politics thread

[Sharkinva]

Thanks for the welcome. I want to make sure how things work here. When people say racist things we do not call that out? Would it be OK for me to say " I think we have more than enough black people at the moment"? Is it OK to call policies, other people not in the conversation and ideas racist, just not people participating in the thread (without any proof or evidence mind you). Oh, unless you phrase it as something like "you seem to want (insert racist thought)".

I get that shark is your friend, sounds like that may be swaying your judgement, because there's been some very racist comments in this thread. So, I will abide and not call out racists, but a little clarification would be helpful. Thanks in advance.

SO I will take this one on.

My comment about I dont think we need more white people is no more racist than the concept that we dont need any more Mexicans, or people from shithole countries. Its an opinion. ONe is in fact based in long standing racial thinking in this country. My thought is rather new to the table.

I have been accused of hating white people... far from it because it would mean hating half my family. Now I do have a problem with white people that feel being born white somehow makes them superior... And I got a few distant relatives i have told to get bent because they hold these views.

My take is rather logical actually. The only way you get real equality and an equal seat at the table is if everyone has an equal stake in the table. I also realize that concept bothers some because they feel the only way minorities get more rights (equality) is if the current majority losses rights in some fashion.

BTW welcome to our little social experiment.

 

[Nod4Eight]

SO I will take this one on.

My comment about I dont think we need more white people is no more racist than the concept that we dont need any more Mexicans, or people from shithole countries. Its an opinion. ONe is in fact based in long standing racial thinking in this country. My thought is rather new to the table.

I have been accused of hating white people... far from it because it would mean hating half my family. Now I do have a problem with white people that feel being born white somehow makes them superior... And I got a few distant relatives i have told to get bent because they hold these views.

My take is rather logical actually. The only way you get real equality and an equal seat at the table is if everyone has an equal stake in the table. I also realize that concept bothers some because they feel the only way minorities get more rights (equality) is if the current majority losses rights in some fashion.

BTW welcome to our little social experiment.

You are right, it is an opinion. And a racist one at that. Simply saying it's not doesn't make it so.

If someone says "we don't need POC immigrants", that is racist. Now, that is quite different than saying we don't need immigrants from shitholes. Being an American is exceptional, we should only allow exceptional people in. We don't need to open the doors as a welfare gesture - isn't that why we give so much in foreign aid? And, if we take the best and brightest from the shitholes, isn't that going to ensure they remain shitholes? And please don't confuse illegal immigration with legal immigration. There are means for people to immigrate here legally.

But at the end of the day, I really don't care. I was just looking for clarification - and got none.

 

[Nod4Eight]

Ask yourself... if these innocent children had been dressed in Antifa gear and protesting for a womans right to choose, and the exact thing had happened... would you be so forgiving??

People of color are paying the price for 'stand your ground' laws: Today's talker

'The obvious consequence is that armed citizens are more emboldened to escalate public altercations, and people of color are paying the price.'

Simply saying SYG laws are racist doesn't make them so. The author of the study that concluded that even went as far as to say that there's "a limited amount of data collected, and it’s collected differently across different jurisdictions." The USA Today author just parrots her, but adds nothing - it's an op-ed piece.

 

[gkekoa]

Ask yourself... if these innocent children had been dressed in Antifa gear and protesting for a womans right to choose, and the exact thing had happened... would you be so forgiving??

People of color are paying the price for 'stand your ground' laws: Today's talker

'The obvious consequence is that armed citizens are more emboldened to escalate public altercations, and people of color are paying the price.'

Actually, if they were wearing ANTIFA or protesting the ability, not right, to choose, and if they were sitting there and had some idiot beating a drum in their face and the idiot was protesting abortion, I would take the back of the ANTIFA member in that exact situation. Right is right and wrong is wrong. A person standing still and not doing a damn thing wrong, regardless of their views, should not be proclaimed evil if they are following the law.

As for an obvious miss in the article is this...perhaps people of color shouldn’t be so violent in their everyday interactions. Maybe we shouldn’t throw people to the ground. Maybe we shouldn’t illegally park in handicapped spots. A gun is the great equalizer. Why should the original victim be required to retreat? Why should a 300 pound dude be expected to run away from an attacker when the escape actually weakens him if followed.

As for Drejka, does anybody actually think he wanted to be attacked? What if the black guy decided to immediately follow up with death blows. Sorry but Drejka, who I blieve is a POS, would not have been able to get to his gun.

 

[gkekoa]

SO I will take this one on.

My comment about I dont think we need more white people is no more racist than the concept that we dont need any more Mexicans, or people from shithole countries. Its an opinion. ONe is in fact based in long standing racial thinking in this country. My thought is rather new to the table.

I have been accused of hating white people... far from it because it would mean hating half my family. Now I do have a problem with white people that feel being born white somehow makes them superior... And I got a few distant relatives i have told to get bent because they hold these views.

My take is rather logical actually. The only way you get real equality and an equal seat at the table is if everyone has an equal stake in the table. I also realize that concept bothers some because they feel the only way minorities get more rights (equality) is if the current majority losses rights in some fashion.

BTW welcome to our little social experiment.

Except it more racist. White (Caucasian) is a race. Mexican and Somali are not. If you don’t believe there is a difference between people from Caracas and people from Poland, why is the murder rate 111/100k murder rate in the other .67...yes that is a decimal.

Very few, if any, white people hold the view you are speaking of. Very few believe it is actually their race that makes them superior.

The only way to have equality is for people to be equal in all aspects. Sorry but people are not all equal in all aspects. Resources, skills, culture, education, what we value, are just a few things that all people differ on. You can’t ask for more rights and believe in equality. If all Americans have the same rights, if you start giving extra rights to somebody bas3d on a perception, then equality is lost.

You have the following rights...
Life
Liberty
Property
Speech
Press
Religion
Arms
Due process
No illegal search and seizure
Fair and speedy trial
Trial
Cruel and unusual punishment
To be taxed by income
Vote

 

[skinsdad62]

Thanks for the welcome. I want to make sure how things work here. When people say racist things we do not call that out? Would it be OK for me to say " I think we have more than enough black people at the moment"? Is it OK to call policies, other people not in the conversation and ideas racist, just not people participating in the thread (without any proof or evidence mind you). Oh, unless you phrase it as something like "you seem to want (insert racist thought)".

I get that shark is your friend, sounds like that may be swaying your judgement, because there's been some very racist comments in this thread. So, I will abide and not call out racists, but a little clarification would be helpful. Thanks in advance.

just dont come out and call anyone a flat out racist or name call in general , thats all . and that would go for anyone not just my friends

you can call out policies and ideas as racist . that is fair . some accuse me of being a dictator here and i dont want that . i just want intense , but civil debate . i will let you know if something is inappropriate as far as name calling (not ideas )

 

[skinsdad62]

Nobody, not even CNN, believes that CNN sent a full camera crew to a single house in South Florida before dawn because it noticed "unusual grand jury activity" (which by law is secret) in...Washington, D.C. It was tipped by someone in law enforcement, and everybody knows it.

Now my question is Stone and Flynn get busted for “process crimes “ ie lying under oath to mueller yet Cheryl Mills and huma Aberdeen who also lied to the fbi to the same crew but were working for HRC weren’t prosecuted .

And we are supposed to believe we have no bias on those organizations ?

 

[Sharkinva]

Nobody, not even CNN, believes that CNN sent a full camera crew to a single house in South Florida before dawn because it noticed "unusual grand jury activity" (which by law is secret) in...Washington, D.C. It was tipped by someone in law enforcement, and everybody knows it.

Now my question is Stone and Flynn get busted for “process crimes “ ie lying under oath to mueller yet Cheryl Mills and huma Aberdeen who also lied to the fbi to the same crew but were working for HRC weren’t prosecuted .

And we are supposed to believe we have no bias on those organizations ?

IM going to play devils advocate here.

Mueller had a stone associate in for a grand jury testimony yesterday.

Usually grand jury is on a Friday. And the last few times when he has convened on a Thursday, some one got indicted on Friday.

As it was a stone associate, maybe they just had a good hunch that Stone would be indicted today, staked out the FBI office in Ft Lauderdale and it paid off..

Or at least thats what i have heard.

 

[Sharkinva]

NO wall yet

But we did get a Presidential cave this afternoon.

 

[skinsdad62]

NO wall yet

But we did get a Presidential cave this afternoon.

Nope. If you follow strategy you will notice he got the dems 2 x times to vote against paying the workers . Now he agreed to open the govt for 3 weeks because pelosi said no negotiations until govt is open . If she fails at having honest negotiations then the country sees this and then trump has her. Add to it the state of the union address. On the 29th and he gets to talk directly to the American people and shows the country the AOC wing of the democratic party in action. Now add to it that
Kushner is pushing for full amnesty to all illegals here in exchange for the wall then I see a huge win for the country

 

[Sharkinva]

Nope. If you follow strategy you will notice he got the dems 2 x times to vote against paying the workers . Now he agreed to open the govt for 3 weeks because pelosi said no negotiations until govt is open . If she fails at having honest negotiations then the country sees this and then trump has her. Add to it the state of the union address. On the 29th and he gets to talk directly to the American people and shows the country the AOC wing of the democratic party in action. Now add to it that
Kushner is pushing for full amnesty to all illegals here in exchange for the wall then I see a huge win for the country

Well I guess the next three weeks should be interesting. He has already backed off the 1900 miles of wall/Fence/tall hedges claim. IF he declares a national emergency, it will be challenged in court and tied up for years.

I honestly think this is more about holding the base for 2020 than thinking he will get the wall at this point. And what ever happened to Mexico paying for it??

 

[eaglesnut]

Dude.. I been living here for 50 years without a wall along the southern border. So a symbol of fear and hate at a cost of billions of dollars is not a cost of living here. Its a waste of money to give a minority of the population a false sense of security.

"A symbol of fear and hate?" Can you hear yourself?

For fuck sake, man.

Does your house have walls? Does your front door have a lock? Is your front door "a symbol of fear and hate" towards your neighbors?

You may have been around for a while, but it's about time you actually grow up.

 

[Sharkinva]

"A symbol of fear and hate?" Can you hear yourself?

For fuck sake, man.

Does your house have walls? Does your front door have a lock? Is your front door "a symbol of fear and hate" towards your neighbors?

You may have been around for a while, but it's about time you actually grow up.

I dont know about you, but my main concern in life isnt if my neighbor is going to come storming through my door to ruin my life. IN fact, my neighbor has keys to keep an eye on the place if Im out of town and the dogs need fed or walked.

 

[eaglesnut]

I dont know about you, but my main concern in life isnt if my neighbor is going to come storming through my door to ruin my life. IN fact, my neighbor has keys to keep an eye on the place if Im out of town and the dogs need fed or walked.

So you do in fact have a key? A "symbol of fear and hate."

What is the key's purpose?

How about just letting any ole schmuck in??

 

[Sharkinva]

So you do in fact have a key? A "symbol of fear and hate."

What is the key's purpose?

How about just letting any ole schmuck in??

I love the false equivalency. Most of these folks want a chance at a better life, and arent intent from taking anything from you or me to get it. Sure some come here with bad intentions. But reality shows the majority of them would do you no harm.

 

[gkekoa]

I love the false equivalency. Most of these folks want a chance at a better life, and arent intent from taking anything from you or me to get it. Sure some come here with bad intentions. But reality shows the majority of them would do you no harm.

Most folks in general want a better life.

These aren’t the people you protect yourself from.

We do want to be prepared for those with bad intentions, regardless of where they are from.

Do you let a 5 year old girl go into a house to live with 5 people, knowing one of them is a *********? Hell, most of those people in the house want a better life, but the one has bad intentions.

 

[Sharkinva]

Most folks in general want a better life.

These aren’t the people you protect yourself from.

We do want to be prepared for those with bad intentions, regardless of where they are from.

Do you let a 5 year old girl go into a house to live with 5 people, knowing one of them is a *********? Hell, most of those people in the house want a better life, but the one has bad intentions.

I dont consider my house to extend for almost 4 million square miles. And I think the possibility of some of these people being bad actors is secondary to the potential shift they bring which is the real problem. And that shift has very little to do with America becoming socialist, or that we will end up like Venezuela, because people have been fearing that for 100 years and it hasnt happened despite us not having a wall. Most of these people will come here and their kids and grandkids will be good old capitalist Americans.

 

[gkekoa]

I dont consider my house to extend for almost 4 million square miles. And I think the possibility of some of these people being bad actors is secondary to the potential shift they bring which is the real problem. And that shift has very little to do with America becoming socialist, or that we will end up like Venezuela, because people have been fearing that for 100 years and it hasnt happened despite us not having a wall. Most of these people will come here and their kids and grandkids will be good old capitalist Americans.

Of course not...but it is the same thing. You protect your family from those who may do harm. You don’t risk your family.

I agree with you. Most would come here and be good capitalist Americans. But here are the facts. Crime south of the border is far worse than the US...in every category. Economics south of the border is far worse in every country. Education is far worse in every country. There are plenty of good Americans without these people.

Oh...so for you it is all about race. I still find that funny.

 

[Sharkinva]

Of course not...but it is the same thing. You protect your family from those who may do harm. You don’t risk your family.

I agree with you. Most would come here and be good capitalist Americans. But here are the facts. Crime south of the border is far worse than the US...in every category. Economics south of the border is far worse in every country. Education is far worse in every country. There are plenty of good Americans without these people.

Oh...so for you it is all about race. I still find that funny.

YOu are spinning the same arguments that have been spun for almost 100 years now. And yet America has survived. Protecting my family does not mean I need to fear everything different from me as some sort of threat. And to be honest, my family is more in danger from born and bred Americans, than any of these people on most days.

 

[eaglesnut]

I love the false equivalency. Most of these folks want a chance at a better life, and arent intent from taking anything from you or me to get it. Sure some come here with bad intentions. But reality shows the majority of them would do you no harm.

So your neighbors just bust in or do they ask you first? How about strangers?

Which ones will do you no harm and how do you personally tell?