Big Brother

[calsnowskier]

I finally finished S23. Wow, what a shit show season. After S1, pretty clearly the worst REGULAR BB season ever. Both Celeb seasons and OTT were worse, of course, but OTT was just a dress rehearsal for Celeb and the Celeb seasons aren't REAL BB.

The first 10 weeks of S23 were completely worthless. The game was rigged (via casting, not through comp manipulation) and there weren’t any overly likable non-black players in the game (Travis and Christian were dripping in soy; Brent was a stereotypical guido; Frenchie was, well, Frenchie; Clair was the typical liberal woman - fighting for every cause imaginable; Britini was fun, but would get super annoying VERY quickly). I was seriously worried that one of the houseguests would have a soy allergy and would go into anaphylactic shock just by being in that house (Travis, Christian, Clair).

Despite the soy (or maybe BECAUSE of it, granted), the only people in that house that saw skin color were the blacks. The whites were too busy getting in touch with their feminine sides or trying to play 8 weeks of BB in the first 3 days.

I still can’t get over how Chen brutalized Michie for the convoluted interpretation of racism when he had to banish 4 players on day 1 and one was Hispanic and 2 were black, but nothing but admiration for a group who actually said they were picking off all the non-black people one by one.

Again, I have no problem with the cookout (well run, even if it did make the season difficult to watch). I only have a problem with the blinders people wear when critiquing this while ignoring that. This inconsistency is what drives a wedge between people. Rules for thee but not for me.

 

[calsnowskier]

OK…

Enough 23-bashing. Hopefully that was just the sacrificial season that had to be offered up to the race gods, and the game can get back to the game moving forward.

Given that, what twists would you recommend for seasons moving forward?

One that I have been thinking of for a while that could add a bit more volatility to the show is to award the surviving houseguest from the eviction-night block immunity in the next week. They kinda did this in the season where Dick left after receiving his positive HIV diagnosis. They awarded the block survivor immunity up to a certain week (week 6?). Dick immediately started using it to pull some of the noobs into the vet’s alliance. He pulled in Porsche in the first eviction (then he promptly left the game). But if they just allow 1 week of immunity, it will ensure different players hit the block each week. The HoH will not have an easy pawn each week.

What other tweaks or twists would be interesting?

 

[The Q]

OK…

Enough 23-bashing. Hopefully that was just the sacrificial season that had to be offered up to the race gods, and the game can get back to the game moving forward.

Given that, what twists would you recommend for seasons moving forward?

One that I have been thinking of for a while that could add a bit more volatility to the show is to award the surviving houseguest from the eviction-night block immunity in the next week. They kinda did this in the season where Dick left after receiving his positive HIV diagnosis. They awarded the block survivor immunity up to a certain week (week 6?). Dick immediately started using it to pull some of the noobs into the vet’s alliance. He pulled in Porsche in the first eviction (then he promptly left the game). But if they just allow 1 week of immunity, it will ensure different players hit the block each week. The HoH will not have an easy pawn each week.

What other tweaks or twists would be interesting?

Get rid of the no consecutive hoh rule.

It just punishes good players

 

[MilkSpiller22]

OK…

Enough 23-bashing. Hopefully that was just the sacrificial season that had to be offered up to the race gods, and the game can get back to the game moving forward.

Given that, what twists would you recommend for seasons moving forward?

One that I have been thinking of for a while that could add a bit more volatility to the show is to award the surviving houseguest from the eviction-night block immunity in the next week. They kinda did this in the season where Dick left after receiving his positive HIV diagnosis. They awarded the block survivor immunity up to a certain week (week 6?). Dick immediately started using it to pull some of the noobs into the vet’s alliance. He pulled in Porsche in the first eviction (then he promptly left the game). But if they just allow 1 week of immunity, it will ensure different players hit the block each week. The HoH will not have an easy pawn each week.

What other tweaks or twists would be interesting?

no big twist idea... but i would love to find a way to make the competitions more fair... i really think comp beasts are only bad casting... what is fun in watching the same people win everything, just because the level of competition sucks...

Best competition in last years BB was the one Aza won where there were two stages, one that gave the clear advantage to the athlete, because of speed, the other needed finesse...

maybe have more two part competitions...

 

[MilkSpiller22]

also maybe make back dooring someone more difficult...

not sure the best way to do this though...

 

[The Q]

also maybe make back dooring someone more difficult...

not sure the best way to do this though...

You can only be on the block a certain number of times?

Makes it harder to create pawns as well

 

[MilkSpiller22]

You can only be on the block a certain number of times?

Makes it harder to create pawns as well

that doesnt work though, if there is a certain amount, then that means that if you are put up one more time then you are out... that would be with no vote and no veto competition...

unless you say that someone cant even be put on the block after a certain number... which would give them safety until this affect is over... which is kind of bad too...

maybe a solution would be that the HOH puts up his 2 nominations, then there is always a third nomination that is picked somehow else... what ever "twist" the show wants to make... and every veto MUST be used on one of these contestants so there is always two contestants in question to be evicted... and all three nominees are ALWAYS competing in the veto competition...

this would take away the pawn aspect, as well because there is serious danger for any of the three to be sent home since anyone could be taken off... this also makes the Veto competition more important because they truly have power...

 

[The Q]

that doesnt work though, if there is a certain amount, then that means that if you are put up one more time then you are out... that would be with no vote and no veto competition...

unless you say that someone cant even be put on the block after a certain number... which would give them safety until this affect is over... which is kind of bad too...

maybe a solution would be that the HOH puts up his 2 nominations, then there is always a third nomination that is picked somehow else... what ever "twist" the show wants to make... and every veto MUST be used on one of these contestants so there is always two contestants in question to be evicted... and all three nominees are ALWAYS competing in the veto competition...

this would take away the pawn aspect, as well because there is serious danger for any of the three to be sent home since anyone could be taken off... this also makes the Veto competition more important because they truly have power...

It would definitely need to reset at certain points

 

[MilkSpiller22]

It would definitely need to reset at certain points

i kind of like my solution... i think it solves everything... and i am ok with an added randomness...

 

[calsnowskier]

that doesnt work though, if there is a certain amount, then that means that if you are put up one more time then you are out... that would be with no vote and no veto competition...

unless you say that someone cant even be put on the block after a certain number... which would give them safety until this affect is over... which is kind of bad too...

maybe a solution would be that the HOH puts up his 2 nominations, then there is always a third nomination that is picked somehow else... what ever "twist" the show wants to make... and every veto MUST be used on one of these contestants so there is always two contestants in question to be evicted... and all three nominees are ALWAYS competing in the veto competition...

this would take away the pawn aspect, as well because there is serious danger for any of the three to be sent home since anyone could be taken off... this also makes the Veto competition more important because they truly have power...

I like this one. Combining it with my idea (1-week immunity if you “win” your nom-week) could really shake up the show without changing the core of the show too much.

The immunity rule would have to stop at top 5 or so, though, of course…

 

[MilkSpiller22]

I like this one. Combining it with my idea (1-week immunity if you “win” your nom-week) could really shake up the show without changing the core of the show too much.

The immunity rule would have to stop at top 5 or so, though, of course…

not sure if i like immunity for the week... that is too strong... maybe if you combine our two ideas that the surviving contestant can not be put up as the third nominee would be enough... and fair... also reward them as a DEFINITE veto competition participant...

 

[calsnowskier]

not sure if i like immunity for the week... that is too strong... maybe if you combine our two ideas that the surviving contestant can not be put up as the third nominee would be enough... and fair... also reward them as a DEFINITE veto competition participant...

But the point of my idea (immunity) is to avoid the perma-pawn. Allowing the surviving nom to still be nom’d by the HOH completely defeats my endgame purpose of the twist.

And just giving them automatic participation in the next POV doesn’t do much either, as the perma-pawns are normally non-comp-contenders (the whole reason they are used as pawns in the first place)

I am ok with introducing my idea as a twist to see how it works before instituting it as a regular part of the game. The Golden POV was initially introduced as a twist before it became the norm. Initially, the POV could not be used to take yourself off the block (stupid rule, imho). It was the end of S3 (the first season with the POV) where they added a twist of the “Golden” POV, then in S4 they added it as the norm and it has been that way ever since.

 

[The Q]

But the point of my idea (immunity) is to avoid the perma-pawn. Allowing the surviving nom to still be nom’d by the HOH completely defeats my endgame purpose of the twist.

And just giving them automatic participation in the next POV doesn’t do much either, as the perma-pawns are normally non-comp-contenders (the whole reason they are used as pawns in the first place)

I am ok with introducing my idea as a twist to see how it works before instituting it as a regular part of the game. The Golden POV was initially introduced as a twist before it became the norm. Initially, the POV could not be used to take yourself off the block (stupid rule, imho). It was the end of S3 (the first season with the POV) where they added a twist of the “Golden” POV, then in S4 they added it as the norm and it has been that way ever since.

Yeah the perma pawn was a key reason for my idea as well.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

But the point of my idea (immunity) is to avoid the perma-pawn. Allowing the surviving nom to still be nom’d by the HOH completely defeats my endgame purpose of the twist.

And just giving them automatic participation in the next POV doesn’t do much either, as the perma-pawns are normally non-comp-contenders (the whole reason they are used as pawns in the first place)

not really, because with our two ideas combined the HOH cant afford pawns, because what if their top choice is taken off?? then the 2 left would be the pawn and the extra nominee... you cant add a new target...


my solution without combining our 2, prevents the perma pawn... to be more clear, by taking away the back door, you kind of take away the perma pawn...

the combination of ours protects the survivor...

 

[calsnowskier]

Giving the immunity might result in some interesting pawn selections as well. Players are typically pretty good at finding great strategic uses of new rules, and this would add enough of a new flavor to create some interesting new uses.

 

[calsnowskier]

not really, because with our two ideas combined the HOH cant afford pawns, because what if their top choice is taken off?? then the 2 left would be the pawn and the extra nominee... you cant add a new target...


my solution without combining our 2, prevents the perma pawn... to be more clear, by taking away the back door, you kind of take away the perma pawn...

the combination of ours protects the survivor...

Ok…. Interesting.

I don’t really like taking power away from the HOH, though. The HOH comes at a pretty high price (showing your cards) and I don’t like to take away their payoff.

Depending on how the 3rd nom is selected, I think it gets into the territory of making HoH more of a punishment than a reward.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Ok…. Interesting.

I don’t really like taking power away from the HOH, though. The HOH comes at a pretty high price (showing your cards) and I don’t like to take away their payoff.

Depending on how the 3rd nom is selected, I think it gets into the territory of making HoH more of a punishment than a reward.

sure, the HOH would be less powerful in my twist, than in previous seasons...

but i do think it is the best way to prevent the back door and even prevent the perma pawn... and it also makes the game more fair for everyone IMO...


Maybe the HOH could secretly protect up to 2 other house guests who can not be the third nomination(however they want to do the third nomination)... or when the third nomination is chosen by whoever or whatever chooses them, there are three options where the HOH can pick 1 of the three...

but however it is done, i like that it makes the veto competition more important, and it allows everyone who needs to participate earn their rights to survive...

nothing worse than a back door when the target wasnt even given the opportunity to save themselves...

 

[calsnowskier]

sure, the HOH would be less powerful in my twist, than in previous seasons...

but i do think it is the best way to prevent the back door and even prevent the perma pawn... and it also makes the game more fair for everyone IMO...


Maybe the HOH could secretly protect up to 2 other house guests who can not be the third nomination(however they want to do the third nomination)... or when the third nomination is chosen by whoever or whatever chooses them, there are three options where the HOH can pick 1 of the three...

but however it is done, i like that it makes the veto competition more important, and it allows everyone who needs to participate earn their rights to survive...

nothing worse than a back door when the target wasnt even given the opportunity to save themselves...

Removing the backdoor option, however, removes the incentive for the other players to play in the POV comp. As it is now, without either of our changes, most want to at least play to give themselves back door armor.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Removing the backdoor option, however, removes the incentive for the other players to play in the POV comp. As it is now, without either of our changes, most want to at least play to give themselves back door armor.

there is already a lack of interest for many to play... they have nothing to gain when they think they are good with the HOH... so i dont see much of a difference... but you are right, that there is definitely less of a need for others to play the veto...

maybe this is why all the twists have been BS twists, because it is much harder to think them up than i first thought...


maybe reward the veto winner with more than just a veto...

how about this...

take my original idea that there is a third nominee decided by whatever method, and the veto has to be used on one of the three nominees every week... and there is no replacement nominees...

and then for the veto competition the "twist" would be that the winner of the veto competition can not be a third nomination for next week... that will make everyone CARE about the veto competition... and have less players tank... and this rule is in effect until top 4( where it is basically 3 nominees anyway)...

 

[calsnowskier]

Removing the back door also removes a lot of the drama during the week. Once your 3rd nom is named, everyone else in the house is automatically safe for the week. As it is now, once noms are made, there is still a lot of strategic game play trying to gauge their risk as a replacement and how winning veto could help or hurt their game.