Texas Rangers 2022 - 2023 Offseason Thread

[Kelleyman]

I would think an improved bullpen would be a big selling point when trying to convince starting pitchers to sign here.

Yeah I would hate to be a SP being pulled with men on base trying to protect a fragile lead without an adequate pen to back me up

 

[saddles]

Oh I don't think money should hinder them in any way. But it's also not my money, and if they've got a self-imposed limit to how much they want to spend, then I can see why they are choosing to wrap up a SP target (even just one of them) first before making any other moves.

EDIT: not saying that is what's happening, but it's an approach that does have logic I can understand.

Refresh my memory, did they sign Gray before Seager and Semien last year? Or, was it afterwards? I know they were very close together.

 

[saddles]

Yeah I would hate to a SP being pulled with men on base trying to protect a fragile lead without an adequate pen to back me up

Yep. I just think if they signed one of the better relievers left and one other good one, that that would make a huge difference to DeGrom, Rodon, Verlander or Senga.

 

[WilltheThrill]

Yes. That will not make them much better than they were last year.

Exactly this. That’s a weak rotation. Perez and Gray won’t be any better than they were last season, and there’s a chance they could be worse. I personally believe the “new” Perez is the real deal and can at least come close to replicating his numbers from last year. But I also think that is likely max performance Perez and at the very top end of his range of outcomes, with regression also possible. So I think it’s fair to say he might be a top of the rotation guy, but to count on that as a done deal is a bit risky. And Bassitt is an ok #2 type guy, with Gray as more of a #3/4 type and Odorizzi and Dunning as back of rotation filler. Point is, nobody in that rotation is scaring anyone and nobody has any real upside.

I either want someone who is currently dominant (deGrom, Verlander), someone who has a very high ceiling (Rodon), or someone who potentially has a bright future (Senga). A bunch of #2-4 types don’t really move the needle that much, either for this year or for building for the future. Perez and Bassitt are fine enough for what they are, but they wouldn’t stand a chance against any Astros duo, Ray/Gilbert/Castillo, Cole/Severino, Bieber/McKenzie, Manoah/Gausman, or McClanahan/Glasnow in the playoffs.

 

[saddles]

Perez and Bassitt are fine enough for what they are, but they wouldn’t stand a chance against any Astros duo, Ray/Gilbert/Castillo, Cole/Severino, Bieber/McKenzie, Manoah/Gausman, or McClanahan/Glasnow in the playoffs.

That is true, but I do not think we are beating the Astros with any of those top 4 starting pitchers instead of Bassitt, either. We are so far behind the Astros in starting pitching, relief pitching, and hitting that we are not going to come close to them this year. I want one of those guys too, but if we match up against the Astrros in the postseason neither of them will get us close to beating them. Closer, to some degree, but not close.

So, if we don't get a prize starting pitcher this offseason, we still have a good bit of time to do so before we can reasonably have a chance against Houston. By then, one of those top pitchers we need could be named, Rocker, Leiter, and/or White. Another one could be named Darvish. There will be other free agents and possible trade acquisitions in the interim as well.

 

[WilltheThrill]

I honestly expect the Rangers to make multiple major splashes. As I’ve said before, it’s not necessarily what I would do. But I have a very, very hard time believing that Bruce Bochy and Mike Maddux would both come out of a cozy retirement to lead the Texas Rangers of all teams just because Chris Young is a nice and smart guy who talked them into it. Both of those guys have been raving about how excited they are about this opportunity (way more than the typical platitudes new hires offer up). These are two seasoned vets who are considered at the top of their profession, and they’re not leaving retirement for the likes of Jake Odorizzi, Martin Perez, Dane Dunning, and Glen Otto. I think they were promised truck loads of cash being splashed and multiple top free agents and/or trades (perhaps both pitchers and hitters) coming in this off-season.

This off-season reminds me a lot of last off-season when we were listed as a probable suitor for maybe one shortstop (Story was often listed as who we would wind up with). But then we blew the doors off the place and landed arguably the top 2 SS on the market (with apologies to Correa). I see us listed as maybe signing deGrom or maybe Rodon or maybe Verlander, or maybe Senga. And on several sites I see us listed as underdogs to the Giants, Yankees, Dodgers, Astros, etc for the aces. But money talks, and national reporters typically under-estimate our chances. I think Buster Olney has it right- he thinks the Rangers will sign 2 of the group of deGrom, Verlander, Rodon, and Senga, and I honestly don’t think it’s that big of a stretch.

 

[WilltheThrill]

That is true, but I do not think we are beating the Astros with any of those top 4 starting pitchers instead of Bassitt, either. We are so far behind the Astros in starting pitching, relief pitching, and hitting that we are not going to come close to them this year. I want one of those guys too, but if we match up against the Astrros in the postseason neither of them will get us close to beating them. Closer to some degree, but not close.

So, if we don't get a prize starting pitcher this offseason, we still have a good bit of time to do so before we can reasonably have a chance against Houston. By then, one of those top pitchers we need could be named, Rocker, Leiter, and/or White. Another one could be named Darvish. There will be other free agents and possible trade acquisitions in the interim as well.

Don’t get me wrong. I agree with everything you said, and I think that SHOULD be their approach. But, I also get the sense that Ray Davis wants to win this year. It’s pretty unrealistic, but I think that is the goal. So they have to have at least 1 if not
2 signings to have any hope of that happening.

 

[saddles]

Don’t get me wrong. I agree with everything you said, and I think that SHOULD be their approach. But, I also get the sense that Ray Davis wants to win this year. It’s pretty unrealistic, but I think that is the goal. So they have to have at least 1 if not
2 signings to have any hope of that happening.

I think they will make sure they get one of the top starters. I am just not sold on them being able to sign 2 of them.

If I remember correctly, they did say that they wouldn't make it all the way to the top this offseason, or something similar to that, during one of the press conferences. They most certainly want to be competitive again though.

 

[True Rangers Fan]

Refresh my memory, did they sign Gray before Seager and Semien last year? Or, was it afterwards? I know they were very close together.

Rangers sign RHP Gray to 4-year deal

All on same day (what a DAY!!) but Gray came after them.

 

[saddles]

I will say this. If the Rangers do spend $70-80 AAV on starting pitching the rest of this offseason, in addition to signing Perez, then I think the strategy to take Leiter, Rocker and Porter was a mistake. We had the chance of getting a very good hitter instead of Rocker and we went with Rocker instead. I know you can trade pitching, but you very rarely get the same level of quality back in trade than if they had simply drafted a hitter to eventually put into the lineup.

 

[Kelleyman]

I will say this. If the Rangers do spend $70-80 AAV on starting pitching the rest of this offseason, in addition to signing Perez, then I think the strategy to take Leiter, Rocker and Porter was a mistake. We had the chance of getting a very good hitter instead of Rocker and we went with Rocker instead. I know you can trade pitching, but you very rarely get the same level of quality back in trade than if they had simply drafted a hitter to eventually put into the lineup.

I think they get one big signing and that does not make the draft bad although the Rocker signing has its risks. We shall see when any of those 3 are MLB ready. Surely not this year and to me maybe not the next minus Leiter

 

[WilltheThrill]

I think they will make sure they get one of the top starters. I am just not sold on them being able to sign 2 of them.

If I remember correctly, they did say that they wouldn't make it all the way to the top this offseason, or something similar to that, during one of the press conferences. They most certainly want to be competitive again though.

I’d be happy with one “ace”, a trade for an outfielder (Bryan Reynolds would be my first choice of those who are supposedly available), and then a real focus put on bringing in quality relievers (as you and Ephland have suggested).

 

[True Rangers Fan]

I will say this. If the Rangers do spend $70-80 AAV on starting pitching the rest of this offseason, in addition to signing Perez, then I think the strategy to take Leiter, Rocker and Porter was a mistake. We had the chance of getting a very good hitter instead of Rocker and we went with Rocker instead. I know you can trade pitching, but you very rarely get the same level of quality back in trade than if they had simply drafted a hitter to eventually put into the lineup.

Don't see the issue. Rangers could easily move a BORP or two as needed to make room for the young guys.

I like being able to say the Rangers have to contend with having too much good pitching.

 

[saddles]

I don't get the surprise. What is happening with FA signings is a direct result of the new CBA. What were people expecting?

 

[True Rangers Fan]

I don't get the surprise. What is happening with FA signings is a direct result of the new CBA. What were people expecting?

a lot of people on Reddit were surprised Martin got that much as well.

 

[saddles]

Don't see the issue. Rangers could easily move a BORP or two as needed to make room for the young guys.

I like being able to say the Rangers have to contend with having too much good pitching.

It is more than just making room for guys. Although, let's wait and see if they sign more pitching next offseason, before we decide if they will have guys to move out of the way. They could sign more next year and move our 4th and 5th starters out of the way then. It is also about not having the guy who they would have drafted instead.

I think you lose something when you start having to make trades just to make room or just because there is no room.

Also, this whole issue can be coupled with last year's strategy to sign two top MIF when that was the strength of the organization. It just seems that the trip to the top could move a little faster had their strategies to trade for prospects, draft prospects, and sign free agents all been a bit more in line with each other. It seems like things could have been planned to work a little more efficiently.

Signing two top pitchers has yet to happen yet though. I am just saying if they do, I will be less happy with the overall strategy.

 

[saddles]

a lot of people on Reddit were surprised Martin got that much as well.

People are failing to take into account the new CBA. I don't understand why.

 

[Kelleyman]

Otto despite his upward climb could still at one point be a winning piece reliever. I doubt if it is this year but beyond that could happen

 

[saddles]

Otto despite his upward climb could still at one point be a winning piece reliever. I doubt if it is this year but beyond that could happen

He could be a very solid 3 or 4, so yes, almost all of those type guys could make a great reliever.

 

[saddles]

If we somehow do not lose Kyle Cody in the Rule 5 draft, I imagine the Rangers will use him in relief for a lot of 2023. They can use his injury as an excuse to move him to the pen.