Phillies Re-Sign Carlos Ruiz: Three Years, $26 Million

[Caligula]

I would rather have Ruiz (well, who wouldn't?), but Molina's value comes from his pitch framing.

Jose Molina and Called Strikes - Beyond the Box Score

Ruiz would have made more sense for Boston than the Phillies. Ruiz is a good player. It just isn't what the Phillies needed to do. And by doing that contract, it does the franchise more harm than good.

 

[Caligula]

Would you rather have Ruiz at 3 years 26 million or Molina/Kratz at 500 grand a piece?

That depends upon the team.

For Boston, Ruiz makes more sense. If the Phillies had a different roster. If Ruiz were the only risky contract? Sure. But with the way the team is structured currently? Pass. Don't even think twice about it.

 

[Omar 382]

And Rupp at even less money.

 

[Omar 382]

That depends upon the team.

For Boston, Ruiz makes more sense. If the Phillies had a different roster. If Ruiz were the only risky contract? Sure. But with the way the team is structured currently? Pass. Don't even think twice about it.

Imagining Rollins, Howard, Byrd, and Papelbon weren't on them, and Utley's contract was only for 1 year, I would still say that 3 years is 1 too many. I mean who hears of that? It is very hard for a catcher to be a regular player, stay injury free, and produce consistently, beyond age 34-ish. Obviously, this isn't a science. You will get a couple of great years from catchers beyond age 34. Piazza's 2005 was decent. Elston Howard finished 3rd in the MVP voting in 1964 at age 35. But for every exception to the rule, there will be 500 35 year old catchers who get injured and cannot produce. Also notice that Howard and Piazza are both borderline Hall of Famers. Ruiz has never been close to matching either of their productions.

 

[navamind]

Ruiz's stats are pretty comparable to Ron Hassey's. Hassey at age 34 had a career line of .278/.354/.401 (107 OPS+). Ruiz has a line of .274/.358/.412 (105 OPS+).

Ron Hassey Statistics and History - Baseball-Reference.com

Hopefully Ruiz fares better.

 

[navamind]

That depends upon the team.

For Boston, Ruiz makes more sense. If the Phillies had a different roster. If Ruiz were the only risky contract? Sure. But with the way the team is structured currently? Pass. Don't even think twice about it.

Pretty much.

 

[Omar 382]

Ruiz's stats are pretty comparable to Ron Hassey's. Hassey at age 34 had a career line of .278/.354/.401 (107 OPS+). Ruiz has a line of .274/.358/.412 (105 OPS+).

Ron Hassey Statistics and History - Baseball-Reference.com

Hopefully Ruiz fares better.

Baseball Reference "Most Similar by Age" much?

 

[Caligula]

Imagining Rollins, Howard, Byrd, and Papelbon weren't on them, and Utley's contract was only for 1 year, I would still say that 3 years is 1 too many. I mean who hears of that? It is very hard for a catcher to be a regular player, stay injury free, and produce consistently, beyond age 34-ish. Obviously, this isn't a science. You will get a couple of great years from catchers beyond age 34. Piazza's 2005 was decent. Elston Howard finished 3rd in the MVP voting in 1964 at age 35. But for every exception to the rule, there will be 500 35 year old catchers who get injured and cannot produce. Also notice that Howard and Piazza are both borderline Hall of Famers. Ruiz has never been close to matching either of their productions.

Well, let me put it in this perspective:
If Rollins, Byrd, Howard, PapelTard weren't on the team, I would have been fine with Utley's current contract.

Now, if we had Utleys current contract, minus the four useless clowns previously mentioned, and the team was competitive, I would be okay with the Ruiz contract knowing that year three will probably be a complete waste and year two will only be serviceable. There is a good chance Ruiz has a solid and productive 2015. On a competitive team, with a hole at catcher, that contact, while bloated, could work. Which is why I mentioned Boston being a better fit.

On the Phillies, with the way they are currently constructed? They might as well take that $26 million and flush it.

 

[Omar 382]

Well, let me put it in this perspective:
If Rollins, Byrd, Howard, PapelTard weren't on the team, I would have been fine with Utley's current contract.

Now, if we had Utleys current contract, minus the four useless clowns previously mentioned, and the team was competitive, I would be okay with the Ruiz contract knowing that year three will probably be a complete waste and year two will only be serviceable. There is a good chance Ruiz has a solid and productive 2015. On a competitive team, with a hole at catcher, that contact, while bloated, could work. Which is why I mentioned Boston being a better fit.

On the Phillies, with the way they are currently constructed? They might as well take that $26 million and flush it.

Just about. I still wouldn't want a 3 year 26 million dollar deal, but if those other contracts didn't exist, like you, I could live with it.

 

[navamind]

Baseball Reference "Most Similar by Age" much?

Yes.

 

[Caligula]

Well, let me put it in this perspective:
If Rollins, Byrd, Howard, PapelTard weren't on the team, I would have been fine with Utley's current contract.

Now, if we had Utleys current contract, minus the four useless clowns previously mentioned, and the team was competitive, I would be okay with the Ruiz contract knowing that year three will probably be a complete waste and year two will only be serviceable. There is a good chance Ruiz has a solid and productive 2015. On a competitive team, with a hole at catcher, that contact, while bloated, could work. Which is why I mentioned Boston being a better fit.

On the Phillies, with the way they are currently constructed? They might as well take that $26 million and flush it.

I'm sorry, what I meant to say was "Rah, Rah, Rah! 100 win team! Fuck yeah!"

 

[navamind]

I'm sorry, what I meant to say was "Rah, Rah, Rah! 100 win team! Fuck yeah!"

 

[jvett77]

This makes no sense. Are you suggesting that if I attended more games, I could see that Ruiz was deserving of a 26 million dollar contract? But it's true, I don't have a lot of money. Maybe you could split your social security check with me and we could see a game together and I can show you Fangraphs.com where you can read about 35 year old+ catcher's production. Or, I could just split the social security checks with Ruiz, Rollins, Howard, Utley and Byrd in about 10 years when the 2025 Phillies are 55-110 due to injuries to their aging players. But in 2026, when Byrd, Howard, and Ruiz are healthy, they will add 800 runs and 50 wins so we should resign them, right?

Ruiz is signed and you'll have to watch his success like it or not. Keep on complaining about his contract and the Phillies older players like a bitch would while they put together a fine season next year.

 

[Omar 382]

Ruiz is signed and you'll have to watch his success like it or not. Keep on complaining about his contract and the Phillies older players like a bitch would while they put together a fine season next year.

You're probably wrong, but regardless, you're still missing the point.

 

[jvett77]

You're probably wrong, but regardless, you're still missing the point.

You've never made a single point in these discussions. Any post you make longer than a few lines can be skipped because you don't say anything that anyone with a brain would support.

 

[Caligula]

I'm always more concerned when JVett agrees with my posts.

 

[jvett77]

I'm always more concerned when JVett agrees with my posts.

Occasionally, you'll catch a bout of common sense.

 

[Omar 382]

You've never made a single point in these discussions. Any post you make longer than a few lines can be skipped because you don't say anything that anyone with a brain would support.

Riiiiiiiiiiight.......

 

[Omar 382]

Worst part of Ruiz signing

Is that it sends a huge fuck you to Cameron Rupp. By the time Ruiz's contract expires, Rupp will be 28. If he gets off to a hot start in AA, we should be looking to move him. He will be 25, and a catcher with decent pop. Somebody will want him for sure. It's not like we'll be using him.

 

[Retroram52]

Bingo, Number 1!!! I am ssooooo tired of this Amaro garbage I could spit nails. Rupp would have been a great addition but no. Enough said.