SHOW ME THE MONEY

[sonnyblack65]

Hearing that Daniel Jones' agent will be asking the Giants for 45 million per

If he gets 45 mill I won't be singing Me and Mrs Jones, will be Me and Mr Jones

 

[jarntt]

I think what’s clouding your perspective is your desire to think that Hurts is a one year wonder when every indicator says otherwise. At no point in his development has he regressed. He has been on a steady arc of improvement. He’s an exceptional leader of men and that has been shown in every stop he has made. The only area in which I can grant your argument is the possibility of injury. Hurts doesn’t have much of an injury history and in theory every contract could become a mistake based on some injury that’s unforeseen. That’s not a reason to move forward with the certainty of cap planning. Regardless of what extension Hurts signs the Eagles have the option of a low contract on the cap in 2023 being used to judiciously spread the cap and signing bonus over years to mitigate the number he costs vs the cap every year. You have more cap flexibility the sooner you can get the deal inked. The sooner the deal gets inked the more flexibility you have in playing the Tom Brady renegotiation game where a player takes more guaranteed money in exchange for a reset and finagling of the cap.

I think you are the one confusing desire with thoughts and I think the desire part may be you trying to attribute my opinion to me not wanting Hurts to be good. I actually like Hurts as a person and think he is very impressive every time I listen to him. Sports are full of guys who for whatever reason had a great season early on and many times their best season. No team signs a guy to a huge deal unless they think it will work out and clearly it doesn't always. My thoughts that Hurts is not a great passer of the football has nothing to do with him being an Eagle. I think the most important thing a QB does is throw the football. I think Hurts had a really good year and is in an incredible spot but I don't think he is a great QB. Again, it's just risk vs reward and I don't see it after one season

 

[sonnyblack65]

the two Patriots I always think of from back in those days are Russ Francis & John Hannah.

Stanley Morgan, Andre Tippet were 2 others along with the 4 already mention. Most remember Daryl Stingley because what happed to him, and Jack Tatum, never apologizing, sending a card or visiting him in the hospital. Then he has the nerve to write a book ' They call me Hitman" or something stupid like that. Now Daryl's grandson is in the NFL, we are getting old

 

[Lake Shore Drive]

I think Hurts had a really good year and is in an incredible spot but I don't think he is a great QB.

Like all players, not just QB, we have to see similar performances over multiple seasons before applying the "great" tag. So in one sense it's fair to say Hurts isn't a great QB......yet. But all indications are this guy is going to be a stud for a number of years. IMO the Eagles would be wise to ink him to an extension while the going price is what it is. Something akin to what the Chiefs did with Mahomes.

 

[jarntt]

Like all players, not just QB, we have to see similar performances over multiple seasons before applying the "great" tag. So in one sense it's fair to say Hurts isn't a great QB......yet. But all indications are this guy is going to be a stud for a number of years. IMO the Eagles would be wise to ink him to an extension while the going price is what it is. Something akin to what the Chiefs did with Mahomes.

Yes, I don't totally disagree with that. I also don't give out $250-300M for one good year unless I have to and he has a contract and then there is the tag option if necessary but I'm not suggesting it will be. Most of these other young QBs play 3 or 4 seasons before they get that offer. If Hurts wants his huge deal after one season I'm discounting it somewhat. Like many players he doesn't need to sign that of course if he disagrees

 

[Southieinnc]

Politics were responsible for people not giving a fuck about the Pats?

The difference was Kraft becoming the owner. They got aggressive and went for Parcells. I think you’re local to Philly so I’ll use this analogy. The Phillies didn’t win with Thome but with his signing and the new ball park, ownership finally signaled that they were serious about competing and winning. Pre Kraft you’re talking about one of the more unsuccessful franchises in the NFL from both a competitive stand point and fan support.

The only things that ever hampered fan support for the pre-Kraft Patriots was a bad stadium and the majority of NE fans being NY Giant fans.....

 

[fightinfunbags]

I think you are the one confusing desire with thoughts and I think the desire part may be you trying to attribute my opinion to me not wanting Hurts to be good. I actually like Hurts as a person and think he is very impressive every time I listen to him. Sports are full of guys who for whatever reason had a great season early on and many times their best season. No team signs a guy to a huge deal unless they think it will work out and clearly it doesn't always. My thoughts that Hurts is not a great passer of the football has nothing to do with him being an Eagle. I think the most important thing a QB does is throw the football. I think Hurts had a really good year and is in an incredible spot but I don't think he is a great QB. Again, it's just risk vs reward and I don't see it after one season

I can just conclude then that you haven’t seen enough of him. Hurts and Mahomes were 1 and 2 this year with QBR from the pocket. Hurts had an exceptional season as a passer this year. How many times did you see him play?

 

[fightinfunbags]

Like all players, not just QB, we have to see similar performances over multiple seasons before applying the "great" tag. So in one sense it's fair to say Hurts isn't a great QB......yet. But all indications are this guy is going to be a stud for a number of years. IMO the Eagles would be wise to ink him to an extension while the going price is what it is. Something akin to what the Chiefs did with Mahomes.

We’ve made declarations about such things about Herbert despite the fact that he’s never won a playoff game. I have my own theory on why the two are perceived differently but I have to bite my tongue on that one.

 

[fightinfunbags]

The only things that ever hampered fan support for the pre-Kraft Patriots was a bad stadium and the majority of NE fans being NY Giant fans.....

We should add some of the worst High School football in the culture. Massachusetts and New England has never been a football culture.

 

[Southieinnc]

We should add some of the worst High School football in the culture. Massachusetts and New England has never been a football culture.

Philly has never had any culture - outside of "brotherly love"

 

[fightinfunbags]

Philly has never had any culture - outside of "brotherly love"

There’s great football in Philly and there always has been. The Philadelphia Catholic League is one of the best high school football conferences in the country. The Big 33 game between Ohio and Pa is well known nationally. People are football crazy down here.

 

[Southieinnc]

There’s great football in Philly and there always has been. The Philadelphia Catholic League is one of the best high school football conferences in the country. The Big 33 game between Ohio and Pa is well known nationally. People are football crazy down here.

Crazy? Check.
Brotherly love? Check!

 

[fightinfunbags]

Crazy? Check.
Brotherly love? Check!

I could talk baseball with Mass Holes all day long. Even women and children up there are well schooled on that sport. Football? Nah. Bunch of casuals drawn to the winning with Belichick and Brady.

 

[jarntt]

I can just conclude then that you haven’t seen enough of him. Hurts and Mahomes were 1 and 2 this year with QBR from the pocket. Hurts had an exceptional season as a passer this year. How many times did you see him play?

I saw him play a lot. I don't know how many games but all the big ones I'd imagine. He was in an offense where the defense was looking run much more often than for average teams. He only had 30 passing attempts per game as compared to Mahomes who had almost 25% more. You should have a better rating when throwing less often. Plus QBR takes running/scrambling into account I believe. You can cherry pick whatever stats you want. But to me, he needs to prove again he can throw the ball accurately and make the right decisions. Also you can't overestimate having the best OL by far in the league and how that helps all of these things like QBR and would help a replacement QB as well.

 

[fightinfunbags]

I saw him play a lot. I don't know how many games but all the big ones I'd imagine. He was in an offense where the defense was looking run much more often than for average teams. He only had 30 passing attempts per game as compared to Mahomes who had almost 25% more. You should have a better rating when throwing less often. Plus QBR takes running/scrambling into account I believe. You can cherry pick whatever stats you want. But to me, he needs to prove again he can throw the ball accurately and make the right decisions. Also you can't overestimate having the best OL by far in the league and how that helps all of these things like QBR and would help a replacement QB as well.

The QBR metric isn’t the larger one. It specifically looks at his QBR from the pocket. Listen, I’m not going to talk you off your point. He’s shown exceptional growth as a passer though.

Additionally, because OL is a franchise priority nearly equal to the QB position, the Eagles don’t have to account for what happens if the OL play falls apart. They’re paying the best OL coach in football offensive coordinator money to keep that program and development in place.

 

[eaglesnut]

I think what’s clouding your perspective is your desire to think that Hurts is a one year wonder when every indicator says otherwise. At no point in his development has he regressed. He has been on a steady arc of improvement. He’s an exceptional leader of men and that has been shown in every stop he has made. The only area in which I can grant your argument is the possibility of injury. Hurts doesn’t have much of an injury history and in theory every contract could become a mistake based on some injury that’s unforeseen. That’s not a reason to move forward with the certainty of cap planning. Regardless of what extension Hurts signs the Eagles have the option of a low contract on the cap in 2023 being used to judiciously spread the cap and signing bonus over years to mitigate the number he costs vs the cap every year. You have more cap flexibility the sooner you can get the deal inked. The sooner the deal gets inked the more flexibility you have in playing the Tom Brady renegotiation game where a player takes more guaranteed money in exchange for a reset and finagling of the cap.

Jarnnt doesn't understand the cap, cap ramifications of contracts, or the value of players. Now you know.

 

[jarntt]

The clown show is back in town. You feel to even grasp the simplest aspects of the cap and cap hits so it's a lost cause with you

 

[Tainthappening]

the two Patriots I always think of from back in those days are Russ Francis & John Hannah.

1977 started collecting football cards a lot more... remember those names along with Mike Haynes and Grogan

Nearly all the cards long gone now... still have some of the better ones... Montana rookie maybe best card have from back then. Packers were not worth collecting much at that time

 

[eaglesnut]

The clown show is back in town. You feel to even grasp the simplest aspects of the cap and cap hits so it's a lost cause with you

The one thing I do not clearly remember is if you or manster is worse on the cap.

I believe the aj brown/reddick hilarity most recently was at your expense.

 

[jarntt]

The one thing I do not clearly remember is if you or manster is worse on the cap.

I believe the aj brown/reddick hilarity most recently was at your expense.

Of course you believe that, you're an idiot