The PAC12 THREAD v.2

[Ironbreaker]

and if you want more

What are the Best Jobs in College Football? - Good Bull Hunting
washington not listed

Remember we are talking about pac12 schools. The author of this blog only lists USC and 0 ahead of UW. duh. They are. He has Stanford as honorable mention and they should be. UCLA doesn't appear on the list either.

But he's welcome to his opinion, as a blogger. :rollseyes:

Ranking All 125 College Football Coaching Jobs for 2013 | AthlonSports.com
UCLA well ahead of UW

At least this article mentions UCLA. Lets examine his pts.

UCLA
Pros: UCLA shares the same built-in recruiting advantages as its cross-town rival USC. The 2000s were relatively lean, but UCLA won or shared three Pac-10 titles in the 1990s and four in the ‘80s. Cons: Life can be tough when you are forced to share a city with one of the elite programs in the nation. And while the Rose Bowl is a beautiful place to play, the facility is 30 miles from campus.
Final Verdict: The Pac-12 is a very good league, but USC and Oregon are the only programs that have enjoyed sustained success in the past 15 years. The right coach can have this program in contention for conference titles on a consistent basis.

UW
Pros: This is a proud program with great tradition. The Huskies won a national title in 1991 and claimed at least a share of five Pac-10 titles from 1990-2000. UW is in a great city (Seattle) and has an SEC-like following when things are going well. Cons: The school has addressed the program’s only significant weakness — facilities — with the $250 million renovation to Husky Stadium. Washington’s in-state recruiting base is solid but lags signficantly behind the four California teams in the Pac-12.
Final Verdict: The past decade has proven that it can be difficult to win at Washington. But this is still a very good job. Is it a great job? Not anymore. But it is still a prestigious program that can attract elite talent. You can win at UW.


Not a great job, but a prestigious program that can attract elite talent. Is this guy on drugs?

UW IS a great job. We have the tradition, we have the facilities, we have a president and an AD that realize the football program accounts for over 85% of athletic revenue. hedges and Gerdering are gone. Football people are here.

We'll also continue to pay our coaches better than most in the pac.

Anyone reading the comments on the two would likely think he had UW rated higher, as it should be. Did he even say anything good about UCLA other than fertile recruiting grounds that they share with USC? No. Not really.

College Football's 25 Most Desirable Coaching Jobs | Bleacher Report
granted its bleacher report but UCLA ahead of UW

Yeah. It is. The bleacher report. Didn't bother with it.

I do appreciate you dug a bit. However I disagree emphatically with those opinions. When you look at what a great football HC job is, UW has it. Do I think it's far superior to UCLA? No. But superior.

Tradition is comparable. Facilities are well ahead in UWs favor. Recruiting, todays a different game but I'll give a slight nod to UCLA even though they have to contend with USC right in their mug. Money, UW will pay more. They just will.

How important is the football program to the school? It's far more important at UW than UCLA.


I know 0regon fans want UW to stay down. But get over it. The people that destroyed this program are gone. People who understand what football is to the University are in place.

Its only a matter of time before the nation realizes what UW people already know. The return is imminent.

 

[Vitamike]

I present facts and all you do is say your opinions are better?

UW has the best venue in the Pac for college football. Granted they can't suck and still fill it, but even a 7 win team has had no problems filling it so what can a decent coach do there? UW has the ability to recruit from their own grounds and poach from all over the NW with really only Oregon as a nearby opponent. UW pays better than most of the rest of the programs in the conference and always have. The location of the school is a draw over much of the rest of the conference outside of LA. Their history is second ONLY to USC in the conference.

Need I really go on?

Pac Conference Championship behind USC

UCLA 17
UW 15

 

[WhiteMamba]

In the long term there is no doubt UW is a better job than Oregon.

Right now Oregon is just flashy. They are not going away, but UW has obvious built in advantages over UW.

I think we tend to sterotype the UCLA football program and that makes the position not as desirable to fans.

 

[asu_08]

2012 3-2 --- W-#16 NEB, #22 ASU & #18 USC. --- L-#8 STAN & #8 STAN

2013 2-3 --- W-#23 NEB & #23 USC. --- L-#13 STAN, #3 ORE & #17 ASU.

So that makes him .500 lifetime (5-5).

I don't believe ASU was ever ranked last season

 

[RegentDenali]

Too much W-L is the factor for those list rankings, but that's typical. Yes, your current success is important and matters, but there are soo many other factors involved.

UCLA floundered under Slick Rick. Mora is doing a superior job with schemes, recruiting, and putting it all together in the field. Kudos for that. The school has a nice recruiting advantage given it's location, even if USC is down the road. But where it lacks big is facilities and football culture. Their facilities are some of the worst of the PAC. The fact they were neglected for so long speaks loudly about it's other problem. Culture. It's a school that still seems to put basketball and other sports above football.
Slick Rick spent his tenure begging them for a facilities upgrade and he got nada from them. And this was a guy who had lots of insider support by at he high level alums.

Yes, UCLA is starting to finally address some of its football facilities issues, but it will take years and lots of gaga. It's absolutely critical because the stadium is not located on campus.

UW has finally started to move past the 6-7 win area. Once in the PAC your team starts winning 8+ games a year, the coach is going be off most talk of a hot seat, well besides USCs extra bloated expectations that PC ushered in.

But the areas UW FB program smokes UCLA is: Facilities. And not just UCLA. Combining the setting, Stadium, football operations, practice, and medical, UW is now the best on the entire west coast. Period. Oregons cred has been greatly elevated thanks to the 100s of millions Uncle Phil has sunk into their facilities, but UW still leaped them with what we have now.

Culture: UW is a football first school. We take pride in bball and the Olympic sports, but football is our passion.

I respect UCLA a lot for their history and tradition. I don't like to speak badly of them. They also have solid academics.
But going forward, UW is the superior coaching situation. And Mora may not take it. He's done great work in 2 years there and has a lot of support. He's ended up a great fit for them as I thought he would. He brings toughness that lacked with the previous regimes. UCLA needs that to succeed these days. But he's not the only candidate. We'll see. Lots of coaching talent out there right now. Whoever coming in inherits a pretty sweet situation with the roster and talent level. Most coaches would kill for these facilities and the culture that you get here.

 

[trojanfan12]

Best decision for his family? Do they have family in Southern California or family members near by? Or is Keith Price just being a dumbass he makes plenty of money lmao! Is he serious?

First of all, Sark is from Southern California, so yeah, there are ties here.

Second, when did you get to decide how much money is "plenty of money" for someone else?

 

[Vitamike]

I just think Ucla has a louzy fan base and home crowd, beaten down stadium. Its not that attractive as it use to be but its still LA.

You can 'think' all you want but dude you just don't get it!

It's the freaking Rose Bowl. It seats 90K+!

I've told you this before, other teams travel well to the Rose Bowl. The Alums from visiting schools circle their calendar for the UCLA game just because it's the Rose Bowl!

Great weather and atmosphere with excellent tailgating. Our tailgates are mostly on the golf course so it's like a huge picnic!

Plus we averaged 68K+ for home games last year, that nearly your capacity!

Have you ever been to the Rose Bowl? Because I don't think you have.

 

[Ironbreaker]

Pac Conference Championship behind USC

UCLA 17
UW 15

You got us on pac titles, UW has more Rose Bowl appearances and wins as Oly pointed out. UW has 1 national championship recognized by the NCAA. I've read that the 1984 Huskies were also recognized as the national champions by the NCAA, however I can't see that on the NCAA site. So I don't know. UCLA has none.

UW was also recognized at least 4 times by other organizations as the national champion. UCLA was recognized by the UPI as national champions in 1954. Lets not forget claiming CFB titles at one time was far more asinine than it is today.

History and tradition consist more of than just conference titles and national championships. UW also has the nations second longest winning streak at 39 games.

Stuff like that.

Once upon a time this was the premiere program in the entire nation. Whats that mean? Not sure when you consider that todays Ivy League schools once dominated cfb as well. When Alabama beat us in the Rose Bowl dubbed the game that changed the south, things started to change across the nations cfb scene.

 

[Vitamike]

I'm not sure if Wiz already replied to this or not but I will anyways. (Had to work on a speech)

1. Sark had a similar comment yes, but Sark didn't have the personal connections to UW that Mora does. Sark was obviously straight up lying. I have to believe Mora really believes it considering he played for UW, coached for UW, and came to Seattle to coach his hometown Seahawks.

2. I think Mora could be a home run coach. He turned around the mediocrity that Slick Rick had going on down there pretty fast. 18-8 in two seasons is pretty good considering UCLA went 10-16 in their previous 2 seasons before Mora. Having the home town boy thing going on also buys him emotional appeal in Seattle. Although there are some slightly better options, for me Mora has the pathos appeal going hardcore. I still root for him to succeed down there at UCLA.

3. Mora plays against Pac-12 competition. DeRuyter plays against glorified HS teams. I'm not opposed to DeRuyter, he is just pretty far down the list for me. Mora is 5-5 against ranked competition. In comparison to 3-7 for Sark in the same timespan. 7-19 total at UW.

As far as UW being Jim Mora's 'dream job' Jim said he was joking the next day and has continued to say all along that he was merely making a joke.

Also if UW wants Jim, it's gonna cost them or Mora another $2.5M for his contract buy out right now or $2M in late January.

 

[Ironbreaker]

As far as UW being Jim Mora's 'dream job' Jim said he was joking the next day and has continued to say all along that he was merely making a joke..

I think the supposed joke was about dropping Atlanta if UW came calling. Not about UW being his dream job.

I think all coaches have their dream job, he's stated on more than one occasion UW is his.


Maybe I'm wrong. I never really dug into what was said exactly and when, but thats how I understood it reading stuff on other sites.

We might not get Mora even if he is our #1 guy. I want him. I don't want to see him bail on UCLA like Sark did up here. But I don't know if that can be avoided.

 

[Vitamike]

it doesnt count when they dont finished ranked. nice try.

when they played they were ranked... that is meaningless. its where they finish

all 5 of those Mora wins you posted are vs teams that didnt finish top 25... Most not even close.

Is this the standard?

You see I wasn't 'trying' anything other than answering your question.

If you go to ESPiN and look up the results that's what you will find.

UCLA 2012 Schedule - Bruins Home and Away - ESPN
UCLA 2013 Schedule - Bruins Home and Away - ESPN

You see your way discounts the impact of injuries and momentum.

They are who they are when you play them.

 

[trojanfan12]

His Southern Cal jimmies arent easily ruslted. But when they are it is because someone bad mouths their coaching choices and or coaches... Even Kiffin.

My first encounter @ cBS with TF12!! was in regards to Kiffin and he swooped in like a shining knight on a knoble steed to defend his honor.

 

[trojanfan12]

Sark better wait a year before running anything uptempo.

 

[Vitamike]

You got us on pac titles, UW has more Rose Bowl appearances and wins as Oly pointed out. UW has 1 national championship recognized by the NCAA. I've read that the 1984 Huskies were also recognized as the national champions by the NCAA, however I can't see that on the NCAA site. So I don't know. UCLA has none.

UW was also recognized at least 4 times by other organizations as the national champion. UCLA was recognized by the UPI as national champions in 1954. Lets not forget claiming CFB titles at one time was far more asinine than it is today.

History and tradition consist more of than just conference titles and national championships. UW also has the nations second longest winning streak at 39 games.

Stuff like that.

Once upon a time this was the premiere program in the entire nation. Whats that mean? Not sure when you consider that todays Ivy League schools once dominated cfb as well. When Alabama beat us in the Rose Bowl dubbed the game that changed the south, things started to change across the nations cfb scene.

I fully understand and respect Husky Football history. I was just responding to Wiz's comment below....

I present facts and all you do is say your opinions are better?

UW has the best venue in the Pac for college football. Granted they can't suck and still fill it, but even a 7 win team has had no problems filling it so what can a decent coach do there? UW has the ability to recruit from their own grounds and poach from all over the NW with really only Oregon as a nearby opponent. UW pays better than most of the rest of the programs in the conference and always have. The location of the school is a draw over much of the rest of the conference outside of LA. Their history is second ONLY to USC in the conference.

Need I really go on?

When you put words like 'only' in caps, then one might conclude that they would at least be second to USC in PAC Conference titles, no?

Besides y'all had close to a 10 year head start and got two of those conference championships before we were even added to the PCC.

So to put this stat on equal footing, from 1925 when both schools were members of the PCC, it's more like...

PAC Conference Championships behind USC

UCLA 17
UW 13

Thanks IB for helping me clear that up!

 

[trojanfan12]

With due respect to Vita, the UCLA job is NOT as attractive as some of these Ducks fans are trying to make it out to be.

First off, it's like being the head basketball coach at USC, there is always that 800 lb. gorilla across town that you have to contend with. Sure you can get the occasional coach who can recruit and coach well enough to knock the other team down once in awhile, but any kind of sustained success is very difficult to come by.

Second, it is typically one of the lower paying jobs. The Bruins "broke their bank" for Mora and it placed him in the middle of the pack as far as salary for coaches in the conference. I hear that traffic in and out of Westwood is a nightmare and only the head coach can actually afford to live close enough to have less than about an hour and a half commute (and we're talking only about 20 miles away).

Third, UCLA is, was and always will be about basketball first. This makes it difficult to consistently recruit top football talent. Why play 2nd fiddle to basketball when you can go to USC and be the BMOC because you're on the football team? Mora has recruited well while USC is under schollie reductions, but how many of those players does he still get if USC has a full compliment of schollies to offer?

I don't know if Mora WILL leave UCLA for UW, but there are alot of reasons for him to strongly consider it beyond his obvious ties to the school.

 

[Vitamike]

With due respect to Vita, the UCLA job is NOT as attractive as some of these Ducks fans are trying to make it out to be.

First off, it's like being the head basketball coach at USC, there is always that 800 lb. gorilla across town that you have to contend with. Sure you can get the occasional coach who can recruit and coach well enough to knock the other team down once in awhile, but any kind of sustained success is very difficult to come by.

Second, it is typically one of the lower paying jobs. The Bruins "broke their bank" for Mora and it placed him in the middle of the pack as far as salary for coaches in the conference. I hear that traffic in and out of Westwood is a nightmare and only the head coach can actually afford to live close enough to have less than about an hour and a half commute (and we're talking only about 20 miles away).

Third, UCLA is, was and always will be about basketball first. This makes it difficult to consistently recruit top football talent. Why play 2nd fiddle to basketball when you can go to USC and be the BMOC because you're on the football team? Mora has recruited well while USC is under schollie reductions, but how many of those players does he still get if USC has a full compliment of schollies to offer?

I don't know if Mora WILL leave UCLA for UW, but there are alot of reasons for him to strongly consider it beyond his obvious ties to the school.

Terrible hyperbole, but a good laugh anyways!

 

[Vitamike]

Look I'm not gonna moan, piss and cry if Mora leaves. I just think there is enough here for him to stay. Then again, it could really come down to how he feels about Hundley's return.

Brett could certainly benefit from another year at the college ranks however the all mighty $$ looms large!

IMO if Brett stays, so does Jim. If not than it's anybody's best guess. Also I believe Brett makes more $$$ in the NFL long term by staying another year or two as a Bruin.

 

[trojanfan12]

Terrible hyperbole, but a good laugh anyways!

Terrible hyperbole? How so? It's a basketball first school compared to a football first school. If I'm a basketball coach or player and I'm choosing between USC or UCLA, I'm going to UCLA because of the emphasis placed on the sport. The opposite is true if I'm a football coach or player.

Sure, there are the occasional exceptions, but generally speaking that's how it plays out.

 

[trojanfan12]

Look I'm not gonna moan, piss and cry if Mora leaves. I just think there is enough here for him to stay. Then again, it could really come down to how he feels about Hundley's return.

Brett could certainly benefit from another year at the college ranks however the all mighty $$ looms large!

IMO if Brett stays, so does Jim. If not than it's anybody's best guess. Also I believe Brett makes more $$$ in the NFL long term by staying another year or two as a Bruin.

If Mora is as smart as I think he is, he's not going to base a career decision on one kid. That would be crazy. You're talking about 1-2 years of having that player vs. the entire rest of your coaching career.

If UW is truly a "dream job" for Mora, why would he risk missing the opportunity to take it to stay with a kid that's only going to be there for another season or 2 anyway (if that)? Mora may take that into consideration, but it won't be any kind of deciding factor.

It's not like UW is going to hold the job open until Mora decides he wants to go there. He may never get another opportunity to coach there.

 

[Ironbreaker]

Look I'm not gonna moan, piss and cry if Mora leaves. I just think there is enough here for him to stay. Then again, it could really come down to how he feels about Hundley's return.

Brett could certainly benefit from another year at the college ranks however the all mighty $$ looms large!

IMO if Brett stays, so does Jim. If not than it's anybody's best guess. Also I believe Brett makes more $$$ in the NFL long term by staying another year or two as a Bruin.

Just listened to a Hundley interview on Rome. Said he's staying as of now but if Mora leaves he said that changes things, and he said it in a way that totally sounded like if Mora leaves I'm gone.