What is your Criteria for MVP

[shopson67]

Embiid missed games because he had a real injury, he wasn’t load managing. I guess it’s one of the two but I think Embiid has earned it. I want to see the changes in his game rewarded. He shoots fewer threes and plays like a old school center a lot. It would be great if he won.

How has Embiid "earned it"?

Embiid: 29.9 ppg on 18.2 attempts, 51.2/37.8/85.3%, 11.2 reb, 3.1 ast, 1.4 blk, 1.0 stl, 2.4 pf, 3.1 to
Jokic: 26.4 ppg on 18.3 attempts, 56.9/41.9/85.4%, 11.1 reb, 8.8 ast, 0.6 blk, 1.4 stl, 2.7 pf, 3.1 to

Stats are a virtual wash with the exception of Jokic's PG like assist numbers and Embiid's FT attempts. Oh yeah, and Jokic's 18 more games played.

 

[fightinfunbags]

By your own criteria it is Jokic without a doubt.

He has played all 57 games for his team. Their team records are very similar.

Embiid has missed 10 games and the 6ers are 7-3 without him.

Jokic all day.

Embiid has missed 18 games and the Sixers are 9-9 without him.

 

[fightinfunbags]

How has Embiid "earned it"?

Embiid: 29.9 ppg on 18.2 attempts, 51.2/37.8/85.3%, 11.2 reb, 3.1 ast, 1.4 blk, 1.0 stl, 2.4 pf, 3.1 to
Jokic: 26.4 ppg on 18.3 attempts, 56.9/41.9/85.4%, 11.1 reb, 8.8 ast, 0.6 blk, 1.4 stl, 2.7 pf, 3.1 to

Stats are a virtual wash with the exception of Jokic's PG like assist numbers and Embiid's FT attempts. Oh yeah, and Jokic's 18 more games played.

Your analysis doesn’t speak to much in the way of defense. Both guys are dominant offensive players bringing a different offensive game. The discrepancy is in the defense. Jokic has improved on that end but Embiid is one of the top rim protectors in the league. On one play last night a switch put him on Curry 27-28 feet away from the basket. Curry tried to take him off the dribble. Embiid tracked him step for step and blocked his shot. Ha, I’d love to see Jokic’s fat ass attempt that shit.

 

[shopson67]

Your analysis doesn’t speak to much in the way of defense. Both guys are dominant offensive players bringing a different offensive game. The discrepancy is in the defense. Jokic has improved on that end but Embiid is one of the top rim protectors in the league. On one play last night a switch put him on Curry 27-28 feet away from the basket. Curry tried to take him off the dribble. Embiid tracked him step for step and blocked his shot. Ha, I’d love to see Jokic’s fat ass attempt that shit.

Yep, the Sixers really locked down Curry last night. Blocks and steals are defensive stats.

 

[ill]

Yep, the Sixers really locked down Curry last night. Blocks and steals are defensive stats.

missing Tobias Harris and Ben Simmons last night.

Embiid is blocking at double the rate Jokic is.

 

[fightinfunbags]

Yep, the Sixers really locked down Curry last night. Blocks and steals are defensive stats.

You should know this as a Laker fan. There’s no defense for pick and roll at 28-29 feet with a guy who has range and willingness to shoot up to seemingly 35 feet. I mean you know this as a Laker fan. You don’t stop that guy, you just buy that guy and put him on your team.

 

[fightinfunbags]

missing Tobias Harris and Ben Simmons last night.

Embiid is blocking at double the rate Jokic is.

It’s nothing short of retarded and insulting to compare Embiid and Jokic as defensive players.

 

[shopson67]

missing Tobias Harris and Ben Simmons last night.

Embiid is blocking at double the rate Jokic is.

Or you can say he's getting one more than Jokic per game. Jokic is getting more steals and assisting on 5 more baskets.

 

[shopson67]

It’s nothing short of retarded and insulting to compare Embiid and Jokic as defensive players.

No, it would be insulting to EQUATE them as defensive players. Comparing has nothing to do with equality.

 

[shopson67]

You should know this as a Laker fan. There’s no defense for pick and roll at 28-29 feet with a guy who has range and willingness to shoot up to seemingly 35 feet. I mean you know this as a Laker fan. You don’t stop that guy, you just buy that guy and put him on your team.

Yes, and even a blind squirrel finds a nut occasionally. One stop does not make Embiid a 5 position defender.

 

[ill]

Yes, and even a blind squirrel finds a nut occasionally. One stop does not make Embiid a 5 position defender.

is that what you require for an MVP candidate? That they be a 5 position defender?

 

[trojanfan12]

Damn...if only the real MVP candidates weren't all hurt.

 

[fightinfunbags]

No, it would be insulting to EQUATE them as defensive players. Comparing has nothing to do with equality.

Semantics is fun

 

[fightinfunbags]

Yes, and even a blind squirrel finds a nut occasionally. One stop does not make Embiid a 5 position defender.

I never made that claim. I said he’s one of the top rim protectors in the game. He’s an elite defensive player. Jokic is not. He’s barely adequate as a defender.

 

[shopson67]

Semantics is fun

Semantics is a big word when you don't understand the difference between compare and equate. We ALWAYS compare players, that's how you identify who is better than another.

 

[shopson67]

I never made that claim. I said he’s one of the top rim protectors in the game. He’s an elite defensive player. Jokic is not. He’s barely adequate as a defender.

....and I agreed. However, Jokic does get more steals and Embiid's rim protection only nets him one more block per game. Difficult to show defense in stats.

 

[shopson67]

is that what you require for an MVP candidate? That they be a 5 position defender?

Straw man, your table is ready...

He identified one play where Curry didn't drive past Embiid to illustrate that Embiid is a superior defender, and I countered.

 

[CitySushi]

Warriors are 28-22 with Curry this year.

They are 1-7 without him, including a 60 point loss to the Raptors.

 

[msgkings322]

Warriors are 28-22 with Curry this year.

They are 1-7 without him, including a 60 point loss to the Raptors.

#cantcarryateam

 

[fightinfunbags]

Semantics is a big word when you don't understand the difference between compare and equate. We ALWAYS compare players, that's how you identify who is better than another.

It’s all good. The colloquialism “can’t compare” invokes the idea that two things are so far apart that the speaker uses hyperbole to express that and say that the difference is so vast that you can’t compare the two. You dismissed the existence of that colloquialism and instead tried to play semantics. This was your choice because let’s face it, you recognized that sticking up for Jokic’s defense was a losing argument.