Actuallly....Sam Darnold

[gkekoa]

Wentz has a higher ceiling b/c he is going to a good team with all the pieces in place. There is a high ceiling for Darnold b/c of his age and ability.

Wentz has a higher ceiling because Wentz has more talent. Wentz has been a top three QB in he league.

Darnold has a lower ceiling because he lacks talent. He has shown that he young and has less ability.

 

[gkekoa]

How is giving up a 2nd or 3rd a desperation trade when its for a possible franchise QB? This is not the Rg3 trade here cmon now. Did you really expect him to win with the Jets? So you are willing to give up a 3rd but if we have to outbid another team with a 2nd you squash the deal? lol. I think its a necessary risk to trade a 2nd or 3rd for him. You don't know how TH will turn out and I think we will miss on the top 5 Qb's in the draft. Plus you have Allen coming back and we dont know if he is the franchise QB.

Reports have shown that we are interested. Im sure other teams are too.

When you start a statement off with who do we have that is better...that screams desperation.

I showed you the Jets regressed with Darnold...not the other way around.

Correct. I would not give a second for Darnold.

Why is it necessary? That second or third could be used on Jones or Trask...both of which have as good a chance of success as the unsuccessful Darnold.

So we should throw away picks for Darnold, who we also shouldnt think will,be a franchise QB because he has proven not to be?

Reports...who cares? I never said we weren’t. I have said we should be at the right price. A first is laughable, a second should not be done, a third ok, a fourth sure.

 

[chillerdab]

Dean, what about sam darnold’s play over the last few years makes you think that he might be a potential franchise qb?

my man gekoka provided you with stats that suggest otherwise.

if he is not a potential franchise qb, then trading a second rounder for him is laughable, and trading a third for him is not much better.

Ryan Tannehill's stats with Titans: How he went from discarded by Dolphins to MVP conversation | Sporting News

www.google.com

tannehill and a sixth round pick was traded by the dolphins for a fourth and seventh round pick.
According to this article Tannehill was traded for because he showed promise during his last two seasons with miami.

Has Darnold shown promise during his last two seasons with the jets?

 

[deanpet21]

Wentz has a higher ceiling because Wentz has more talent. Wentz has been a top three QB in he league.

Darnold has a lower ceiling because he lacks talent. He has shown that he young and has less ability.

If that was the case then why is there a trade market for Darnold? The guy has upside.

 

[deanpet21]

When you start a statement off with who do we have that is better...that screams desperation.

I showed you the Jets regressed with Darnold...not the other way around.

Correct. I would not give a second for Darnold.

Why is it necessary? That second or third could be used on Jones or Trask...both of which have as good a chance of success as the unsuccessful Darnold.

So we should throw away picks for Darnold, who we also shouldnt think will,be a franchise QB because he has proven not to be?

Reports...who cares? I never said we weren’t. I have said we should be at the right price. A first is laughable, a second should not be done, a third ok, a fourth sure.

giving up a 2nd or 3rd is not desperation. Young QB's on bad teams usually dont produce good stats. So you can throw your numbers right out the window. Jones shounnt be there in the 1stround never mind 2nd round. If you are bidding against other teams a round difference from the 3rd to 2nd shouldnt break the deal. Its a possible franchise QB. You take the risk, that doenst mean its desperation.

 

[deanpet21]

Dean, what about sam darnold’s play over the last few years makes you think that he might be a potential franchise qb?

my man gekoka provided you with stats that suggest otherwise.

if he is not a potential franchise qb, then trading a second rounder for him is laughable, and trading a third for him is not much better.

Ryan Tannehill's stats with Titans: How he went from discarded by Dolphins to MVP conversation | Sporting News

www.google.com

tannehill and a sixth round pick was traded by the dolphins for a fourth and seventh round pick.
According to this article Tannehill was traded for because he showed promise during his last two seasons with miami.

Has Darnold shown promise during his last two seasons with the jets?

throw the stats out the window, he was on a bad team. His age, draft status, and abiltiy make him worthy of a 2nd or 3rd round pick. There will be a market for him. I cant wait to see the offers. Alot of teams need Qb's.

 

[pachyderm]

May not be as bad as i thought. I now would do it for a 3rd. I was reading a mock draft on nfl.com and perhaps on another team with more talent, he could pull off a Ryan Tanehill type transformation. Also the previous year he swept the NFC EAST. And he has played well against some of the better NFC teams too. 3rd and 5th are my max offers.
If thats not good enough, oh well. Back to Original plan of FA,cuts or draft

I think he is better than most folks think. I think the Jets are much worse than most people think...

 

[chillerdab]

throw the stats out the window, he was on a bad team. His age, draft status, and abiltiy make him worthy of a 2nd or 3rd round pick. There will be a market for him. I cant wait to see the offers. Alot of teams need Qb's.

Just because there might br a market for Darnold doesnt mean there should be.

Just because there might be a market for Darnold doesnt mean the WFT has to overpay for him.

 

[gkekoa]

If that was the case then why is there a trade market for Darnold? The guy has upside.

There is a trade market because there is hope. There was a trade market for Wentz, a market for Mariota, for Carr, for Watson, and every market is different.

Nobody said Darnold didn’t have upside, or a possibility of upside.

 

[gkekoa]

giving up a 2nd or 3rd is not desperation. Young QB's on bad teams usually dont produce good stats. So you can throw your numbers right out the window. Jones shounnt be there in the 1stround never mind 2nd round. If you are bidding against other teams a round difference from the 3rd to 2nd shouldnt break the deal. Its a possible franchise QB. You take the risk, that doenst mean its desperation.

When did I say giving up a second or third was desperation? I said, when you made your statement of giving up a second or third for Darnold because WE DON’T HAVE BETTER OPTIONS, that is desperate. You aren’t giving up a second or third because Darnold is good. You are giving up a second or third because you are desperate.

My stats were directed at the three excuses people like you have made: bad coaching (same coach with a 5 game regression), no number one WR (same basic receivers with lower production), bad OL (better OL than the previous year). What you fail to admit is Darnold regressed.

Joe Blow is a possible franchise QB. That isn’t how you weigh draft capital. You put a value on a player, another team puts a value on a player, and you bid.

 

[deanpet21]

When did I say giving up a second or third was desperation? I said, when you made your statement of giving up a second or third for Darnold because WE DON’T HAVE BETTER OPTIONS, that is desperate. You aren’t giving up a second or third because Darnold is good. You are giving up a second or third because you are desperate.

My stats were directed at the three excuses people like you have made: bad coaching (same coach with a 5 game regression), no number one WR (same basic receivers with lower production), bad OL (better OL than the previous year). What you fail to admit is Darnold regressed.

Joe Blow is a possible franchise QB. That isn’t how you weigh draft capital. You put a value on a player, another team puts a value on a player, and you bid.

We probably will give up a 2nd or 3rd for Darnold b/c there is no proven guy on our roster. Thats not desperate at all. That's being smart on having multiple options at QB.

 

[deanpet21]

Just because there might br a market for Darnold doesnt mean there should be.

Just because there might be a market for Darnold doesnt mean the WFT has to overpay for him.

Of course there should be. You cant just give up on the guy at his age and talent level. a 2nd or 3rd round pick is not an overpay. Considering the QB trades in the past, not even close.

 

[gkekoa]

We probably will give up a 2nd or 3rd for Darnold b/c there is no proven guy on our roster. Thats not desperate at all. That's being smart on having multiple options at QB.

Why not just give up a second for a second round QB in the draft?

If that is the value you place on Darnold, and that is the value you place on a second round QB, then why not take the second round QB?

 

[gkekoa]

Of course there should be. You cant just give up on the guy at his age and talent level. a 2nd or 3rd round pick is not an overpay. Considering the QB trades in the past, not even close.

They gave up on Josh Rosen, who was arguably more talented. What did he bring in return?

 

[deanpet21]

Why not just give up a second for a second round QB in the draft?

If that is the value you place on Darnold, and that is the value you place on a second round QB, then why not take the second round QB?

lol. After the first 5 QB's there is a huge drop off. I rather have Darnold than Trask.

 

[Stymietee]

First let me state that it makes zero sense to use team W/L records as any sort of measurement related to individual stats. However, using individual stats on teams that finished with the same or very similiar W/L records will give you better indicators of what each can do under similiar circumstances. THe N.Y. Jets finished with a 2-14 record and they were the only team that did. The closest team was the Jacksonville jaguars who finished with a 1-15 record. With that in mind here are the comparative stats of their QB's.

NYJ:



Jacksonville Jaguars:

 

[deanpet21]

They gave up on Josh Rosen, who was arguably more talented. What did he bring in return?

Actually Rosen fetched a 2nd rounder from Miami if I remember correctly. .

 

[Stymietee]

If anyone is interested here: the link to NFL.com that I used for these stats.

QB Index: Ranking the 59 starting quarterbacks of the 2020 NFL season
NFL.com editors evaluated every quarterback who started a game (including the playoffs) during the …
NFL · 8d

 

[deanpet21]

Actually Rosen fetched a 2nd rounder from Miami if I remember correctly. .

Rosen was traded to Miami during draft weekend in April 2019 for a 2019 second-round pick and a 2020 fifth-round pick.

So how isn't Darnold worth a 2nd or 3rd?????

 

[skinz2winz]

When you start a statement off with who do we have that is better...that screams desperation.

I showed you the Jets regressed with Darnold...not the other way around.

Correct. I would not give a second for Darnold.

Why is it necessary? That second or third could be used on Jones or Trask...both of which have as good a chance of success as the unsuccessful Darnold.

So we should throw away picks for Darnold, who we also shouldnt think will,be a franchise QB because he has proven not to be?

Reports...who cares? I never said we weren’t. I have said we should be at the right price. A first is laughable, a second should not be done, a third ok, a fourth sure.

To echo that sentiment, regardless of what "others" think of Adam Gase outside football, he will get numerous calls about Darnold asking why the regression, why ghost, why 2 steps backwards this past season and what's up with this kid. Don't assume it was all coaching with Darnold. As a matter of fact, don't assume anything with Darnold. Do your homework.