Game Thread: CFP SEMIFINAL: Clemson (13-0) vs Ohio State (13-0) 8pm ET ESPN

[michaeljordan_fan]

This thread has potential to reach Wisconsin/Arizona State levels from back in the day.

Yes, clearly OSU should be awarded 3/5 of a win.

 

[ClemsonTiger2369]

Sorry can’t hold back anymore. Clemson engineer here. This needs to be addressed because nobody seems to understand or talk about this and it’s been driving me nuts for years. In any sport, you CANNOT assume that events after a “ball call”, any play, any decision etc. would have played out EXACTLY as the actual game did if the call, play, decision, whatever had gone differently.

For example, the events of a sporting contest plays out as follows: ABCDEFGH
For whatever reason, fans seem to think if event “C” had gone the other way, the rest of the game would play out exactly as follows: ABXDEFGH
Do people not realize the rest of the game could have played out: ABXWPKQN?

It kills me how people say “if they hadn’t made that call in the 2nd quarter then the final score would have been...whatever”. That’s laughable. You have NO IDEA how the rest of the game would have gone in that “alternate universe” and we never will. In case you didn’t know, defense coverages, offensive play-calling, and decisions are based on the score and game situations at that time. A pitcher might not have thrown that same pitch had the runner been called out (or safe)

Maybe if that targeting call hadn’t been made, Clemson punts and Ohio State muffs it and Clemson still scores anyway. Maybe if they don’t make that targeting call, Clemson gets more jacked up and angry and they end up beating OSU worse. Maybe if the Clemson safety doesn’t drop that pick-6 early in the game, that would have changed momentum and OSU never dominates the first half and Clemson is leading at half time. Maybe if the other interception the Clemson corner had in his breadbasket had been made, Clemson wins with an even wider margin of victory. We don’t know, but it’s possible. Perhaps Ohio State would have won if both calls went their way.

But if I’m an OSU fan I’m more upset at:
- 3 FGs instead of TDs
- Wide open Dobbins not making the catch
- Not going for 2 at the end (although it didn't matter)
- Roughing punter (uh really?)
- Not going for it on 4th and 4 to put the game away on offense (you DO think Lawrence can drive 60 yards but you DO NOT think he can drive 90 yards in 3 mins? Really? He did it in 4 plays against #1 defense in the country)

So to hang this 100% on the refs as if OSU did everything they could and just got robbed is disingenuously extreme.

What I know is those were 2 fantastic teams putting on a great show. Both teams took advantage of opportunities and both teams certainly blew opportunities. Each team had the ball in their hands to go make the game-winning drive. Clemson did. OSU did not.

I do love my tigers but I’m not too naive to know that LSU just might have the best team in the country this year and Clemson must bring their A+ game to beat them. If they don’t, I can’t imagine Clemson won’t be favored to win it next year. The future is so bright. Go Tigers!

 

[handicappers]

lol

alts are funny

 

[cwerph]

 

[PIBuckeye]

Veteran NFL referee says overturned fumble was wrong call while the SEC crew defends itself

 

[cwerph]

Sorry can’t hold back anymore. Clemson engineer here. This needs to be addressed because nobody seems to understand or talk about this and it’s been driving me nuts for years. In any sport, you CANNOT assume that events after a “ball call”, any play, any decision etc. would have played out EXACTLY as the actual game did if the call, play, decision, whatever had gone differently.

For example, the events of a sporting contest plays out as follows: ABCDEFGH
For whatever reason, fans seem to think if event “C” had gone the other way, the rest of the game would play out exactly as follows: ABXDEFGH
Do people not realize the rest of the game could have played out: ABXWPKQN?

It kills me how people say “if they hadn’t made that call in the 2nd quarter then the final score would have been...whatever”. That’s laughable. You have NO IDEA how the rest of the game would have gone in that “alternate universe” and we never will. In case you didn’t know, defense coverages, offensive play-calling, and decisions are based on the score and game situations at that time. A pitcher might not have thrown that same pitch had the runner been called out (or safe)

Maybe if that targeting call hadn’t been made, Clemson punts and Ohio State muffs it and Clemson still scores anyway. Maybe if they don’t make that targeting call, Clemson gets more jacked up and angry and they end up beating OSU worse. Maybe if the Clemson safety doesn’t drop that pick-6 early in the game, that would have changed momentum and OSU never dominates the first half and Clemson is leading at half time. Maybe if the other interception the Clemson corner had in his breadbasket had been made, Clemson wins with an even wider margin of victory. We don’t know, but it’s possible. Perhaps Ohio State would have won if both calls went their way.

But if I’m an OSU fan I’m more upset at:
- 3 FGs instead of TDs
- Wide open Dobbins not making the catch
- Not going for 2 at the end (although it didn't matter)
- Roughing punter (uh really?)
- Not going for it on 4th and 4 to put the game away on offense (you DO think Lawrence can drive 60 yards but you DO NOT think he can drive 90 yards in 3 mins? Really? He did it in 4 plays against #1 defense in the country)

So to hang this 100% on the refs as if OSU did everything they could and just got robbed is disingenuously extreme.

What I know is those were 2 fantastic teams putting on a great show. Both teams took advantage of opportunities and both teams certainly blew opportunities. Each team had the ball in their hands to go make the game-winning drive. Clemson did. OSU did not.

I do love my tigers but I’m not too naive to know that LSU just might have the best team in the country this year and Clemson must bring their A+ game to beat them. If they don’t, I can’t imagine Clemson won’t be favored to win it next year. The future is so bright. Go Tigers!

There was only one called penalty on this play, and it wasn't the one where Chase Young's helmet is being removed. There wasn't even a flag on this play, just a penalty.

 

[WizardHawk]

That was a lot of unnecessary words to say the same thing many of us have over the years. Going back to any prior play and changing any one thing also charges every future decision. It's kind of a no shit thing that's pretty obvious and doesn't require 5000 words to explain.

 

[Edisto_Tiger]

That was a lot of unnecessary words to say the same thing many of us have over the years. Going back to any prior play and changing any one thing also charges every future decision. It's kind of a no shit thing that's pretty obvious and doesn't require 5000 words to explain.

Come on now, go easy on the new guy. Hell, I thought it was a great first post compared to the “hello, I’m new here” threads.

 

[cwalke3408]

There was only one called penalty on this play, and it wasn't the one where Chase Young's helmet is being removed. There wasn't even a flag on this play, just a penalty.

Poor Buckeyes, these guys haven’t had sleep in 3 days

 

[dtgold88]

I GUARANTEE that if this play happened in the end zone as the clock fell to triple zeroes, NO ONE would accept it as a TD to lose the game. NO ONE.

On top of that, how it was called by the replay officials is exactly how it’s being called for the last decade or so.

How could they not? do you think we'd think the rule of 1 foot down would have been changed for a completion? How many steps would you think he needed to take?

 

[dtgold88]

Day: Replay calls against OSU 'hard to swallow'
Day spoke about those calls in the wake of the loss. At least as much as he can without getting in trouble. Olave admitted it was his fault on the last play. He was supposed to break a post and thought the play turned to a scramble and broke away.

No matter what you think about those calls there isn't anyone that wouldn't find swallowing that loss very difficult if it was their team with all that was on the line.

The program is in solid shape and every reason to believe OSU bounces back and is again a solid team next year with lofty goals.

No doubt about that. That's what makes it easier to swallow. We can be back next season. will suck until after the season ends, then it's on to next year.

 

[Diego Roll Tide]

Veteran NFL referee says overturned fumble was wrong call while the SEC crew defends itself

If you want logic, don’t turn to SEC officials. They have the combined IQ of a cantaloupe.

 

[dtgold88]

Sorry can’t hold back anymore. Clemson engineer here. This needs to be addressed because nobody seems to understand or talk about this and it’s been driving me nuts for years. In any sport, you CANNOT assume that events after a “ball call”, any play, any decision etc. would have played out EXACTLY as the actual game did if the call, play, decision, whatever had gone differently.

For example, the events of a sporting contest plays out as follows: ABCDEFGH
For whatever reason, fans seem to think if event “C” had gone the other way, the rest of the game would play out exactly as follows: ABXDEFGH
Do people not realize the rest of the game could have played out: ABXWPKQN?

It kills me how people say “if they hadn’t made that call in the 2nd quarter then the final score would have been...whatever”. That’s laughable. You have NO IDEA how the rest of the game would have gone in that “alternate universe” and we never will. In case you didn’t know, defense coverages, offensive play-calling, and decisions are based on the score and game situations at that time. A pitcher might not have thrown that same pitch had the runner been called out (or safe)

Maybe if that targeting call hadn’t been made, Clemson punts and Ohio State muffs it and Clemson still scores anyway. Maybe if they don’t make that targeting call, Clemson gets more jacked up and angry and they end up beating OSU worse. Maybe if the Clemson safety doesn’t drop that pick-6 early in the game, that would have changed momentum and OSU never dominates the first half and Clemson is leading at half time. Maybe if the other interception the Clemson corner had in his breadbasket had been made, Clemson wins with an even wider margin of victory. We don’t know, but it’s possible. Perhaps Ohio State would have won if both calls went their way.

But if I’m an OSU fan I’m more upset at:
- 3 FGs instead of TDs
- Wide open Dobbins not making the catch
- Not going for 2 at the end (although it didn't matter)
- Roughing punter (uh really?)
- Not going for it on 4th and 4 to put the game away on offense (you DO think Lawrence can drive 60 yards but you DO NOT think he can drive 90 yards in 3 mins? Really? He did it in 4 plays against #1 defense in the country)

So to hang this 100% on the refs as if OSU did everything they could and just got robbed is disingenuously extreme.

What I know is those were 2 fantastic teams putting on a great show. Both teams took advantage of opportunities and both teams certainly blew opportunities. Each team had the ball in their hands to go make the game-winning drive. Clemson did. OSU did not.

I do love my tigers but I’m not too naive to know that LSU just might have the best team in the country this year and Clemson must bring their A+ game to beat them. If they don’t, I can’t imagine Clemson won’t be favored to win it next year. The future is so bright. Go Tigers![/QUOTE
I'll answer in order. Agree, and anyone who saw Back to the Future with Doc Brown and Space Time continuum knows this. Get either call right and who knows how rest of game unfolds?

As for your 5-6 other issues for OSU I agree with most. In fact, Dobbins dropped 2 balls that were likely TDs. The one in EZ, and the screen with a convoy blocking.

I get not going for 2 (and as you mentioned, didn't matter). Essentially a 4th and goal from 3 and no reason to believe they'd have made it based on other plays in that area. Those who are really ripping OSU for that (not you) assume they make it. suppose they don't? Then if OSu does score at end game goes to OT. would have been risky, but agree maybe go for it on 4th and 4.

No disrespect to Clemson, as they did what they needed to do when gifted opportunities and on their last drive, but OSu has no one to blame but themselves.

And, yeah, with both QBs back next year a rematch wouldn't be a surprise.

Good luck!!

 

[dtgold88]

That was a lot of unnecessary words to say the same thing many of us have over the years. Going back to any prior play and changing any one thing also charges every future decision. It's kind of a no shit thing that's pretty obvious and doesn't require 5000 words to explain.

Maybe, but wasn't it his first comment? Doubt he read all the comments.

Better a Clemson fan stick up for his team than a fan of an alsoran with no dog in the fight, right (not you)?

 

[Bayou Tiger]

Come on now, go easy on the new guy. Hell, I thought it was a great first post compared to the “hello, I’m new here” threads.

I didn't know you were an engineer....

 

[Stakesarehigh]

If you want logic, don’t turn to SEC officials. They have the combined IQ of a cantaloupe.

It's basically 50/50 on who you ask on if it was a fumble I'm perplexed how that is then indisputable evidence it was incomplete

 

[Across The Field]

It's basically 50/50 on who you ask on if it was a fumble I'm perplexed how that is then indisputable evidence it was incomplete

There definitely wasn't. Had they called it incomplete on the field, I would've been pissed about it but it wouldn't have been the worst call I've ever seen. The fact that they called it complete on the field, we scored, and then they took points off the board from us is what makes is so horrible.

 

[Across The Field]

Here comes mjfan with more irrelevant drivel. Right on time.

 

[WizardHawk]

Maybe, but wasn't it his first comment? Doubt he read all the comments.

Better a Clemson fan stick up for his team than a fan of an alsoran with no dog in the fight, right (not you)?

Sure, but who creates a first post on a new site blowing up in frustration over things they are tired of to total strangers?

I was just pointing out he could have said the same thing in about 300 less words and maybe a hello added in a first post. Sheesh.

 

[Across The Field]

Sure, but who creates a first post on a new site blowing up in frustration over things they are tired of to total strangers?

I was just pointing out he could have said the same thing in about 300 less words and maybe a hello added in a first post. Sheesh.

He definitely came in a little hot.