Random NFL talk

[fightinfunbags]

I think the success of kids like Ken Walker, Travis Etienne, Isiah Pacheco and Breece Hall (pre-injury) are making people rethink a little too. Still not sure of drafting them too high and all that but copycat league and also run defense not as good overall across the league, imo.

A few picks come to mind - CMC - not with the team that drafted him. Zeke Elliott - a bad contract. Trent Richardson - bust. Ricky Williams - didn’t work for the team that drafted him. Leonard Fournette - looked good at first but team fell apart when he got paid and he got injured.

I don’t want anything to do with picking a RB top 10ish.

 

[Clayton]

I think the success of kids like Ken Walker, Travis Etienne, Isiah Pacheco and Breece Hall (pre-injury) are making people rethink a little too. Still not sure of drafting them too high and all that but copycat league and also run defense not as good overall across the league, imo.

I think it might have more to do with the nature of the draft. If there are no elite OTs or WRs then I think the 1 elite RB gets pushed up

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

A few picks come to mind - CMC - not with the team that drafted him. Zeke Elliott - a bad contract. Trent Richardson - bust. Ricky Williams - didn’t work for the team that drafted him. Leonard Fournette - looked good at first but team fell apart when he got paid and he got injured.

I don’t want anything to do with picking a RB top 10ish.

Oh me neither but it was just to point out the recent ones that GMs look at. I do think a lot of it is because of bad or indifferent run defense though.

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

I think it might have more to do with the nature of the draft. If there are no elite OTs or WRs then I think the 1 elite RB gets pushed up

Yeah, that's definitely a factor, especially when teams already have their QB in place or the QB draft classes are underwhelming as they were last year and this.

 

[Schmoopy1000]

I think if they are gonna be a bad ass Rb & they are a 3 down back. They are worth a 1st rd. pick.

 

[fightinfunbags]

I think if they are gonna be a bad ass Rb & they are a 3 down back. They are worth a 1st rd. pick.

I would entertain it if I’m convinced it’s best player available and I’m picking 20 or later.

 

[Schmoopy1000]

I would entertain it if I’m convinced it’s best player available and I’m picking 20 or later.

I get what your saying. Also agree to a point of how good do you think this guy is.
but if you were sold he is a solid pick (not a Trent Richardson) & you picked 12th. You telling me you would go for a feast or famine pick instead of the solid guy? If you are drafting a 3 down back there is good chances of his high quality for those 1st 5 years.
WR & other picks are often wild cards. (Reagor comes to mind.) Also everything else comes into play. I get that. Not a black & white answer.
If you have no running game & score a quality three down back in the 1st round. You now just helped your whole defense.
Now I would have a hard time using a 1st on a bad ass RBBC guy, that isnt a 3 down back, but a 3 down back (rare out of college) can be a game changer just like a WR ensech.

& obviously they would need to be near the top of BPA.

For instance. CMAC was a game changer, would take that kinda guy all day in the 1st.

I didnt regret drafting Zeke (although I wanted Ramsey) He fixed a lot of problems on our defense by keeping our defense off the field. (TOP)
He could run reliably, catch reliably, & block reliably. He was quality in all phases.
Depends on teams & how they are built if it is worth it.

but as a general statement. I believe 3 down backs are worth a 1st.

 

[fightinfunbags]

I get what your saying. Also agree to a point of how good do you think this guy is.
but if you were sold he is a solid pick (not a Trent Richardson) & you picked 12th. You telling me you would go for a feast or famine pick instead of the solid guy? If you are drafting a 3 down back there is good chances of his high quality for those 1st 5 years.
WR & other picks are often wild cards. (Reagor comes to mind.) Also everything else comes into play. I get that. Not a black & white answer.
If you have no running game & score a quality three down back in the 1st round. You now just helped your whole defense.
Now I would have a hard time using a 1st on a bad ass RBBC guy, that isnt a 3 down back, but a 3 down back (rare out of college) can be a game changer just like a WR ensech.

& obviously they would need to be near the top of BPA.

For instance. CMAC was a game changer, would take that kinda guy all day in the 1st.

I didnt regret drafting Zeke (although I wanted Ramsey) He fixed a lot of problems on our defense by keeping our defense off the field. (TOP)
He could run reliably, catch reliably, & block reliably. He was quality in all phases.
Depends on teams & how they are built if it is worth it.

but as a general statement. I believe 3 down backs are worth a 1st.

Fair. Can’t say I disagree with your logic. I’m a system guy. I don’t want to be drafting top 10-12 very often. When I am I’m thinking OT, DT, DE, CB, QB. I’m not even a WR guy this early unless it’s a can’t miss prospect and the BPA at my positions above are weak that draft. In fact, I’d rather trade down than draft a RB that early. Again, it’s just a philosophy thing for me and I know I’m missing out on some great players with this philosophy but I think the aggregate results in consistent winning football.

 

[Schmoopy1000]

Fair. Can’t say I disagree with your logic. I’m a system guy. I don’t want to be drafting top 10-12 very often. When I am I’m thinking OT, DT, DE, CB, QB. I’m not even a WR guy this early unless it’s a can’t miss prospect and the BPA at my positions above are weak that draft. In fact, I’d rather trade down than draft a RB that early. Again, it’s just a philosophy thing for me and I know I’m missing out on some great players with this philosophy but I think the aggregate results in consistent winning football.

If I had your team for this next draft.
I would 100% agree with you. This offensive concept (& QB) doesnt need a 3 down back.

 

[shopson67]

I think the success of kids like Ken Walker, Travis Etienne, Isiah Pacheco and Breece Hall (pre-injury) are making people rethink a little too. Still not sure of drafting them too high and all that but copycat league and also run defense not as good overall across the league, imo.

Don't forget Pierce, Stevenson, Allgeier, Robinson, etc. Problem is, with that many being effective, it actually works against the concept of drafting them early, as you have 6th and 7th rounders excelling as rookies.

 

[shopson67]

I think it might have more to do with the nature of the draft. If there are no elite OTs or WRs then I think the 1 elite RB gets pushed up

The one thing I can guarantee is that Bijon gets picked 1st overall in my dynasty draft this spring lol. Unfortunately, I'm picking 3rd, so I have to strategize more...

 

[PDay8810]

The one thing I can guarantee is that Bijon gets picked 1st overall in my dynasty draft this spring lol. Unfortunately, I'm picking 3rd, so I have to strategize more...

now you're coming around...beauty is in the eye of the beholder

 

[shopson67]

now you're coming around...beauty is in the eye of the beholder

I agreed with that point from the beginning, was just discussing why the beholder might have those desires lol.

 

[PDay8810]

I agreed with that point from the beginning, was just discussing why the beholder might have those desires lol.

well...some football folks think certain RB's matter?

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

Don't forget Pierce, Stevenson, Allgeier, Robinson, etc. Problem is, with that many being effective, it actually works against the concept of drafting them early, as you have 6th and 7th rounders excelling as rookies.

Totally agree. But as @Clayton said, teams will sometimes reach when the options are limited. Late first round at best or later if guys are there and that's what the team needs is usually the best option, imo.

 

[shopson67]

Totally agree. But as @Clayton said, teams will sometimes reach when the options are limited. Late first round at best or later if guys are there and that's what the team needs is usually the best option, imo.

In the Jets case, they had multiple firsts, which made taking the 1st RB of last year's draft in the early 2nd an easier choice. Unfortunately for them, their franchise QB choice appears to be busting and they no longer should expect to have early draft picks to get their top choice of any upcoming class.

 

[shopson67]

well...some football folks think certain RB's matter?

Eye of the beholder, like the Titans essentially building their team around Henry. Unfortunately for them, his window should be closing (barring some Lebron/Brady extended window aberration, lol), and runners of that style and dominance aren't easy to find.

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

In the Jets case, they had multiple firsts, which made taking the 1st RB of last year's draft in the early 2nd an easier choice. Unfortunately for them, their franchise QB choice appears to be busting and they no longer should expect to have early draft picks to get their top choice of any upcoming class.

Same thing with the Seahawks and Ken Walker. But the Hawks knew they had a QB that could at least, lead the team. I think the Jets need to go after a veteran QB and quit trying to find a unicorn in the draft. It clearly isn't working for them and there really is not much in this years crop.

 

[shopson67]

Same thing with the Seahawks and Ken Walker. But the Hawks knew they had a QB that could at least, lead the team. I think the Jets need to go after a veteran QB and quit trying to find a unicorn in the draft. It clearly isn't working for them and there really is not much in this years crop.

Ironically, Geno was one of those early QB picks of the Jets lol.

 

[PDay8810]

Eye of the beholder, like the Titans essentially building their team around Henry. Unfortunately for them, his window should be closing (barring some Lebron/Brady extended window aberration, lol), and runners of that style and dominance aren't easy to find.

never know when building a team. GB & KC couldn't or wouldn't pay 28/30M per for a wide receiver, maybe WR's won't matter down the line for some teams. Eye of the beholder kinda thing.