Random NFL talk

[fightinfunbags]

Same thing with the Seahawks and Ken Walker. But the Hawks knew they had a QB that could at least, lead the team. I think the Jets need to go after a veteran QB and quit trying to find a unicorn in the draft. It clearly isn't working for them and there really is not much in this years crop.

I disagree. I think this is a great QB draft. I think Young and Stroud have the potential to be franchise QBs. I also think the position is deep with some value on developmental options in the 3rd and 4th round as well.

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

Ironically, Geno was one of those early QB picks of the Jets lol.

63 years, Joe Namath #1 overall in 65, Ken O'brien #24 overall in 83, and Chad Pennington #18 overall in 2000 (they had 4 first rounders that year and Chad was their 3rd pick, lol). The only picks that have really panned out for them at the position. Had a few good seasons with Sanchez but mostly because of the defense. Rex Ryan was a buffoon and still is, imo. Geno was immature and not ready but he didn't have a prayer under Ryan.

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

never know when building a team. GB & KC couldn't or wouldn't pay 28/30M per for a wide receiver, maybe WR's won't matter down the line for some teams. Eye of the beholder kinda thing.

Well, looking at what the Saints paid Michael Thomas and how it effects their cap, maybe they aren't always worth it. Adams lived up to his end of the deal but the Raiders aren't winning games because of it. So my take is WRs are over valued to some degree. Hill has been great for Miami but they are over the cap and not looking like they are going anywhere. KC was smart but they also have a great QB and TE and HC so they only need good WRs that don't get paid top dollar.

 

[PDay8810]

Well, looking at what the Saints paid Michael Thomas and how it effects their cap, maybe they aren't always worth it. Adams lived up to his end of the deal but the Raiders aren't winning games because of it. So my take is WRs are over valued to some degree. Hill has been great for Miami but they are over the cap and not looking like they are going anywhere. KC was smart but they also have a great QB and TE and HC so they only need good WRs that don't get paid top dollar.

Dallas fans bitch about 40M for a QB
I wonder if 30M for Lamb is expectable.

 

[Clayton]

I disagree. I think this is a great QB draft. I think Young and Stroud have the potential to be franchise QBs. I also think the position is deep with some value on developmental options in the 3rd and 4th round as well.

I don't know about great but it's at least average. Can't shy away from QB when there are at least a few there with lots of upside.

All I know is that you can't let previous busts deter you from finding a winner. Players are independent variables. Lions drafted Calvin Johnson right after drafting 2 bust WRs.

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

I disagree. I think this is a great QB draft. I think Young and Stroud have the potential to be franchise QBs. I also think the position is deep with some value on developmental options in the 3rd and 4th round as well.

We will just have to disagree on that one. No offense. Stroud is the only one that stands out and his arm strength is questionable. a lot like Tua in that regard. It will also depend on which team drafts these kids. They may not have the luxury of going to solid franchises like the Chiefs, Eagles, etc. who have a leadership team that knows how to build a roster. As for the 3rd and 4th rd thing, I have no problem drafting QBs back there but the overall class isn't great, imo.

 

[shopson67]

never know when building a team. GB & KC couldn't or wouldn't pay 28/30M per for a wide receiver, maybe WR's won't matter down the line for some teams. Eye of the beholder kinda thing.

Well, GB paying Adams beyond Rodgers' likely remaining years is a tough call, and KC is built around their TEs more than their WRs. Getting multiple high picks in exchange for not having to pay the exorbitant new WR ceiling is a relatively easy call, provided you backfill properly with those picks. Been a bumpier road for the Packers, since they didn't add FAs (losing one to KC in fact). I'm a bit surprised that Skyy Moore hasn't carved out more of a role yet.

Sticker shock on top WRs could prompt more of these trades, and there seems a steady influx of worthy WRs each season.

 

[PDay8810]

Sticker shock on top WRs could prompt more of these trades, and there seems a steady influx of worthy WRs each season.

sounds like this board's definition of runningbacks in another season or two

 

[shopson67]

Well, looking at what the Saints paid Michael Thomas and how it effects their cap, maybe they aren't always worth it. Adams lived up to his end of the deal but the Raiders aren't winning games because of it. So my take is WRs are over valued to some degree. Hill has been great for Miami but they are over the cap and not looking like they are going anywhere. KC was smart but they also have a great QB and TE and HC so they only need good WRs that don't get paid top dollar.

I think the multiple top pick offers for max contract WRs could dry up to some degree. Worked for the Dolphins for the most part, but didn't really move the needle for the Raiders. The leverage for $30M WR annual salaries may fade a bit as teams instead rotate in younger players, more like they do with RBs.

 

[shopson67]

sounds like this board's definition of runningbacks in another season or two

To a degree, but the RBs are less likely to get top end contracts and typically have shorter careers.

 

[PDay8810]

To a degree, but the RBs are less likely to get top end contracts and typically have shorter careers.

correct Sir, which was the point all along.
30 to 35M per is not 12 to 15 per
BUT...Good to Great Football players play all positions. That all matter in this team sport on any given week.

 

[shopson67]

correct Sir, which was the point all along.
30 to 35M per is not 12 to 15 per
BUT...Good to Great Football players play all positions. That all matter in this team sport on any given week.

Drafting a RB in the first round does not mean you need to pay them exorbitantly. It does provide an option for a fifth year under the rookie scale before free agency can create a significant jump. Drafting a 1st round RB every 4th or 5th year could continue a high level at the position without having to pay FA prices (as with WRs, but you might want more than one at that level depending on your system). Busts would complicate trying to schedule draft picks like that of course.

 

[PDay8810]

Drafting ANY POSITION in the first round does not mean you need to pay them exorbitantly. It does provide an option for a fifth year under the rookie scale before free agency can create a significant jump.

fixed

 

[shopson67]

fixed

Also true. Not all positions are perceived to be valued strongly enough to draft in the first round other than in extreme situations. Running back has become one of those of course.

 

[PDay8810]

Also true. Not all positions are perceived to be valued strongly enough to draft in the first round other than in extreme situations. Running back has become one of those of course.

Yes....and center
LOL

 

[Clayton]

We will just have to disagree on that one. No offense. Stroud is the only one that stands out and his arm strength is questionable. a lot like Tua in that regard. It will also depend on which team drafts these kids. They may not have the luxury of going to solid franchises like the Chiefs, Eagles, etc. who have a leadership team that knows how to build a roster. As for the 3rd and 4th rd thing, I have no problem drafting QBs back there but the overall class isn't great, imo.

The gist Im getting is that Bryce Young is locked in at #1 overall in kind of a Kyler Murray type of tier. What'll get interesting is where exactly Stroud and Levis go. PFF actually has Levis above Stroud so...here we go already.

A good deal of the top 10 should be QB or defensive linemen if I had to guess. Maybe the TCU WR is up there. Bijan, JSN and the Rashawn Slater 2.0 probably a little after that.

Imo it puts Seattle in a tough position. I am generally of the belief that they should go QB if one is there. If Young is clearly the #1, though...it does kinda shake the idea of going QB if there is a tier drop when you could be picking a top tier dlineman. The gist Ive heard is that the Georgia DT has the best film of anyone. You dont want to pass on Suh to take Sam Bradford. Indy and Atlanta should absolutely try to draft a QB, though.

 

[fightinfunbags]

The gist Im getting is that Bryce Young is locked in at #1 overall in kind of a Kyler Murray type of tier. What'll get interesting is where exactly Stroud and Levis go. PFF actually has Levis above Stroud so...here we go already.

A good deal of the top 10 should be QB or defensive linemen if I had to guess. Maybe the TCU WR is up there. Bijan, JSN and the Rashawn Slater 2.0 probably a little after that.

Imo it puts Seattle in a tough position. I am generally of the belief that they should go QB if one is there. If Young is clearly the #1, though...it does kinda shake the idea of going QB if there is a tier drop when you could be picking a top tier dlineman. The gist Ive heard is that the Georgia DT has the best film of anyone. You dont want to pass on Suh to take Sam Bradford. Indy and Atlanta should absolutely try to draft a QB, though.

TCU WR is going to run a laser timed 4.6 and he will drop. I’ve been watching him and there’s no way that dude is a 4.4 guy. No way.

 

[Clayton]

TCU WR is going to run a laser timed 4.6 and he will drop. I’ve been watching him and there’s no way that dude is a 4.4 guy. No way.

Im guessing he is 4.5-4.6. Id imagine whoever drafts him will put him in a Tee Higgins type of role.

Watching 2 games of his and his highlights, Im seeing why he is successful in college. His arms and legs are so long that he is difficult for college defenders to even match up with him. He has the same spin-and-run move he does after catching the ball because CB overpursue on him because they cant match him. He has the same cutback move whenever he gets the ball in space because defenders overpursue him. His big play against Michigan was just his long legs being too tough to tackle in space. His stiff arm creates a ton of space, too.

 

[Schmoopy1000]

never know when building a team. GB & KC couldn't or wouldn't pay 28/30M per for a wide receiver, maybe WR's won't matter down the line for some teams. Eye of the beholder kinda thing.

ebb & flow

 

[shopson67]

Yes....and center
LOL

You don't have to tell me about center lol. Been a sore spot for Rams fans how they have passed on center options in the last few drafts, even in the 3rd or later.