2015 Pirates

[thedddd]

Rangers Hire Jeff Banister As Manager ? MLB Trade Rumors

With Banister gone, shame to see him go after 29 years, but this might end up being a blessing in disguise. Hopefully the next bench coach will help Hurdle with his questionable coaching decisions.

 

[thecrow124]

keep pedro at 1B. let him platoon with tony snachez until bell is ready.
get rid of ike and gaby. they have some benefit, but no real ceiling. pedro still has a high ceiling of potential.
his fielding is great. 1 error at 3B with many great plays. 24 errors throwing. most 1B throw like crap, ave no range or both.
with a clearer head at 1B who knows what he can accomplish as a FT 1B or at least a platoon with a cheap RH mate like tony sanchez. also gets us a thrd catcher for more roster flexibility.

losing taillon for a year and cole not establishing himself as an ace has our SP a little muddied.
i think we can re-sign volquez and liriano to reasonable base contracts with incentive bonuses so both team and player share the risk and reward. they both seem to like each other, like pitt and are appreciative of the revival they were afforded, and we are a young winning team.
cole, worley, volquez, liriano, #5 (pimentel, locke, cumpton, sadler) then taillon, kingham, sampson, morton at midseason.
our BP shouldn't cost us so many games in the beginning of the year as we should have a solid group of melancon, watson, holdzom, hughes, wilson, lafombee, gomez, and whatever 5th starters don't make it.

martin, since our team is young and minimal cost over the next few years, if our high end prospects pan out, we can afford to go 3 years and 45-55 M. ideally if games played goals are reached. but he is in good physical shape and doesn't loaf. just gets nicked up being a catcher. he wasn't a catcher growing up, so has less cumulative wear and tear.

Polanco or snider continuing growth would solidify an awesome OF (marte continues health and production as the #5 hitter, not leadoff)
harrison and mercer are the key to me.
if they can continue moving forward offensively and provide sound competent defense, they are the wildcards.

the rest of the offense shouldn't fall off to much.

Not sure how I have been missing this post, but I have. If we are going to discuss first base options to keep, I would keep Ike Davis over Pedro, he is superior defensively and by most metrics offensively. However, I would personally just me all 3 go and turn first base over to Lambo. If he can't cut it there, give Snider a shot at it. Either one would be athletic enough to play the position and my personal opinion is that they would both hit better than any of the three. I do not see this happening, but it is what I would do. That move alone would save us $15-20 million on next years salary and would ensure us of being able to hi with anyone for Martin. We would also be almost assured of being able to sign a second tier starter like Liriano.

 

[sychmd]

thanks crow, forgot about lambo at 1B.
i agree, giving him another chance after he seemed to act like he belonged this year after the call up.
would love to see him earn it out of ST. would solve a lot and allow us to trade ike and pedro for some potentials down the line.

 

[Burghfan]

I don't know about anyone else but losing the wildcard game to San Francisco doesn't quite sting as bad anymore. Especially watching what Bumgardner did the rest of the playoffs. Wow!

 

[sychmd]

I don't know about anyone else but losing the wildcard game to San Francisco doesn't quite sting as bad anymore. Especially watching what Bumgardner did the rest of the playoffs. Wow!

was hoping for this outcome after our loss.
feel that we were on par with the rest right after SF.

it shows how important an ace really is.
we cannot compete past just getting in until we have an ace.

burnett wasn't it in 2013, cole was close to it in 2013, as was liriano, but cole and liriano weren't it in 14.

can liriano or cole be that person in 2015, or taillon.
that is why i have said 2106 would be our year.
in the post season, to really have a chance to go all the way, you have to have sheer magic like the royals plus price (along with nice depth and BP they had) or 1 ace and helpful to have a strong #2, with some really clutch hitters.
Tigers, Cards, Nats, Tiger aces all weren't enough.

 

[Burghfan]

was hoping for this outcome after our loss.
feel that we were on par with the rest right after SF.

it shows how important an ace really is.
we cannot compete past just getting in until we have an ace.

burnett wasn't it in 2013, cole was close to it in 2013, as was liriano, but cole and liriano weren't it in 14.

can liriano or cole be that person in 2015, or taillon.
that is why i have said 2106 would be our year.
in the post season, to really have a chance to go all the way, you have to have sheer magic like the royals plus price (along with nice depth and BP they had) or 1 ace and helpful to have a strong #2, with some really clutch hitters.
Tigers, Cards, Nats, Tiger aces all weren't enough.

Without an "ace" we really need to win the division, because we have more of a chance getting past the other team. Although last year we couldn't cut it against St. Louis, but there is something about them that the Pirates can't beat. I thought we had a decent shot at winning at least one series if we got past the Giants, but we'll never know.

By the way, I hope you meant 2016 being the Pirates year and not 2106. I'd like to see one more run in my lifetime.

 

[26 elroy face]

Not sure how I have been missing this post, but I have. If we are going to discuss first base options to keep, I would keep Ike Davis over Pedro, he is superior defensively and by most metrics offensively. However, I would personally just me all 3 go and turn first base over to Lambo. If he can't cut it there, give Snider a shot at it. Either one would be athletic enough to play the position and my personal opinion is that they would both hit better than any of the three. I do not see this happening, but it is what I would do. That move alone would save us $15-20 million on next years salary and would ensure us of being able to hi with anyone for Martin. We would also be almost assured of being able to sign a second tier starter like Liriano.

Yeah, I saw that post and wished I had missed it. Pedro at his very best is a one tool player.

 

[element1286]

4pm deadline for QO's will see how this all shakes out.

 

[element1286]

NL Central Notes: Martin, Peavy, Shields ? MLB Trade Rumors

In today’s Insider-only blog post (subscription required), ESPN’s Buster Olney discusses the looming free agency of Russell Martin, calling him the “Lamborghini of the catching market” and noting that he is positioned better than perhaps any free agent this offseason. Olney spoke with a number of executives from around the league, with some believing the tipping point for Martin could be whether a team is willing to increase its offer from three years to four, and others believing the tipping point will be whether or not any team offers a fifth guaranteed year. I’m on board with the latter of the two opinions, personally, as I do feel Martin has an exceptionally strong case for a four-year deal. As Olney notes, even if Martin is physically unable to catch a full workload of games by the end of his contract, he’s an exceptional athlete with MLB experience at other positions, so he could be moved around to provide further value as his heavy career workload begins to take its toll.

Really can't see the Pirates going four years, let alone five.

 

[Darkstone42]

Agreed, that kind of term would handcuff the team too much, especially if his abilities start to fade by the end of the deal, a reasonable concern for a catcher. They need to make a strong three-year deal offer, I think.

 

[steelparrot]

I would give QO's to Martin and Liriano.

Both of them will decline and cash out.

Not that I blame them, they were giving 'improve your next contract' contracts and they did.

 

[steelparrot]

They gave them both QO's.

I think the odds of Liriano excepting are about 40%, time will tell.

 

[element1286]

Surprised they gave out one to Liriano, could be the type of guy who really gets hamstrung in free agency by having a draft pick attached to him.

 

[thecrow124]

I believe that the Pirates fully intend to sign Liriano for 3-4 years, so in that case the QO makes all the sense in the world. He will likely decline and his FA stock will be impacted enough to where his price tag will stay in the Pirates range.......might have to push to a 4th year, but in this case it would be worth it. 4/$45-50 should be all it takes with the draft pick attached.

As for Martin, if the Cubs seriously get in the mix we may be screwed. There is no way we can compete with them in terms of dollars, especially since they only look to get younger next year. Even with the draft pick attached he is likely going to get 4/$60 or more, which would be ok for us, but if the Cubs go 5 years, the only shot we have is the fact that the Cubs are going to be bad for the next 2 years, where we would be in much better shape to win while he is still young enough to be a factor. In the end, I just can't see us being able to bring him back.

I do believe that we will bring back Volquez, probably on a Charlie Morton type deal, and that could be an absolute bargain, then again it could be horrible......equal risk.

As for reclamation projects, I am not sure there are any out there in our price range. One down year usually doesn't make a pitchers price drop that much, and the ones that have had consecutive bad years have some alarms that would make me skeptical of signing them.

 

[thecrow124]

NL Central Notes: Martin, Peavy, Shields ? MLB Trade Rumors



Really can't see the Pirates going four years, let alone five.

Just a quick thought on this, if he were to get a 5 year deal from us there are a couple ways it could play out.

If Diaz proves to be legit, there are still openings at first and possibly third, and possibly even second, depending on Harrison, Bell, Lambo and , Walker situations.

He could be traded after year 3 while his skills still might not have started to diminish to a point where it would be noticeable. For catchers, defense would be the last thing to go, and that is his strongest asset.

He could play out the contract, and we would have to play out the skillset decline. But that brings up other issues like the development of all the other early round catchers we have drafted. Even at 5 years the skillset decline might not be as bad as people think, then again it could be worse, earlier and more rapid.

In the end, if it takes 5 years, I would be comfortable with it, but not at $15 million per, maybe something like $13 million per, but not $15.

 

[TheBurgh88]

It really sucks that some rich teams had awful years and their picks will be protected (Boston/Chicago).

Much easier for them to lose a 2nd than a 1st. I think that's the rule isn't it?

 

[steelparrot]

It really sucks that some rich teams had awful years and their picks will be protected (Boston/Chicago).

Much easier for them to lose a 2nd than a 1st. I think that's the rule isn't it?

Yep, if you are in the top 10, your 1st round pick is protected. I think they added a clause that exempts comp picks from moving your pick out of protection after the Mets got screwed by our Appel comp pick.

 

[Illinest]

The pittsburgh sports media is already in "protect ownership" mode. It's funny how one year they defend management by pointing out how valuable a guy like Russell Martin is, but then next year they're all trying to downplay Martin's contributions.
They did a similar thing with Burnett.

I actually agree with you guys for the most part. Russell Martin's contract is probably going to hang on the term. I think Martin has enough leverage to ask for 5 years, and maybe only get 4. I think that the Pirates need 2 years and probably shouldn't go past 3.

Vance Worley needs to be back.
Volquez can fuck off. We probably squeezed all of the value that you can possibly get out of the guy. Some other team can offer him a pay raise.
I think there's a good case to be made for signing Liriano.
I think there's also a good case to be made for trying to trade Melancon. As good as he's been, he might be in line for 6 or 7 million in arbitration. If he gets that then hell no.

Pedro screwed everybody by sucking. Have to keep him one more year.
Gaby - bye. Davis - bye.
We could use a right-handed bat I think.
Walker - easy call. Just go to arbitration with him.

I don't know what to do about catcher. I assume we'll have no better option than to promote Stewart. I heard Miguel Montero is on the block. I think that some team will find the balls to make that trade rather than compete for Martin. Will that team be the Pirates?

 

[element1286]

Martin did a good job of having his best season ever too this year. I don't buy him as a .290/.402/.430 hitter going forward, I'd be more comfortable projecting him as a .250/.350/.400, and even that is a better line than every year he has had since 2008, save last year.

If you can keep him on reasonable terms, it would be great, but bringing him back for something insane like 4/60 or 5/75 isn't a good investment. 2/30 with a team option and 5m buyout is probably the limit I'd go, and he'll get better offers.

With the QO, they are at least planning on Liriano as a possibility, really don't have a good handle on what he would command though. He has the dynamic stuff that teams could jump on, but he is also injury prone, and has had some average at best season mixed in with great ones. I don't think he is Ubaldo Jimenez, who got 4/50, Ubaldo having much better consistent history, and less injuries. Just gonna throw 3/36 out there, since it's a nice round number.

Not particularly interested in Volquez, someone else can pay him 20 million dollars.

 

[Darkstone42]

I also want Worley back, but only if we have a catcher who receives pitches well. Worley's standout skills are not walking anyone and catching guys looking, and both of those are hugely enhanced by a backstop who can buy him some calls and cost him few. If we don't have Martin or a similar receiver, Worley just isn't that good.