how do we fix this ?

[Sharkinva]

have you seen tom brady and cam newton play this season? its hard for qbs to do much if their o line sucks. hey maybe rg3 and/or kirk could develop better if they're center and guards didnt get pushed back in their face all the time.

Patriots are 2-1 and Carolina is 2-2, and again I dont see either fanbase bitching about how the O-line is the reason their teams arent undefeated. That has become the Redskins fans excuse dejour.

 

[j_y19]

j_y.... Skins fans spend more time complaining about the o-line than almost ANY fanbase on the planet. Fanbases that actually have a QB I dont generally see this from. I agree we could use a bit more talent on the O-line. But after 20 years, I think the excuse grows tired considering i see teams with worse offensive line performances doing much better than our team consistently. But I give, I agree. we need to cut Chester, Polumbus and every other lineman not named trent Williams. Cut all the WRs and half the defense. Use every cap dollar to sign the biggest baddest pass blocking O-line ever assembled. And if we still suck after that, well atleast we will have something else to blame.

They complain about the OL because this unit has been subpar for years and every FO seems to never address it. Couldn't the complaints be legitimate? No one is saying that the OL is the reason why our QBs are struggling. They both have their own issues. But wouldn't it make sense that as we wade through our QB dilemma over the next season and a half that we do try and upgrade this unit for whomever is our QB? Or would you rather we just keep it subpar as some way of making RG3 develop his pocket passing skills in a negative environment to toughen him up? It seems everything with you comes back to somehow posters are making excuses for RG3 and his deficiencies. Well guess what, that OL sucks for KC also. You know why? Because the OL sucks. Its just that simple. We would all just like to see the FO finally apply some resources to address the issue.

 

[Sharkinva]

j_y... Im agreeing. Im saying fuck it, lets go all in on the o-line. Get rid of the excuse.

 

[SkinFaninATL]

have you seen tom brady and cam newton play this season? its hard for qbs to do much if their o line sucks. hey maybe rg3 and/or kirk could develop better if they're center and guards didnt get pushed back in their face all the time.

Those are two good examples. Not to mention, Tom Brady was very upset, when Logan Mankins got traded and rightfully so. QBs need time to throw the ball. I even like what the Cowboys have done with their O-line in the last couple of drafts. They've drafted Tyron Smith, Travis Fredrick, and Zack Martin. Tony Romo has time to get rid of the football. Now, what he does with it afterwards, who knows. Still, this proves that a good OL is needed to be successful. Let's be for real! Outside of Trent Williams, none of these guys would be starters on the average team's O-line. What's sad is the FO has ignored this position, until this year's draft. I don't know if Morgan Moses or Long will be ready, but they have potential. I'm still not sold on Shaun Lavao as a guard. I don't know what this team is going to do at this point.

 

[Sharkinva]

shark must have been pissed when we drafted moses and long because apparently our o line isnt a problem

I thought Moses was highly over rated. and apparently I was right. I was fine with the long pick. But again if these guys are so good and our line is really the problem... why the fuck arent they starting already??

 

[martinez]

Patriots are 2-1 and Carolina is 2-2, and again I dont see either fanbase bitching about how the O-line is the reason their teams arent undefeated. That has become the Redskins fans excuse dejour.

yeah the pats are 2-1 going against miami, minn and oak. wow because i was talking about records and not qb play... tom brady scored 16 points against the raiders. the difference is, when the o line sucks, the qbs struggle hence i brought up tom brady and cam newton.

 

[martinez]

I thought Moses was highly over rated. and apparently I was right. I was fine with the long pick. But again if these guys are so good and our line is really the problem... why the fuck arent they starting already??

because they're not ready yet. they are rookies. its week 4. i didnt want moses. i was saying hopefully they develop into starters. if not, we might have to address RG and RT through the free agency or draft. i have never called for long or moses or ribeye to start once on this board. when i say we need to make changes i am talking about in the off season.

 

[Sharkinva]

yeah the pats are 2-1 going against miami, minn and oak. wow because i was talking about records and not qb play... tom brady scored 16 points against the raiders. the difference is, when the o line sucks, the qbs struggle hence i brought up tom brady and cam newton.

The difference is, neither team is sitting there talking about what they need to do next off season in week 4. As usual, we are. We lost to the texans, Eagles, and the giants steam rolled us, But maybe you are right. we need to address the line. But Im willing to bet it wont matter.

 

[martinez]

j_y... Im agreeing. Im saying fuck it, lets go all in on the o-line. Get rid of the excuse.

actually you are not, you just want the skins to do that, then have them still suck, and then you can say i told you so. what the hell is the excuse? if something sucks you hope to fix it. who is making excuses? if anyone, you are making excuses for the o line.

 

[martinez]

The difference is, neither team is sitting there talking about what they need to do next off season in week 4. As usual, we are. We lost to the texans, Eagles, and the giants steam rolled us, But maybe you are right. we need to address the line. But Im willing to bet it wont matter.

and your still missing the point of that im talking about qb play. panthers and pats were double digit win teams last year. their o lines have sucked this year. its gotten cam killed and tom brady hasnt played well. why are you talking about records when the topic is qbs and o lines. the point is very simple, o line sucks = qb play and offense struggle.

 

[Sharkinva]

and your still missing the point of that im talking about qb play. panthers and pats were double digit win teams last year. their o lines have sucked this year. its gotten cam killed and tom brady hasnt played well. why are you talking about records when the topic is qbs and o lines. the point is very simple, o line sucks = qb play and offense struggle.

So like I said dude, I hope we sell out to fix the o-line next year. get rid of this excuse. And if we still suck.

A franchise Qb with a sucky line= an average team that you cant count out.

A sucky line with an over rated Qb= talking about next year after game 4 of this season.

We have been option #2 since my son was in diapers.. and he just graduated college.

 

[Sportster 72]

its called a draft we have a full compliment of picks for the next 2 years and counting

free agency is another way in conjunction with the draft

now again i am all ears if anyone has better way , all ears

I was probably directing my post more towards Martinez. Either way you did not address my questions if that was your intention. So I guess I don't have anymore questions until we address the issues I mentioned.

 

[martinez]

What, do u want names or something? Ur questions were answered. We already have Moses and long, drafting an o linemen wouldn't expensive. I said I wanted a Brian de la Puente type signing. Or we could go more expensive if you'd like. But the one thing I stress the most is the o line coach. We need an upgrade here.

 

[martinez]

Shark, me and dad are not talking about a one year fix. So ur all in, sign three o linemen plan doesnt apply to us.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

The difference is, neither team is sitting there talking about what they need to do next off season in week 4. As usual, we are. We lost to the texans, Eagles, and the giants steam rolled us, But maybe you are right. we need to address the line. But Im willing to bet it wont matter.

First of all - as it now stands - those are three pretty decent teams. Cmon - a little time has transpired since Thu & there are lots of other teams who have played just as poorly as the Redskins over the course of the season so let's try to be a little reasonable & not act like drama queens when discussing all of this.

There are numerous problems on this team & also it probably is not as bad as it appeared on Thu. The problems are in several areas in all three phases of the team.

Think of it - if the Skins secondary could cover anyone then they probably win the Eagles game. If they can execute on special teams & limit their turnovers then they have a good shot beating the Texans. I am not stating this as a woulda-shoulda exercise - simply bringing this up to point out that all of the issues are not on the O-line & QB & some things are correctable - if not this season then perhaps by the next few seasons.

I also believe that for some of this everyone is placing the blame on personnel & in the process giving the players on the field a free pass (i.e. you can't blame them since they are no good). I call BS on that - they can improve to a certain extent & coaches are also accountable. It does appear that there is a certain amt of quit in this team & that needs to be addressed. Also - on defense there do appear to be mismatches & a certain amt of outcoaching.

Let's just calm down a bit, stop attacking each other so much (I am as guilty as anyone) & evaluate the team over the next 6 games or so before coming to final conclusions about what is needed to upgrade this team.

 

[martinez]

So like I said dude, I hope we sell out to fix the o-line next year. get rid of this excuse. And if we still suck.

A franchise Qb with a sucky line= an average team that you cant count out.

A sucky line with an over rated Qb= talking about next year after game 4 of this season.

We have been option #2 since my son was in diapers.. and he just graduated college.

I'm not even defending rg3 or Kirk, I'm just saying the o line sucks. Lets say rg3 and Kirk are not the answer at QB. So then we have to draft one in the next few years or however long it takes the front office to realize that they aren't the answer. Wouldn't u want a decent o line for the new developing QB? Or would u want to throw him into the fire and have him running for his life every game? So before this new QB gets here, lets put him in a position for success and give him a clean pocket. Or we could just set up the next QB for failure. Whether its rg3, kirk, colt, free agent, or draft pick, a good o line would help them all. And we aren't even saying draft one in the first round. We could draft Leonard Williams or Landon Collins and then take an o linemen in the second and id be happy

 

[SoCalWizFan]

So like I said dude, I hope we sell out to fix the o-line next year. get rid of this excuse. And if we still suck.

A franchise Qb with a sucky line= an average team that you cant count out.

A sucky line with an over rated Qb= talking about next year after game 4 of this season.

We have been option #2 since my son was in diapers.. and he just graduated college.

Washington Redskins | 2006 Roster - SportingCharts.com

Unless your son is a Doogie Houser type and graduated when he was 12 that statement is not quite accurate. Until the relatively recent past the Redskins generally had at least an adequate O-line (and secondary) that produced quality players like Tre Johnson, John Jansen, Chris Samuels, Randy Thomas, Derrick Dockery, etc. Scroll through the various years in the link above to refresh your memory.

Many of those teams had guys that contributed for many years until injury or age took its toll. A lot of those teams had issues in other areas including coaching.

Also - I don't think that you need to replace the entire line at once (save for Williams). It is amazing how much difference it would make if you even added one quality player & there is no telling if perhaps one of the younger guys also steps up in the future.

 

[Sharkinva]

I'm not even defending rg3 or Kirk, I'm just saying the o line sucks. Lets say rg3 and Kirk are not the answer at QB. So then we have to draft one in the next few years or however long it takes the front office to realize that they aren't the answer. Wouldn't u want a decent o line for the new developing QB? Or would u want to throw him into the fire and have him running for his life every game? So before this new QB gets here, lets put him in a position for success and give him a clean pocket. Or we could just set up the next QB for failure. Whether its rg3, kirk, colt, free agent, or draft pick, a good o line would help them all. And we aren't even saying draft one in the first round. We could draft Leonard Williams or Landon Collins and then take an o linemen in the second and id be happy

Mart.... IM not against fixing the O-line. I think we have actually sacrificed the O-line reaching for the WRONG QBs over and over again. So I think the two are heavily linked. I think we had a good line with a shitty QB during Gibbs two. I think right no w we have what should be an average line with a pair of flawed Qbs.

 

[Sharkinva]

Washington Redskins | 2006 Roster - SportingCharts.com

Unless your son is a Doogie Houser type and graduated when he was 12 that statement is not quite accurate. Until the relatively recent past the Redskins generally had at least an adequate O-line (and secondary) that produced quality players like Tre Johnson, John Jansen, Chris Samuels, Randy Thomas, Derrick Dockery, etc. Scroll through the various years in the link above to refresh your memory.

Many of those teams had guys that contributed for many years until injury or age took its toll. A lot of those teams had issues in other areas including coaching.

Also - I don't think that you need to replace the entire line at once (save for Williams). It is amazing how much difference it would make if you even added one quality player & there is no telling if perhaps one of the younger guys also steps up in the future.

Socal... my son is 22 and since 1999 I have seen certain posters who proclaimed our line was garbage year in and year out. remember Im one who thinks we have what should be an average line, but other issues make them look worse than they are. Im just agreeing with the prevailing thought line here that our Qbs have failed because the line sucked.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Mart.... IM not against fixing the O-line. I think we have actually sacrificed the O-line reaching for the WRONG QBs over and over again. So I think the two are heavily linked. I think we had a good line with a shitty QB during Gibbs two. I think right no w we have what should be an average line with a pair of flawed Qbs.

I find it interesting that everyone is jumping on the O-line right now. Granted - they definitely need to address that area. However - by no means were they the main ones responsible for the last two losses. They were without blame in the Eagles game & that one primarily falls on the horrible secondary.

The Giants loss was mainly the result of poor coverage (this time by LBs as well as DBs) and just a flat our horrible second half by the QB. I realize that part of this supports your argument Shark - just trying to clarify the situation.

I would also not be so quick to dismiss both QBs - they need at least the rest of the season before deciding to get rid of one or both. The majority of the NFL consists of QBs that have several horrible games during the season (heck Foles didn't look good today). You may be right that they both should go elsewhere but please give it a bit of time. If neither works out it will make the Redskins rebuild that much tougher.