tOfficially Official 2016 Spring training thread

[True Rangers Fan]

When I think of successful Rangers sinker ball pitchers I think of Kevin Brown. His first 3 full seasons here he had 4.45 strikeouts per 9 innings. I think you have to look at what else they have to offer besides strikeouts. I also think it is extremely early to pigeon hole Chi Chi as a pitcher who cannot strike out batters at a greater rate than he did in his first 10 big league starts. Sometimes it takes 100 starts before we find out what a pitcher really is.

Kevin Brown's best seasons featured a far higher K/9IP ratio though.

 

[True Rangers Fan]

He made the comment that Chi-Chi has not been a strikeout pitcher at any level, not just in the ML. So he didn't just isolate his time with the Rangers.

I think Bascik's point, if I'm not mistaken, isn't that Chi Chi needs to be a strikeout pitcher (a la Darvish), but he does need that capability to miss bats at a greater frequency. Which, I get.

 

[saddles]

He made the comment that Chi-Chi has not been a strikeout pitcher at any level, not just in the ML. So he didn't just isolate his time with the Rangers.

He struck out 6.8 per 9 innings in his minor league career. That is a good bit above the threshold that Bascik set.

 

[donaldson79]

I think Bascik's point, if I'm not mistaken, isn't that Chi Chi needs to be a strikeout pitcher (a la Darvish), but he does need that capability to miss bats at a greater frequency. Which, I get.

Precisely.

There's a lot of room for improvement between Darvish and Gonzalez, and that's no knock on Gonzalez.

 

[donaldson79]

He struck out 6.8 per 9 innings in his minor league career. That is a good bit above the threshold that Bascik set.

Which has absolutely nothing to do with anything.

 

[saddles]

Kevin Brown's best seasons featured a far higher K/9IP ratio though.

Still he went 3 full seasons below that to begin his career. My point is that you can't say that just because a guy doesn't strikeout a lot of batters so early in their career that their career is doomed.

 

[saddles]

Which has absolutely nothing to do with anything.

It has everything to do with this statement. "He made the comment that Chi-Chi has not been a strikeout pitcher at any level, not just in the ML."

 

[True Rangers Fan]

Still he went 3 full seasons below that to begin his career. My point is that you can't say that just because a guy doesn't strikeout a lot of batters so early in their career that their career is doomed.

I think (I'm guessing) he meant the odds aren't favorable for a long career if the K rate is so low. And, using Brown as example again, his K rate did go up significantly after a few years.

 

[donaldson79]

It has everything to do with this statement. "He made the comment that Chi-Chi has not been a strikeout pitcher at any level, not just in the ML."

And if he's wrong, he's wrong and so be it. I'm not defending or exalting him. This is why I quoted him and did not state it as my opinion.

But your statement of......"That is a good bit above the threshold that Bascik set" has less than zero to do with his statement. It matters not one iota what Basciks stats were or weren't when he pitched. Why interject this?

 

[True Rangers Fan]

But your statement of......"That is a good bit above the threshold that Bascik set" has less than zero to do with his statement. It matters not one iota what Basciks stats were or weren't when he pitched. Why interject this?

Those weren't Bascik's stats, they were Chi Chi's. If Bascik said that Chi Chi wasn't a strikeout pitcher in the minors, then Bascik would be wrong about that. That's what Saddles is saying.

Bascik's point about needing a better K ratio in the majors is still correct.

 

[saddles]

And if he's wrong, he's wrong and so be it. I'm not defending or exalting him. This is why I quoted him and did not state it as my opinion.

But your statement of......"That is a good bit above the threshold that Bascik set" has less than zero to do with his statement. It matters not one iota what Basciks stats were or weren't when he pitched. Why interject this?

I meant Bascik set the threshold when he used 4.5 strikeout per outing/9innings. I never meant what he did as a pitcher. 6.8 is significantly above the number Bascik used to guage whether a pitcher struck out enough batters. Bascik's personal stats never came up.

Also, I am responding to what Bascik said and not you personally.

 

[saddles]

I think (I'm guessing) he meant the odds aren't favorable for a long career if the K rate is so low. And, using Brown as example again, his K rate did go up significantly after a few years.

Yes, they went up significantly and he was a very good pitcher for a number of years. He was a jerk, but a very good pitcher.

I am just saying that like Brown, Chi Chi could improve with experience as well. Maybe not to the same extent, but improve significantly nonetheless.

 

[romeo212000]

He can, but I have concerns about Nick's third time through a lineup.

That's true of almost any #5. If he can pitch into the 6th inning every time that will do.

 

[True Rangers Fan]

I am just saying that like Brown, Chi Chi could improve with experience as well. Maybe not to the same extent, but improve significantly nonetheless.

He absolutely could, yes. I'm certainly not writing Chi Chi off - in fact, going into ST I figured he probably was the last man standing against the rest of the competition. But he'll be more successful if he can figure out how to induce more swings and misses. And yeah, that's pretty much true for any pitcher, so it's not that groundbreaking of a point. But it'll help Chi Chi, and that's a priority in my opinion.

 

[saddles]

 

[saddles]

 

[Kelleyman]

I think it was his goal to find a swing and miss pitch. I think extended ABs have hurt him and not allowed him to pitch deep. Of course a sinker ball pitcher Dan get away with less strikeouts

 

[Bmurph]

Televised baseball, sweet! Even if it is Bus and Tom, I can turn the sound off

 

[Bmurph]

Desmond loses first flyball to LF in the sun

 

[donaldson79]

I meant Bascik set the threshold when he used 4.5 strikeout per outing/9innings. I never meant what he did as a pitcher. 6.8 is significantly above the number Bascik used to guage whether a pitcher struck out enough batters. Bascik's personal stats never came up.

Also, I am responding to what Bascik said and not you personally.

10-4......with ya now.

I don't know why I trust a f...ing word which comes outta the 105.3 staff to begin with.