What are the 49ers long-term plan at quarterback?

[MW49ers5]

It's that they think alike. I can only infer from that that if great minds think alike, so must old, feeble minds.

No one has made any real points as to why he could improve other than "Smith did with Harbaugh."

I'd much rather give Smith his second year with Harbaugh and again, stick with the known commodity, rather than gamble that the train wreck that Mark Sanchez has been can be fixed.

Mark Sanchez has been asked throughout his career to be Alex Smith. He hasn't done it despite playing with better talent.

Someone make a real case (not 2 sentences) that Sanchez would be better than Smith on our team (not in our offense, on our TEAM).

So far it's been "Harbaugh can work with him/he has a better arm than Smith."

You're right no one has made any points - on either side - let it go.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

I think as a general statement though it is probably true. That is why people make such a big deal out of exceptions like Brees and Brady.

All things being equal, of course you want the more talented physical player. But all things are not equal, and the best physical player is very rarely the best NFL QB. I don't think it's accurate to say that the more physically talented player "should be" the better player.

 

[MW49ers5]

All things being equal, of course you want the more talented physical player. But all things are not equal, and the best physical player is very rarely the best NFL QB. I don't think it's accurate to say that the more physically talented player "should be" the better player.

Anything other than "an all things being equal argument" is just baseless speculation - right?

 

[imac_21]

Sure seems that way. Sanchez has more tools to work with than Smith does so if they have the same teacher, Sanchez should be better.

Except Sanchez is irresponsible with the ball.

To the stat NN offered up earlier about Smith throwing more than 1 INT per game before Harbaugh, that's actually not true. Smith had appeared in 54 games before this year. He had thrown 53 INT.

That's despite the horrible rookie year.

Sanchez's 3 years in terms of INT% would be the 2nd, 3rd and 4th worst of Smith's career.

Sanchez is not an upgrade.

If we're going to look to upgrade the QB position in the offseason I'd much rather look for someone that may actually be able to be a difference maker.

Also, Sanchez is only signed for 2 more seasons.

This trade would be change simply for the sake of change. It makes no sense.

Would you trade Crabtree for a WR that has struggled for a few years but was a high draft pick?

 

[imac_21]

You're right no one has made any points - on either side - let it go.

So essentially it's a trade just to make a trade? If you think it would help the team, you should be able to make some legitimate points as to why.

 

[ViperVisor]

ERA last 2 years

A.J. Burnett >5
R.A. Dickey 3

 

[imac_21]

All things being equal, of course you want the more talented physical player. But all things are not equal, and the best physical player is very rarely the best NFL QB. I don't think it's accurate to say that the more physically talented player "should be" the better player.

Does Sanchez have more physical attributes, or does he just a (slightly) better arm?

 

[Crimsoncrew]

Anything other than "an all things being equal argument" is just baseless speculation - right?

Only if we're dealing with purely hypothetical players. But we're not. We're dealing with two actual players who have been observable over a period of years and many NFL games. It's difficult in the game of football to make absolutely positive judgments, but Sanchez has demonstrably struggled in areas of the game that go beyond pure physical attributes, like committing foolish mistakes, creating turnovers, and struggling to accurately place a football. I don't see how those things are baseless speculation.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

Does Sanchez have more physical attributes, or does he just a (slightly) better arm?

I think he has a clearly stronger arm, more than slightly better even though Sanchez doesn't have an elite arm. As that's the most important physical attribute for a QB, I'd give him the nod there. He's a bit thicker than Smith, which I prefer in a QB as it generally means a guy can withstand a pounding a bit better.

 

[MW49ers5]

Only if we're dealing with purely hypothetical players. But we're not. We're dealing with two actual players who have been observable over a period of years and many NFL games. It's difficult in the game of football to make absolutely positive judgments, but Sanchez has demonstrably struggled in areas of the game that go beyond pure physical attributes, like committing foolish mistakes, creating turnovers, and struggling to accurately place a football. I don't see how those things are baseless speculation.

You're missing the point of "all things being equal".

I think Sanchez is a better QB than Smith and with more upside; thus, in a Harbaugh/Roman environment I believe Sanchez far outperforms Smith.

That's all.

 

[MW49ers5]

So essentially it's a trade just to make a trade? If you think it would help the team, you should be able to make some legitimate points as to why.

Of course not. Sanchez has a stronger arm, a quicker release, he throws a better ball with more velocity. futhermore, and IMO, Sanchez is better in the pocket, has better footwork, is better at play-action and finally, he has a much quicker mind and is much more confident. All totaled, IMO, Sanchez has way more upside; and, that is what is this is about - not who is better today, but who will be better tomorrow.

If you think Smith is better and/or has more upside - what are your legitimate points as to why you feel that way.

 

[ViperVisor]

Thinking is good. Better than just a blind guess.

I thought Smith would be as good or out preform all the feasible options people brought up the past 2 years. Carson Palmer, Donovan McNabb, Matt Hasselbeck, Kevin Kolb, Vince Young, Shaun Hill.

Not to mention the names some on the more tard filled boards were dropping during the preseason.

Looking back those names, their play didn't stand out.

I appear to have a clue.

Now things are not equal and the truth may be below the surface, but if you are gonna bust out the provisos for 1 guy you have to do it for all.
If a guy "far outperforms" it is probably beyond the margin of provisos and thinking he is better is good thinking.

Thinking Sanchez is better and "far outperforms" Smith...

doing that this year would of been a 100 QB rating. How do you imagine that would of happened?

He would of needed notable improvement in some areas to just match what Smith did.

 

[MW49ers5]

Thinking is good. Better than just a blind guess.

I thought Smith would be as good or out preform all the feasible options people brought up the past 2 years. Carson Palmer, Donovan McNabb, Matt Hasselbeck, Kevin Kolb, Vince Young, Shaun Hill.

Not to mention the names some on the more tard filled boards were dropping during the preseason.

Looking back those names, their play didn't stand out.

I appear to have a clue.

Now things are not equal and the truth may be below the surface, but if you are gonna bust out the provisos for 1 guy you have to do it for all.
If a guy "far outperforms" it is probably beyond the margin of provisos and thinking he is better is good thinking.

Thinking Sanchez is better and "far outperforms" Smith...

doing that this year would of been a 100 QB rating. How do you imagine that would of happened?

He would of needed notable improvement in some areas to just match what Smith did.

UGH!!!!!.... VV, I am comparing Sanchez with Harbaugh & Roman to Smith with Harbaugh & Roman and not just today but into the future as well.

 

[ViperVisor]

IN THE YEAR TWO THOU SAAAND...

IN THE YEAR TWO THOU SAAAAAAAAAAAAND!!!

If Harbaugh & Roman are magical why can't they just get a bit more out of Alex Smith?

Alex Smith with
10% better in Yards Per Att
1 more Completion Per Game
1 more TD Per Month

99.8 QB rating.

 

[MW49ers5]

IN THE YEAR TWO THOU SAAAND...

IN THE YEAR TWO THOU SAAAAAAAAAAAAND!!!

If Harbaugh & Roman are magical why can't they just get a bit more out of Alex Smith?

Alex Smith with
10% better in Yards Per Att
1 more Completion Per Game
1 more TD Per Month

99.8 QB rating.

LOL!!!...Conan Rules!!!

 

[clyde_carbon]

Smith or Sanchez? Did someone just punch me in the balls?

 

[Mozart'sGhost]

Except Sanchez is irresponsible with the ball.

To the stat NN offered up earlier about Smith throwing more than 1 INT per game before Harbaugh, that's actually not true. Smith had appeared in 54 games before this year. He had thrown 53 INT.

That's despite the horrible rookie year.

Sanchez's 3 years in terms of INT% would be the 2nd, 3rd and 4th worst of Smith's career.

Sanchez is not an upgrade.

If we're going to look to upgrade the QB position in the offseason I'd much rather look for someone that may actually be able to be a difference maker.

Also, Sanchez is only signed for 2 more seasons.

This trade would be change simply for the sake of change. It makes no sense.

Would you trade Crabtree for a WR that has struggled for a few years but was a high draft pick?

Two things about the bolded statement; first of all that statement is false; I did not say that. Check post #180 of this thread which is what you are referring to and show me where I said that "Smith throws more than an INT per game". Secondly, even though 53 INT is not an INT per game which is what I did say, it spretty darn close and the statistical difference is not even worth discusssing. You've got to do better than that IMAC or us old feeble guys will continue to make you look bad.

 

[Mozart'sGhost]

Only if we're dealing with purely hypothetical players. But we're not. We're dealing with two actual players who have been observable over a period of years and many NFL games. It's difficult in the game of football to make absolutely positive judgments, but Sanchez has demonstrably struggled in areas of the game that go beyond pure physical attributes, like committing foolish mistakes, creating turnovers, and struggling to accurately place a football. I don't see how those things are baseless speculation.

If I didn't know better I'd think you were decscribing the career of Alex Smith prior to this season.........to a T.

 

[iHATEdodgers]

Two things about the bolded statement; first of all that statement is false; I did not say that. Check post #180 of this thread which is what you are referring to and show me where I said that "Smith throws more than an INT per game". Secondly, even though 53 INT is not an INT per game which is what I did say, it spretty darn close and the statistical difference is not even worth discusssing. You've got to do better than that IMAC or us old feeble guys will continue to make you look bad.

You did say 1 a game, however you have to throw out Smith's rookie season, he shouldn't have even been on the field and obviously 1 td and 11 int in no way embodies his career. I would even go so far as to take away his injury plagued 07 season - if you want a fair representation of his growth - and the numbers look like this:

Pre Harbaugh: 48 td 38 int, post 17 td 5 int.... compare that to Sanchez 55 td 51 int and it's fair to say that Smith protects the ball better.

It's also fair to point out that Sanchez' YPA is dismal 6.5 his completion % is terrible 55.3 and he seems prone to just making really stupid plays.

Maybe he gets better under Harbaugh, minimizes his mistakes increases his accuracy a bit and then you basically have Smith... we should probably wait to see what Smith does in the playoffs anyway...

 

[Flyingiguana]

The only miracle is Harbaugh knowing the position. Compared to Nolan and Singletary believing that they could embarrass Smith into performing like one of the best QBs in the NFL.

I fell into that trap about Harbaugh being the QB whisperer, and made a thread about it... thinking he did something crazy with Smith. Since then, I've just realized that his understanding of the position and how to play it in the NFL is what brought along Smith's "improvement".

Could Harbaugh do that for Sanchez? Sure, but I'd rather the 49ers get a QB who isn't limited to the "Don't screw it up" role on the offense. I really don't see any difference in Sanchez and Smith, they have talent and ability, just not the type you need to open up an offense and let the QB be the star.

smith is more mobile and capable of leading drives.