back in the 1930's...

 

[jdwills126]

There were no upper 90's fastballs in the 1960's... NOBODY was throwing 96+ NOBODY.

Drysdale started in the 1950s was a pretty good pitcher.
Koufax started in 1955
Nolan Ryan started pitching in 1966.

I think we can find some guys that could reach 90.

 

[MiamiVice]

It may be higher but I think 3 is a good over under for MVP type play. Big guys don't hold up as well. Unless they want to get him out of the field. Can he play till 41....most definitely and I bet he still is a plus hitter but not a 30 million dollar player.

Big guys hold up just fine.. that statement has been proven wrong many times... Be it steroids and HGH or better training staff... but look at guys like Pujols (35 but many believe he is actually 38) and Ortiz... Bigger guys that are top level hitters hit for a very long time. There is not a doubt in my mind that Miggy can hit .300+ with 30+ hr and 100 rbi for at least the next 5 yrs.. and it shouldn't surprise anyone if he is still doing it all the way to the end of his contract.

 

[MiamiVice]

Drysdale started in the 1950s was a pretty good pitcher.
Koufax started in 1955
Nolan Ryan started pitching in 1966.

I think we can find some guys that could reach 90.

I didn't say 90... I said upper 90's... You can name 3 guys that MIGHT have.... There will be 3 guys in tonights game that do it in one game... think about that for a second.

 

[jdwills126]

Nolan Ryan could get it into the 100s in the 1970s

To think Lolich, McClain, Gibson, Seaver couldn't get it into the upper 90s is false and your direct quote was nobody and that is plain wrong.

Pujols is 35-38 not 41 and definitely not 30 million dollars worth or MVP level. Ortiz has had some down years as well. Hey I hope he plays MVP level tip he is 41 but even Dave Winfield couldn't and he is the gold standard for longevity as a star player. But thats my opinion.

 

[MiamiVice]

Dave Winfield isn't even in Miguel Cabrera's jock straps catagory... Miggy could out hit him when he is 80. Come on man..

 

[MiamiVice]

Nolan Ryan could get it into the 100s in the 1970s

To think Lolich, McClain, Gibson, Seaver couldn't get it into the upper 90s is false and your direct quote was nobody and that is plain wrong.

Pujols is 35-38 not 41 and definitely not 30 million dollars worth or MVP level. Ortiz has had some down years as well. Hey I hope he plays MVP level tip he is 41 but even Dave Winfield couldn't and he is the gold standard for longevity as a star player. But thats my opinion.

And once again... Nolan Ryan was 19 in 1966... He was not throwing high 90's until the mid 70's.... You can say what you want... but even IF there were guys that could throw upper 90's fastballs in the 60's.. there were only a handful... Its not even arguable... The average fastball is so much higher now than it was even 20 years ago... its not even comparable. Why anyone would even try to argue this is beyond me. Look it up.. The facts are there.