A.L. Central Discussion 2016

[SlinkyRedfoot]

It's certainly possible for the Indians to cough up the lead, and that being the case, there is no guarantee that they'd cough it up to the Tigers.

With KC on fire (won 13 of last 15 games) and being just one game back of Detroit, who are decidedly not on fire (won 5 of last 15), I could easily see the Royals overtaking the Tigers.

Hell, the Tigers are closer to the White Sox in the standings than they are the Indians.

 

[dougplayer]

Still. Not a patty cake the suckeryes will plsy

 

[WiggyRuss]

It's certainly possible for the Indians to cough up the lead, and that being the case, there is no guarantee that they'd cough it up to the Tigers.

With KC on fire (won 13 of last 15 games) and being just one game back of Detroit, who are decidedly not on fire (won 5 of last 15), I could easily see the Royals overtaking the Tigers.

Hell, the Tigers are closer to the White Sox in the standings than they are the Indians.

Tigers just arent that good.

they spent a ton of money on Upton and Zimmerman and both guys have seriously disappointed.

Indians just simply have more talent, better chemistry and a better manager.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

Tigers just arent that good.

they spent a ton of money on Upton and Zimmerman and both guys have seriously disappointed.

Indians just simply have more talent, better chemistry and a better manager.

You always have to keep on eye on Detroit just because you know Upton is a capable hitter when he's on point, along with arms like Fulmer, Norris, and Boyd; but at the same time they definitely struggle defensively at several positions and their pitching is a perpetual question mark.

Definitely a mediocre team that can oscillate up and down the standings depending on if everything is working in the same direction or not.

 

[Iffster]

Tigers just arent that good.

they spent a ton of money on Upton and Zimmerman and both guys have seriously disappointed.

Indians just simply have more talent, better chemistry and a better manager.

I don't know about more talent...Tigers do have a lot of talented players. But they payed heavily to get them, and some are starting to decline. What has hurt, this year, is the poor (unlucky?) additions of Upton, Lowe, Pelfrey, and now Zimmermann.
Mr. Illitch gets a lot of praise for spending mega-$ to build a team. Sadly, just as fans now realize that Dombrowski and Illitch drained the minor league system....Detroit will be the AL version of the Phillies in the coming years, due to the abundance of "super-Contracts".

 

[navamind]

You always have to keep on eye on Detroit just because you know Upton is a capable hitter when he's on point, along with arms like Fulmer, Norris, and Boyd; but at the same time they definitely struggle defensively at several positions and their pitching is a perpetual question mark.

Definitely a mediocre team that can oscillate up and down the standings depending on if everything is working in the same direction or not.

Agreed. That rotation could be pretty solid again in the near future. I do expect Fulmer to take a step back, but he's still pretty good. Miggy/Kinsler/J.D. Martinez is still a nice core to have, and Castellanos is starting to look like a legit Major Leaguer. I'd expect Upton to hit better than this, but there are some red flags with him (his K% was pretty high after leaving Arizona, now it's at a career high of 29.9%; walk rate is also a career low of 6.5%). It's great to see V-Mart hitting again, but it's not something I'd bet on going forward given his age.

The Tigers bench has certainly been underwhelming.

 

[WiggyRuss]

You always have to keep on eye on Detroit just because you know Upton is a capable hitter when he's on point, along with arms like Fulmer, Norris, and Boyd; but at the same time they definitely struggle defensively at several positions and their pitching is a perpetual question mark.

Definitely a mediocre team that can oscillate up and down the standings depending on if everything is working in the same direction or not.

Tigers have some upside if everything is hitting on all cylinders- but its beginning to be a team of either old guys, overpaid guys, with a little bit of young talent sprinkled in. Fullmer and Boyd and Norris look to be members of the rotation for awhile- Fullmer more towards the front - the other 2 more towards the middle-back.

Castellanos and Iglesias have some talent- but both are hurt and have been inconsistent. Castellanos was ripping it up for a while after kind of disappointing in previous major league stints. Bruce Rondon has never really gotten it together for such a talented arm.

Victor, Kinsler, Miggy are all getting up there. KRod has had a nice year but hes a stop gap.

 

[WiggyRuss]

I don't know about more talent...Tigers do have a lot of talented players. But they payed heavily to get them, and some are starting to decline. What has hurt, this year, is the poor (unlucky?) additions of Upton, Lowe, Pelfrey, and now Zimmermann.
Mr. Illitch gets a lot of praise for spending mega-$ to build a team. Sadly, just as fans now realize that Dombrowski and Illitch drained the minor league system....Detroit will be the AL version of the Phillies in the coming years, due to the abundance of "super-Contracts".

Indians just dont have the budget that the Tigers do- but the Tribe has a ton of cheap/controllable talent.

Salazar, Carrasco, Kluber, Bauer, Tomlin are all signed long term and none of these guys has a big time contract. All would have substantial trade value with how cheap they are as compared to their production.

Lindor is cheap and isnt eligible for free agency forever, same with Ramirez...Kipnis is signed forever at a very respectable level.

Santana and Napoli as FA's is definitely an issue as thats a LOT of power- but hopefully they resign at least 1 and Brantley picks up some slack.

Miller is signed for 2 more years...Allen is around for a long time for cheap....their minor leagues has a solid amount of reinforcements even post Miller deal.

 

[navamind]

trading away prospects hasn't been the problem for the Tigers, it's poor drafting.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

What gives me an inkling of hope for the Royals is Gordon and Cain refinding their offense as of late along with Ventura momentarily removing his head from his anus. If they can keep this up for a bit longer and knock the Tigers down a peg H2H, there's an outside shot of getting Duffy in a WC game which the Royals would have a fighting chance in given their roster composition.

 

[Iffster]

Not saying Tribe does not have talent, they do. Some young and controllable.

Tigers have the marque names....perhaps not much better, and soon to be in decline?

Simple problem...your team is developing young talent....Detroit has had to trade for it = Fulmer, Norris, Boyd. Now the well is dry. For shit's sake...Steven Moya was last years #1 prospect. He was passed over for Alex fuckin' Presley!!!! I think this years #1 got hurt...and he wasn't even listed on anyone's Top 100!

 

[Iffster]

trading away prospects hasn't been the problem for the Tigers, it's poor drafting.

Agreed....and I'll give credit to Dombrowski for over-selling a few Tiger "Prospects".

 

[Fountain City Blues]

trading away prospects hasn't been the problem for the Tigers, it's poor drafting.

Posted a chart earlier on WAR from the last 10 years of drafts somewhere, but yeah, Detroit has come way ahead of what their draft WAR suggests they should be as I recall by virtue of trading prospects while they were still hot commodities.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Tigers just arent that good.

they spent a ton of money on Upton and Zimmerman and both guys have seriously disappointed.

Indians just simply have more talent, better chemistry and a better manager.

You're forgetting the single most important thing that the Indians have much more of than the Tigers

Spoiler

 

[Iffster]

I envy teams like the Indians who can watch young players develop in their system and break into the majors.

Detroit has two starting position players they drafted. McCann, a weak hitting defensive catcher...and Nick Castellanos. A poor fielding 3B who is getting a lot of praise for a "great" offense this season. However...if you look closer, No Range Nick actually lived off his super .365 BA month of April. In the following months he hit, 284, 273, and 260. Even a .100 in a brief August. So, what does Detroit expect from their 3B going into 2017?

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

I do expect Fulmer to take a step back, but he's still pretty good

I'm curious to see what they do with him. Right now he's increased IP from 2015 by 13%, and ever six inning start from here out is another 5%.

 

[Iffster]

You're forgetting the single most important thing that the Indians have much more of than the Tigers

Spoiler

An aortic artery ???????

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

I envy teams like the Indians who can watch young players develop in their system and break into the majors.

The grass is always greener, man.

I envy teams that can sign non-reclamation project free agents.

 

[WiggyRuss]

The grass is always greener, man.

I envy teams that can sign non-reclamation project free agents.

i couldnt imagine if the Indians had like 150M to spend on free agents in an offseason.....

 

[Fountain City Blues]

Something else to note here. There are still trades that could theoretically be made. If the Tigers and/or Royals got hot during the next week, the likelihood of them making a move should go up quite a bit. Hellickson comes to mind.