THE MASTERS 2019.

[Montalban]

My first response to that was the same thing. The reason I brought it up is because the club pro that gives me lessons said they did a survey and the average age on the course was like 55. On one side of the coin it's good that older people have a thing they can go out and do that keeps them busy and in shape. On the other side of things (his side) he was saying that this is bad news for him because this bodes very bad long term for people that do what he does. And revenue are requisites for golf courses. They're expensive to operate.

The "head in the cellphone" generation cannot spend the 4 hours it takes to play a round of golf. Their attention span is way to short. They can't be away from their cell phone, facebook or instagram that long. It would destroy them.

 

[gohusk]

Golf is tough...tour players make it look easy...I know a lot of the guys I played with 20+ yrs ago that may have gotten the bug from Tiger's first wave...I'm hearing all kinds of stuff as to why they're not playing now...kids, finances, don't have time anymore for 5-6 hours away from the house...one of the more honest ones I heard...hit a wall, couldn't break 90, 100, and just didn't want to put in the work to get better.

I think many players started too far back (tees) and could never really learn how to play the game because they spent most of the time looking for tee shots.

Yeah, hitting from the right tees is critical. Par 3 courses disappearing really hurts it as well. There's one in Seattle that I play at that's perfect. They have one hole that's 300, another that's 200, good contour to the course and the other 7 are 160 and closer. It's in a great location so it's always packed and they're constantly doing putting/chipping classes. But just about all the other ones here have disappeared.

But that's my skewed view of the sport in the PNW. All the rain up here doesn't help out much either. But the sports always been about country club types or good ole boys from the south. I don't think it ever really picked up too much with the west coast kids from the suburbs.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

Yeah, hitting from the right tees is critical. Par 3 courses disappearing really hurts it as well. There's one in Seattle that I play at that's perfect. They have one hole that's 300, another that's 200, good contour to the course and the other 7 are 160 and closer. It's in a great location so it's always packed and they're constantly doing putting/chipping classes. But just about all the other ones here have disappeared.

But that's my skewed view of the sport in the PNW. All the rain up here doesn't help out much either. But the sports always been about country club types or good ole boys from the south. I don't think it ever really picked up too much with the west coast kids from the suburbs.

I remember when I started the game...red tees were considered the women's tee and no one I played with early on wanted to play from there. A lot of newbies were playing from the blue tees because that's where their buddies played from....making an already difficult sport that much tougher.

Agree on the par 3 tracks, and executive tracks closing...there are still several execs around, and two nice par 3s in the area.

A couple of weeks ago my buddy and I played and he's 65 y/o now...standing back at the blue tees...I said we're playing the white tees...you don't play much now, and you're damn near 70, when do you intend to move up? We were paired with two guys that may not have been newbies but they had some godawful swings...they were happy we chose the white tees....in truth they should've been hitting from red.

 

[redseat]

All you need to do is to look at attendance at events Tiger is at compared to when he is not. Also, when he is in contention and when he is not.

Tiger could have a 6:30 TEE time teeing off the 6th hole in Norton (Farthest away from beginning) and he'd had more fans there to see him tee off then there would be for 20 groups behind him

 

[Wazmankg]

I'm not saying he's a bad thing. Increased interest is a good start. What the courses need is sustained interest of players. And no player in the PGA is capable of helping that. It has to happen at the driving ranges and courses.

I agree, but there are several barriers that will continue to limit golf's appeal, cost and time commitment being the biggest. I've heard some talk about 6 hole rounds to mitigate the time factor, but Idk whether that's gotten off the ground.. and how many golfers only want to play 6 holes.

Also, golf is hard - Unless someone is a natural it takes a lot of time and practice to get to the point where they're hitting the ball well enough to enjoy themselves. It's no fun not being able to get it airborne and/or hitting it sideways regularly and having to constantly chase your mistakes into the woods, weeds, water, etc.

Also the newbies I just described really are not welcome on most golf courses. Officially they are, but for the others out there playing they just get in the way, slow things down, are generally unaware of the etiquette .. in short they negatively effect the experience of their fellow players. That's not the case with most other activities. If I'm a crappy bowler, nobody cares but me. If I can't hit a golf ball, it often affects those around me.

The notion that Tiger was going to transform golf into a sport that everyone plays was always fool's gold. But he did help elevate its status among many who wouldn't have been otherwise inclined.

 

[gohusk]

I remember when I started the game...red tees were considered the women's tee and no one I played with early on wanted to play from there. A lot of newbies were playing from the blue tees because that's where their buddies played from....making an already difficult sport that much tougher.

Agree on the par 3 tracks, and executive tracks closing...there are still several execs around, and two nice par 3s in the area.

A couple of weeks ago my buddy and I played and he's 65 y/o now...standing back at the blue tees...I said we're playing the white tees...you don't play much now, and you're damn near 70, when do you intend to move up? We were paired with two guys that may not have been newbies but they had some godawful swings...they were happy we chose the white tees....in truth they should've been hitting from red.

I think everybody's guilty of wrecking a scorecard every now and again doing things like pulling their ego out of the bag instead of the club they should be hitting and such. That's why I keep bashing these driver commercials. I've golfed with maybe 2 guys that can hit fairways really consistently going 280+ and they were both total jocks and played their entire lives. Figure out how far you can hit them and manage the course. I was playing with this one guy and he played real short. He was about 200 with his driver and 170 with his fairway wood. But he was dead center in the fairway every time, was accurate as hell with that fairway wood, and could chip, pitch, and putt like a monster. Dude was close to 70 years old and he was at 2 under until the 16th hole when his body started getting the better of him. There's a lot more to the game than distance.

 

[Hang_On_Sloopy08]

I think everybody's guilty of wrecking a scorecard every now and again doing things like pulling their ego out of the bag instead of the club they should be hitting and such. That's why I keep bashing these driver commercials. I've golfed with maybe 2 guys that can hit fairways really consistently going 280+ and they were both total jocks and played their entire lives. Figure out how far you can hit them and manage the course. I was playing with this one guy and he played real short. He was about 200 with his driver and 170 with his fairway wood. But he was dead center in the fairway every time, was accurate as hell with that fairway wood, and could chip, pitch, and putt like a monster. Dude was close to 70 years old and he was at 2 under until the 16th hole when his body started getting the better of him. There's a lot more to the game than distance.

I'm as critical as anyone when it comes to the USGA but they had it right when they were pushing the "Play It Forward" initiative. That lasted maybe a summer. They need to bring it back. Golf isn't meant to be 5.5 hours of hell. There's too many high handicappers playing well outside their comfort zone on the back tees. That's like me being a beginner skier and going down black diamonds all day. It's just going to be hell and ruins it for everyone else. But everyone is obsessed with distance and many aren't good enough to be pulling driver on every hole. I'm a bomber and scratch golfer, but just until recently at 33 years old I finally found out golf is easier to play from in the fairway lol. I've been traveling around watching a lot of tour golf the past few years, and it was eye opening to see how many times those guys left driver in the bag to favor the fairway. These guys are crushing driver irons off many tees now. I've started hitting a lot more 3 woods and 2 hybrids, and wouldn't you believe it my scores are going down.

 

[RTR...USN (ret)]

I'm as critical as anyone when it comes to the USGA but they had it right when they were pushing the "Play It Forward" initiative. That lasted maybe a summer. They need to bring it back. Golf isn't meant to be 5.5 hours of hell. There's too many high handicappers playing well outside their comfort zone on the back tees. That's like me being a beginner skier and going down black diamonds all day. It's just going to be hell and ruins it for everyone else. But everyone is obsessed with distance and many aren't good enough to be pulling driver on every hole. I'm a bomber and scratch golfer, but just until recently at 33 years old I finally found out golf is easier to play from in the fairway lol. I've been traveling around watching a lot of tour golf the past few years, and it was eye opening to see how many times those guys left driver in the bag to favor the fairway. These guys are crushing driver irons off many tees now. I've started hitting a lot more 3 woods and 2 hybrids, and wouldn't you believe it my scores are going down.

Amen Sloopy! I'm an 8 handicap. I CAN play from the blues, but choose to play from the whites. When I'm playing with my older friends, I play from the senior tees with them. It changes the game, and really makes me hit shots and clubs I'm not used to hitting. I have to play the holes from the "green to the tee". I hit whatever club I need to off the tee in order to be about 100 to 125 out. It has really helped my course management.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

I think everybody's guilty of wrecking a scorecard every now and again doing things like pulling their ego out of the bag instead of the club they should be hitting and such. That's why I keep bashing these driver commercials. I've golfed with maybe 2 guys that can hit fairways really consistently going 280+ and they were both total jocks and played their entire lives. Figure out how far you can hit them and manage the course. I was playing with this one guy and he played real short. He was about 200 with his driver and 170 with his fairway wood. But he was dead center in the fairway every time, was accurate as hell with that fairway wood, and could chip, pitch, and putt like a monster. Dude was close to 70 years old and he was at 2 under until the 16th hole when his body started getting the better of him. There's a lot more to the game than distance.

My father in law is probably the best golfer I personally know...shot 68 twice in tournament play.

The 1st time I tee up with him, I’d only been playing about 6 yrs...some 80s but mostly a 90s player...he was no longer playing like he was when he shot these scores but still active in the game. On the range I’m watching a few of his shots and thinking to myself this guy shot 68?

We tee off and after about 5 holes, he’s -1, hasn’t missed a FW or green, 9 holes...still -1....then we play the back and finally had a bogey on like 15, finished with +2 74.

Much like this guy you’re talking about 220 off the tee with a low fade...fairway after fairway...his irons could move both ways but accurate probably hit 14 GIR that day. He said he hadn’t played in a month.

 

[Hang_On_Sloopy08]

Amen Sloopy! I'm an 8 handicap. I CAN play from the blues, but choose to play from the whites. When I'm playing with my older friends, I play from the senior tees with them. It changes the game, and really makes me hit shots and clubs I'm not used to hitting. I have to play the holes from the "green to the tee". I hit whatever club I need to off the tee in order to be about 100 to 125 out. It has really helped my course management.

Yup, you get it. Same thing here, on my Wednesday golf group we've got older guys and higher handicappers. So we all play the senior tees. I doubt you've ever played OSU's Scarlet course but it's a hard ass course. First few times playing that far up I would try over powering the course playing so far up and wouldn't shoot any better scores than I did from the back tees. It would just get me in trouble. So playing it way forward it's actually taught me too a lot about course management. Just get it in the fairway by any means necessary, and by that I'm now thinking which side of the fairway I'm trying to hit and how far back given the pin locations.

 

[RTR...USN (ret)]

Yup, you get it. Same thing here, on my Wednesday golf group we've got older guys and higher handicappers. So we all play the senior tees. I doubt you've ever played OSU's Scarlet course but it's a hard ass course. First few times playing that far up I would try over powering the course playing so far up and wouldn't shoot any better scores than I did from the back tees. It would just get me in trouble. So playing it way forward it's actually taught me too a lot about course management. Just get it in the fairway by any means necessary, and by that I'm now thinking which side of the fairway I'm trying to hit and how far back given the pin locations.

My favourite wedge is my approach wedge and a smooth swing is going to carry 125. If I lay up to that point, I'm confident I'm putting the ball on the green. I'm not good enough to pick my spot on the green, but I like my chances at that distance.

 

[Hang_On_Sloopy08]

My favourite wedge is my approach wedge and a smooth swing is going to carry 125. If I lay up to that point, I'm confident I'm putting the ball on the green. I'm not good enough to pick my spot on the green, but I like my chances at that distance.

While I'm good enough to pick my spot on the green, I still struggle mightily with distance control on my wedges. But more and more if I can control tempo and just smooth a wedge I'm much better offer. It's so hard sometimes to take it back three quarters. What feels three quarters is still a full swing, if I try going halfway back (which ends up three quarters) I don't feel like I have enough momentum for the distance I want to carry lol. But I'm learning a nice easy swing no matter how far I go back goes very straight, and usually much better distance control.

 

[RTR...USN (ret)]

While I'm good enough to pick my spot on the green, I still struggle mightily with distance control on my wedges. But more and more if I can control tempo and just smooth a wedge I'm much better offer. It's so hard sometimes to take it back three quarters. What feels three quarters is still a full swing, if I try going halfway back (which ends up three quarters) I don't feel like I have enough momentum for the distance I want to carry lol. But I'm learning a nice easy swing no matter how far I go back goes very straight, and usually much better distance control.

You are a MUCH more accomplished golfer than this old fart, but I know my yardages with my wedges (I carry 4). Where I get in the most trouble is trying to either "take a little off", or carry it "Just a little more". I am more consistent between clubs if I take the longer club, and choke up an inch and swing the same speed. Distance isn't exact, but I have better results this way. A longer putt is better than chipping out of the rough lol!

 

[GNG]

Also, golf is hard - Unless someone is a natural it takes a lot of time and practice to get to the point where they're hitting the ball well enough to enjoy themselves. It's no fun not being able to get it airborne and/or hitting it sideways regularly and having to constantly chase your mistakes into the woods, weeds, water, etc.

My dad taught me to golf at the tender age of 8 and it really came natural to me but I still went to the range and practiced.

 

[Edonidd]

So, in your world, that makes it OK? I could go on and talk about the initial reasons as to why I dislike the guy as a person - his on course behaviour that was routinely covered up because he is Tiger Woods, but it's pretty clear from your response that your line in the sand is clearly different than mine.

No, I don't excuse him of anything. But I don't know anything about their relationship beyond him cheating on her and her trying to kill him with a golf club. But I don't hate him for it. I also don't hate Tom Brady for leaving his pregnant girlfriend. I don't hate Kobe, Magic, Jordan, Lebron, Carmelo, etc for cheating on their wives. I'm more likely to dislike a guy who fucks his own teammates wife, and theres tons of those rumors out there. Theres even rumors one of Lebrons teammates was fucking his momma. Tiger's slow of blonde waitress and hostesses is pretty funny, but so was Frank Giffords love of airline stewardesses, and one of the all time Hollywood cheating scandals was Frank Giffard sleeping with Johnny Carsons wife. Hell I was at work the other day and all the wimen folk were literally crying after watching the thing about Dwayne Wade's retirement, one even said they wished more athletes were as good of a role model and human being as Wade. I didn't have the heart to tell her about the baby momma he has outside of his marriage.

I'm sure there are people who legitimately don't like Tiger. But most of what I see is just people mad that he's a black golfer and they've never forgave him for that. And that was before he started sleeping with the white women too.

 

[Batman]

Golf is tough...tour players make it look easy...I know a lot of the guys I played with 20+ yrs ago that may have gotten the bug from Tiger's first wave...I'm hearing all kinds of stuff as to why they're not playing now...kids, finances, don't have time anymore for 5-6 hours away from the house...one of the more honest ones I heard...hit a wall, couldn't break 90, 100, and just didn't want to put in the work to get better.

I think many players started too far back (tees) and could never really learn how to play the game because they spent most of the time looking for tee shots.

Good post. Hits home.
Players want to get better. They want to see their scores go down. The best way for that to happen(for high handicappers) is to practice their short game. But its very hard to find a place to practice short play at many course. No chipping areas and high fees for the driving range. Who wants to pay $9 to hit 30 practice chips? I used to play the course during slow times just so I could hit some extra balls from 100 yds in and from the sand without holding up people behind me.

 

[SJ76]

Whole lot of crying over Tiger in here.

Whether you like him or not, it was a great Masters and good for the game.

 

[Montalban]

Greatly increased interest in the sport, which is what Tiger brings to the table, is an unqualified positive. How others, who work in and manage various aspects of the sport, handle that unqualified positive is another matter.

I hate to sound elitist, but I don't want those people around. Woods has brought the game to the average Joe, yes, but that's not necessarily a good thing. I can honestly say, back in the 70s and 80s we all used to say "You never meet a dickhead on the golf course". You cannot say that anymore. There all kinds of drunken fools out there now and club throwers. Its really a shame. I see and hear about people getting in fights on the golf course all the time now. I blame that on Baldy's influence on the game.

 

[Montalban]

Good post. Hits home.
Players want to get better. They want to see their scores go down. The best way for that to happen(for high handicappers) is to practice their short game. But its very hard to find a place to practice short play at many course. No chipping areas and high fees for the driving range. Who wants to pay $9 to hit 30 practice chips? I used to play the course during slow times just so I could hit some extra balls from 100 yds in and from the sand without holding up people behind me.

And I think playing from the tees that suit you makes for a much more fun experience. When I go to a course I look for tees where on the par 4s if I hit a good drive I have a 7 iron or less left to the green. Everything else seems to fall into place when I do that. The 5s and 3s seem to fall in line as reasonable lengths.

 

[Montalban]

Whole lot of crying over Tiger in here.

Whether you like him or not, it was a great Masters and good for the game.

The Masters is always great. Its the greatest sporting event in the world. Somehow it comes down to the 18th hole on Sunday every year. Its amazing. Having said that, Woods' Sunday round was not spectacular or even great. It was a solid performance with little risk or little need for flair or brilliant shots. His round was solid but not spectacular as the knob gobblers on TV are trying to make it out to be.