Rules Question

[uncfan103]

Can someone please help me understand a couple things about this punt return? It's following a defensive delay of game penalty for trying to guess the snap count.

My question (maybe former officials can help me out):
A) Why blow the play dead and say you saw a fair catch signal if you did not see a fair catch signal?

B) If you "see" a fair catch signal why was a kick catch interference or whatever penalty called when he was run into immediately after the catch?

C) why are officials this incompetent still allowed to officiate? Or are they just good at doing their job and we're trying to keep Carolina from covering the spread, or winning the game? Are officials held accountable for being terrible.


This is not a one time "mistake". These things are happening on a weekly basis and are not just screwing Carolina over.

 

[tech_iceman]

Officials are getting worse every year... just a plain fact

Closest thing to a fair catch was when he brought up his hand to his chest... should've been a penalty for that dude running into him

 

[craigk217]

Depends ... did he lead with the crown of his helmet OR did he lead with his shoulder and abstain from contact in the neck or head area?

 

[theboardref]

If anything the chest tap meant, that's all me I got it. Bad call.

 

[uncfan103]

If anything the chest tap meant, that's all me I got it. Bad call.

And the chest tap is legally not a fair catch call. But, if it was called that they need to enforce rules that come into play on a fair catch.

 

[dann bunn]

Can someone please help me understand a couple things about this punt return? It's following a defensive delay of game penalty for trying to guess the snap count.

My question (maybe former officials can help me out):
A) Why blow the play dead and say you saw a fair catch signal if you did not see a fair catch signal?

B) If you "see" a fair catch signal why was a kick catch interference or whatever penalty called when he was run into immediately after the catch?

C) why are officials this incompetent still allowed to officiate? Or are they just good at doing their job and we're trying to keep Carolina from covering the spread, or winning the game? Are officials held accountable for being terrible.


This is not a one time "mistake". These things are happening on a weekly basis and are not just screwing Carolina over.

 

[dann bunn]

It appeared to me no. 5 in the white thought it was a fair catch signal, as he veered away from the receiver, and the guy that did bumb heim also appeared to not intend on hitting him. These two would not have been that careless if they did not think it was a fair catch signal. It was not just the referee.

 

[uncfan103]

It appeared to me no. 5 in the white thought it was a fair catch signal, as he veered away from the receiver, and the guy that did bumb heim also appeared to not intend on hitting him. These two would not have been that careless if they did not think it was a fair catch signal. It was not just the referee.

The two players were trying not to hit him before he caught it, or just assumed he made a fair catch signal. But, he's done this all year and this was the first time anyone just didn't finish hitting him. Everyone else just stands there, waits for him to catch it, and tackles him.

But regardless, even if you're under the assumption that patting your belly is a fair catch signal shouldn't the referees
a) be held accountable for not knowing the rule

valid signal is a signal given by a player of Team B who has obviously
signaled his intention by extending one hand only clearly above his head and waving
that hand from side to side of his body more than once

OR

b) have penalized the playing for hitting him after calling for a fair catch? By the way, I doubt the player would've hit him if he saw him signal for a fair catch.

 

[dann bunn]

The two players were trying not to hit him before he caught it, or just assumed he made a fair catch signal. But, he's done this all year and this was the first time anyone just didn't finish hitting him. Everyone else just stands there, waits for him to catch it, and tackles him.

But regardless, even if you're under the assumption that patting your belly is a fair catch signal shouldn't the referees
a) be held accountable for not knowing the rule


OR

b) have penalized the playing for hitting him after calling for a fair catch? By the way, I doubt the player would've hit him if he saw him signal for a fair catch.

Yes, I agree

 

[4down20]

You can't do anything that looks like it might be a fair catch sign, even if it's not an actual fair catch sign.

If you want to signal other players, you need to do it low so that it can't be confused.

 

[ElTexan]

Correct me if I'm wrong:

This seems like a good enough place to bring this up. I've always wondered about this since this exact thing happens once a year or so.

So, in basketball, the ref will throw one arm up when a guy attempts a three, and then throws the other up if he makes it. This signals to the scorekeeper that a THREE is being attempted.

So, why the fuck don't we have the same thing in football for these situations… since clarity and player safety are so important?

When the ref sees a Fair Catch called, he can raise both hands and scream 'fair catch fair catch fair catch' to signal to all on the field that a Fair Catch is engaged.

This keeps the returner safe, right?

So, why don't we have this simple thing?

 

[Lakers+USC=#1]

You can't do anything that looks like it might be a fair catch sign, even if it's not an actual fair catch sign.

If you want to signal other players, you need to do it low so that it can't be confused.

He didn't do anything that looks like a fair catch.

 

[dann bunn]

Correct me if I'm wrong:

This seems like a good enough place to bring this up. I've always wondered about this since this exact thing happens once a year or so.

So, in basketball, the ref will throw one arm up when a guy attempts a three, and then throws the other up if he makes it. This signals to the scorekeeper that a THREE is being attempted.

So, why the fuck don't we have the same thing in football for these situations… since clarity and player safety are so important?

When the ref sees a Fair Catch called, he can raise both hands and scream 'fair catch fair catch fair catch' to signal to all on the field that a Fair Catch is engaged.

This keeps the returner safe, right?

So, why don't we have this simple thing?

With all the noise in stadiums like LSU or Seahawks, or the like, I'd be unsure if the players could hear. Just keep the rule, signal above the shoulders or head, whatever and make sure the referees and players understand the rules. That is all that has to be done. No need to reinvent the wheel for stupidity. A similar mistaken timeout happened to Eli Manning last week. An error in judgement of an official could cost a team their season and playoff berth. This is their livelihood, they don't need any stupid mistaken calls.

 

[4down20]

He didn't do anything that looks like a fair catch.

Yes he did, he moved his hand above his waist. You can't do anything at all like that as I said.

 

[Edonidd]

As they make up stupider and more esoteric rules all the time refs forget to call the basic rules of the game. I have seen more offensive teams trying to draw defenders offsides this year by having their backs suddenly go into motion than I ever have in the past. That should be a penalty on the offense every time. I think it was Navy or Air Force I watched, and they did that literally every snap with the obvious intention of faking the snap to draw defenses offsides. That's a penalty.

 

[4down20]

As they make up stupider and more esoteric rules all the time refs forget to call the basic rules of the game. I have seen more offensive teams trying to draw defenders offsides this year by having their backs suddenly go into motion than I ever have in the past. That should be a penalty on the offense every time. I think it was Navy or Air Force I watched, and they did that literally every snap with the obvious intention of faking the snap to draw defenses offsides. That's a penalty.

This rule exists for exactly the reason you seen in game, and the refs and the rule is 100% correct.

 

[uncfan103]

Yes he did, he moved his hand above his waist. You can't do anything at all like that as I said.

You're funny. The highest his hand got was when he caught the ball. If were gonna call that a fair catch lets eliminate all kick returns and call the ball dead as soon as it's touched

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

Officials are getting worse every year... just a plain fact

Closest thing to a fair catch was when he brought up his hand to his chest... should've been a penalty for that dude running into him

I keep saying there needs to be fines for officials who simply get the rules wrong. It has been dramatically changing the game. If you suck that much at your job that you can't get the rules of college football right, then you get fined or you can quit. Speaking from recent experience, you shouldn't be able to call targeting on a player blocked into another player.

 

[Edonidd]

This rule exists for exactly the reason you seen in game, and the refs and the rule is 100% correct.

I'm not sure if you're agreeing with me or not. But the rule specifically states "after assuming a set position no player of the offense may make a sudden movement as if to simulate the play is starting."

Another rule of players going in motion is that they can not move forward towards the line of scrimmage. Like RB's who go in motion are supposed to only go parallel to the line, not take a step forward and then go parallel.

 

[4down20]

You're funny. The highest his hand got was when he caught the ball. If were gonna call that a fair catch lets eliminate all kick returns and call the ball dead as soon as it's touched

You can dislike the rule all you want, but that will get called EVERY SINGLE FUCKING time.

You say he did nothing that would look like a fair catch signal, and yet everyone else treated it like he called a fair catch signal. To which he was then able to run for a TD after because - everyone else had stopped on the play as if he called a fair catch signal.

The rule exists specifically for this. It's not the first time it's been called, it's not going to be the last.