Bill Russell is the GOAT

[HammerDown]

Hammer Down is letting his envy foul up his mental processes.

If I weren't a Boston resident and son of a New Englander I might be envious too!

Funny, that's the same thing the Patriots fans keep saying.

But what is it I'm envious of?

"The rings."

Dickey Simpkins > Bill Russell

 

[Am I Blue Through it All?]

ESPN BOSTON Hall of Fame - Bill Russell

May be hyping their own man, but I agree with ever word. And bear in mind, I was a Wilt supporter and hated the Celtics.

 

[Am I Blue Through it All?]

Funny, that's the same thing the Patriots fans keep saying.

But what is it I'm envious of?

"The rings."

Dickey Simpkins > Bill Russell

Just curious. How many of Russell's games do you suppose you watched live?

 

[rmilia1]

I disagree that he was the best or better than Jordan. In fact, while very dominant, it'd be hard for me to say Wilt was better than Hakeem, Shaq or Kareem. Jordan, Magic and Bird were the most fundamentally sound to ever play the game. I don't see how that can be debated.

Ehhhhhh, I dont know HD. MJ was incredibly sound on D, his offense was FARRR from funadmentally sound. The man palmed/traveled with the ball 75% of his possessions he touched it. Granted the refs never called it because he was MJ but doesnt mean it didnt happen. It BLOWS MY MIND that the guy who is probably one of only 3 players to have a legit argument as GOAT has been brought up like 2 times on this entire thread. MJ, Magic and Big O are without a doubt the 3 greatest players in NBA history when it comes to all phases of the game. Id put Magic 3rd because his D lacks when compared with the other 2 but it really is semantics when debating MJ and Big O. I lean towards Robertson because his ENTIRE game was much more complete but he also only won 1 ring but if someone can tell me Peyton Manning is the greatest QB of all time with his one ring then I can say Oscar is the greatest of all time with his 1 too

 

[_Xer0_]

Wilt was arguably a better passer than Russell as well as being a VASTLY superior scorer, defender/rim protector, rebounder.

 

[Am I Blue Through it All?]

Ehhhhhh, I dont know HD. MJ was incredibly sound on D, his offense was FARRR from funadmentally sound. The man palmed/traveled with the ball 75% of his possessions he touched it. Granted the refs never called it because he was MJ but doesnt mean it didnt happen. It BLOWS MY MIND that the guy who is probably one of only 3 players to have a legit argument as GOAT has been brought up like 2 times on this entire thread. MJ, Magic and Big O are without a doubt the 3 greatest players in NBA history when it comes to all phases of the game. Id put Magic 3rd because his D lacks when compared with the other 2 but it really is semantics when debating MJ and Big O. I lean towards Robertson because his ENTIRE game was much more complete but he also only won 1 ring but if someone can tell me Peyton Manning is the greatest QB of all time with his one ring then I can say Oscar is the greatest of all time with his 1 too

I still have Oscar as number one. Peyton as well. ~laffin~ One ring wonders, eh?

 

[_Xer0_]

I disagree that he was the best or better than Jordan. In fact, while very dominant, it'd be hard for me to say Wilt was better than Hakeem, Shaq or Kareem. Jordan, Magic and Bird were the most fundamentally sound to ever play the game. I don't see how that can be debated.

Wilt would have killed Shaq and Hakeem.

Now Kareem on the other hand, both him and Wilt in their absolute primes would have been probably the best 1 on 1 matchup in NBA History.

 

[HammerDown]

Just curious. How many of Russell's games do you suppose you watched live?

So you're answering questions with questions? Nice dodge. Totally irrelevant, but nice try anyway.

 

[Brahmsian]

Wilt was arguably a better passer than Russell as well as being a VASTLY superior scorer, defender/rim protector, rebounder.

Passer, maybe, I'd want to look at some assist numbers before saying more, but that's as much as I'll grant you.

 

[Am I Blue Through it All?]

Wilt was arguably a better passer than Russell as well as being a VASTLY superior scorer, defender/rim protector, rebounder.

Wilt had several advantages. Some clown did an "electronic eye" or some such measurement of Wilt and determined he was really 7'3" and I tend to believe it, Just as I believed Jabbar was closer to 7'6". Wilt was also reputed to be the strongest man ever to play in the NBA. They listed him at 275 lbs. but it was reported than he was really 325 lbs. One of those naturally unnaturally strong men whom everyone feared.

 

[HammerDown]

Wilt would have killed Shaq and Hakeem.

Now Kareem on the other hand, both him and Wilt in their absolute primes would have been probably the best 1 on 1 matchup in NBA History.

So he would have killed Shaq and Hakeem but matched up well with Kareem? That doesn't make sense to me. No one who ever played the game would kill Hakeem or Shaq.

On the other hand, Bill Russell would have been humiliated and dominated by dozens of players over the years. I like what someone said (can't remember who) that Russell was a glorified Ben Wallace. Bill Russell is Otis Thorpe with a bunch of rings.

 

[HammerDown]

Wilt had several advantages. Some clown did an "electronic eye" or some such measurement of Wilt and determined he was really 7'3" and I tend to believe it, Just as I believed Jabbar was closer to 7'6". Wilt was also reputed to be the strongest man ever to play in the NBA. They listed him at 275 lbs. but it was reported than he was really 325 lbs. One of those naturally unnaturally strong men whom everyone feared.

Wilt was a little over 7'-1" without shoes and Kareem was a little over 7'-3".

Wilt was lean his entire career so I don't see how in the world you can say he weighed more than Shaq. Not even close.

 

[Am I Blue Through it All?]

So you're answering questions with questions? Nice dodge. Totally irrelevant, but nice try anyway.

May be your show bud, but your arguments are pure conjecture. Why are we even having this discussion? The Celtics were almost unbeatable during Russell's tenure. The other positions changed. He was the constant. Do the math.

 

[_Xer0_]

Wilt had several advantages. Some clown did an "electronic eye" or some such measurement of Wilt and determined he was really 7'3" and I tend to believe it, Just as I believed Jabbar was closer to 7'6". Wilt was also reputed to be the strongest man ever to play in the NBA. They listed him at 275 lbs. but it was reported than he was really 325 lbs. One of those naturally unnaturally strong men whom everyone feared.

Wilt said himself he was right around 300 lbs during most of his playing days.

 

[HammerDown]

Passer, maybe, I'd want to look at some assist numbers before saying more, but that's as much as I'll grant you.

So even though the numbers PROVE otherwise and Russell fully admits it, you're going to stick with that? Man, you are one stubborn dude.

 

[HammerDown]

Wilt said himself he was right around 300 lbs during most of his playing days.

He also said he slept with 20,000 different women.

 

[Am I Blue Through it All?]

Wilt was a little over 7'-1" without shoes and Kareem was a little over 7'-3".

Wilt was lean his entire career so I don't see how in the world you can say he weighed more than Shaq. Not even close.

I thought Shaq tipped it over 360 lbs.

 

[HammerDown]

May be your show bud, but your arguments are pure conjecture. Why are we even having this discussion? The Celtics were almost unbeatable during Russell's tenure. The other positions changed. He was the constant. Do the math.

But your arguments are fact?

Red was the constant. Russell wasn't even the best player on his team and says as much.

 

[Brahmsian]

Bill Russell wasn't even the most valuable player on his team and he even says that.

"The rings" is what the Russell fan chants because other than that, as a player he was very pedestrian and an offensive liability.

Russell was no egomaniac and saying good things about your teammates is generally considered part of being a good teammate yourself.

I doubt Wilt ever called any of his teammates more valuable than himself. He, as near as I can tell, WAS an egomaniac.

 

[HammerDown]

I thought Shaq tipped it over 360 lbs.

In his last season with Boston when he was so heavy he could barely stay on his feet he was 325.

No way Wilt went more than 260.