THE PAC 12 THREAD v.3

[Olyduck]

Indiana, Kentucky, Duke - you're talking basketball schools that scare football players away. I don't know if either has ever won the conference in football or ever will.

and Iowa State and Vandy and Wake Forest and Purdue

 

[nddulac]

Yeah, he wasn't a clear failure from the start, but I do remember lurking around the CBS forums (before I went all in with this message board thing) and seeing plenty Notre Dame fans who were thrilled to move on.

I didn't like the way Notre Dame moved on. I think that when you sign a guy to a contract, you should honor it. But alas - as in many cases, Notre Dame doesnt give a bronze, let alone golden, dome about what I think.

That said, it was clear that Tyrone Willingham was not performing at the level that was expected of him. So, had they honored his contract, he still would have been fired in the sense that his contract would not have been renewed (ala Gerry Faust.)

 

[trojanfan12]

I didn't like the way Notre Dame moved on. I think that when you sign a guy to a contract, you should honor it. But alas - as in many cases, Notre Dame doesnt give a bronze, let alone golden, dome about what I think.

That said, it was clear that Tyrone Willingham was not performing at the level that was expected of him. So, had they honored his contract, he still would have been fired in the sense that his contract would not have been renewed (ala Gerry Faust.)

It's kind of weird how things fell apart on him. It can be argued that the foundation for the success that Stanford has had under Harbaugh and now Shaw was established by Willingham. He goes 10-3 in his first season at ND and it all kind of unraveled from there. Hasn't even been an assistant coach since 2008.

 

[socaljim242]

It's kind of weird how things fell apart on him. It can be argued that the foundation for the success that Stanford has had under Harbaugh and now Shaw was established by Willingham. He goes 10-3 in his first season at ND and it all kind of unraveled from there. Hasn't even been an assistant coach since 2008.

You're right he did do well at stanford and that first year at ND but somewhere along the line he lost the passion. You could see it in his body language and it showed in the play of his teams. They weren't prepared and his lack of recruiting killed him in the end.

 

[nddulac]

It's kind of weird how things fell apart on him. It can be argued that the foundation for the success that Stanford has had under Harbaugh and now Shaw was established by Willingham. He goes 10-3 in his first season at ND and it all kind of unraveled from there. Hasn't even been an assistant coach since 2008.

I don't know. I think the Buddy Teevens/Walt Harris years pretty much ruined anything anyone had ever done there. Remember 2005? Stanford managed to lose games to three different campuses of the University of California! (All three times in their own stadium.)

 

[Wamu]

but I also mean look at the other conferences. there have been a few changes with Duke and Baylor moving up but when was the last time Indiana won Big 10?
Has Iowa State ever won Big XII?
Vandy or Kentucky won the SEC?
And while Duke has been doing well thy still havent won the ACC.

From what I found...


-Indiana last won the BigTen outright in 1945
-Iowa State has never won the Big XII
-Kentucky won the SEC in 1976, Vandy never
-duke shared the conference crown w/ Virginia in 1989

 

[Wamu]

I didn't like the way Notre Dame moved on. I think that when you sign a guy to a contract, you should honor it. But alas - as in many cases, Notre Dame doesnt give a bronze, let alone golden, dome about what I think.

That said, it was clear that Tyrone Willingham was not performing at the level that was expected of him. So, had they honored his contract, he still would have been fired in the sense that his contract would not have been renewed (ala Gerry Faust.)

...Gerry Faust. He was @ Akron U. when I went to school there.

 

[nddulac]

...Gerry Faust. He was @ Akron U. when I went to school there.

Gerry Faust (not unlike Tyrone Willingham) was a good man. A bad coach, but a good man.

 

[Wamu]

Gerry Faust (not unlike Tyrone Willingham) was a good man. A bad coach, but a good man.

Don't know very much about Willingham other than he was the HC @ Washington & ND. And I agree about Gerry, he is/was very well liked. Helluva HS coach though.

 

[nddulac]

Don't know very much about Willingham other than he was the HC @ Washington & ND. And I agree about Gerry, he is/was very well liked. Helluva HS coach though.

He was indeed very successful at Moeller in Cincinnati. But then he moved on to Notre Dame and discovered that other colleges got to recruit too!

Actually, his problems at Notre Dame stemmed from two main issues. 1) he wanted to be every player's best friend, and B) he thought that "college athletes" would have a self-motivated work ethic. So he would tell his linemen to go to the weight room and work on upper-body strength, and they would head to Corby's and work on 12-oz. curls. And by the time he had figured this out, he had lost any respect he ever had from the players - which is always a recipe for disaster.

 

[OregonDucks]

I applaud Gary Andersen.

He is going out there and offering some big time guys. 4 and 5 star recruits. IMO that is awesome, good for him.

Riley would offer your 1-3 star recruits and nothing more, grabbing local HS talent that wouldn't get looks from out of state.

Andersen on the other hand is going for elite players. Will he get them? Probably not, but at least he is trying.

 

[SUBuddha]

It's kind of weird how things fell apart on him. It can be argued that the foundation for the success that Stanford has had under Harbaugh and now Shaw was established by Willingham. He goes 10-3 in his first season at ND and it all kind of unraveled from there. Hasn't even been an assistant coach since 2008.

To be fair, Stanford got a new admissions chair near the end of Ty's tenure that did not like athletics and actually said to Teevens "Sports will no longer count as an extra curricular". This hurt not only football but other sports. That said Buddy and Walt were horrible coaches that did not get the Stanford brand.

In talking to players from Ty's era, he had a definite schtick that only flew with a certain type of recruit (elite academic types) and it came off as corny even to them, so no wonder he struggled at ND and UW. Be honest ND is a good academic institution but it is not, and never will be, a Stanford level school. The only thing he did right at UW was improve the horrendous graduation rates of the tail end of the James and Lambright era.

 

[seahawksfan234]

To be fair, Stanford got a new admissions chair near the end of Ty's tenure that did not like athletics and actually said to Teevens "Sports will no longer count as an extra curricular". This hurt not only football but other sports. That said Buddy and Walt were horrible coaches that did not get the Stanford brand.

In talking to players from Ty's era, he had a definite schtick that only flew with a certain type of recruit (elite academic types) and it came off as corny even to them, so no wonder he struggled at ND and UW. Be honest ND is a good academic institution but it is not, and never will be, a Stanford level school. The only thing he did right at UW was improve the horrendous graduation rates of the tail end of the James and Lambright era.

Personally I don't care about graduation rates. Most of these kids are here to play football, not get an education, and that applies at most schools.

 

[bksballer89]

what happened to Mamba

 

[trojanfan12]

what happened to Mamba

In before @BeaverShaver says "He drowned in a pool of Huskies tears."

 

[nddulac]

Be honest ND is a good academic institution but it is not, and never will be, a Stanford level school.

This is actually true. Notre Dame will actually fail a student for not mastering the material in a course. Stanford is a champion of the "gentleman's C."

 

[trojanfan12]

The smart guys is fightin'.

 

[4down20]

This is actually true. Notre Dame will actually fail a student for not mastering the material in a course. Stanford is a champion of the "gentleman's C."

Notre Dame's coach said something jarring (and refreshing) about player academics - SBNation.com

I think we recognized that all of my football players are at risk. All of them, really. Honestly, I don't know that any of our players would get into the school by themselves right now, with the academic standards the way they are. Maybe one or two of our players that are on scholarship.

 

[TheLonestarDUCK]

This is actually true. Notre Dame will actually fail a student for not mastering the material in a course. Stanford is a champion of the "gentleman's C."

A Gentlemam's C at Stanford is an A at most schools including ND

 

[socaljim242]

Some ND fans seem to have the illusion that ND football players are on some level academically as the students there.Kelly told it like it is. Remember Manti Teo who would have never been able to get into a junior college if he wasn't a great player was somehow was honored for academics there when he admittedly spent most of the nights his senior year on the phone with Bruce Jenner.